Next Year Roster

[urmite]

I think Noyes is going to be a real good one for us. With his size, I could see him starting next year, especially if Goose and Grace come back. I think a starting 5 of Nelson, Goose, Burton, Noyes, and Grace makes a lot of sense when you look at the need for size and shooting. Noyes could provide both, and he has had a year to learn the system. If Burton, Goose, and Grace start, it's almost like 3 starters returning because Grace will play the exact role he has been playing. Instead of backing up Grant so well, he would just take over Grant's spot, and the bonus would be he provides more outside shooting, which was one of our main issues this past season.

Nelson replaces Gilyard. There is only one Jacob Gilyard, but Nelson is a true PG, and if he can shoot it, he will be a huge weapon for us.
That leaves Noyes replacing Nate. We will miss Nate's inside game, but, like with Grace, the bonus here could be outside shooting, which Noyes should provide.

That leaves Dji, Randolph, Crabtree, Dread, and Walz, along with any new guys. While some of these guys have potential to be starters, and, SDad75, I am looking forward to seeing a lot more of Dji, I think if Goose and Grace come back, and we have Nelson and Burton starting with them, we need size out there, so that is why I am going with Noyes. He has had a year to learn, he can shoot it, he can get up, and could play taller than his 6'7 or 6'8 height.
Of course, depending on who else we might get, my opinion could change, but right now, this is the starting 5 I like, and I am pretty excited about it. Our 3 point shooting needs to improve, so, even though we lose Jacob, we have a good chance to be a much better 3 point shooting team next year. SDad75, is Dji shooting his 500 shots a day from 3 this spring and summer? If he can knock that shot down......look out, right?

For the moment, I like that lineup Grace, Burton, Noyes, Goose, Nelson. With a heavy dose of Crab & Dji at the wing. And either of those could look even better by November.

That leaves us learning what Randolph, Dread, and Walz can do.

And 3 more to add...

 

[spiderman]

Kid can shoot it and of course jump out the gym...I think just like with some of the other guys, they hit the weight room hard get some more muscle.

we never saw much size incease with Sal and a few others in the weight program.
is Creatine talked about at all? I don't know much about it but I think it's legal and supposedly safe. or any other supplements?

 

[spider23]

Will be very interesting to see how roster plays out. It is kind of a tough spot - you have Goose coming back, or coaches pushing for it anyway. Then a bunch of 2/3's on the roster in Crab, Dji, Randolph looking for big minutes. To land that 3pt shooter, like Wright, I feel like you are going to sell them on the spot basically being their position to lose. Not owned by the new player, but basically "1st opportunity to win the slot" for lack of better term. I don't see Mooney being very good at this.

Interesting 4700 take on Noyes. You did not explicitly say playing the interior "4" position, but that is where he would slot in that line up. I know sman has mentioned him as a PF - more of a stretch 4 for sure. Just not sure he has the strength or body type for that.

I better run and check the Bryce Golden thread, maybe we will have some help

 

[spiderman]

yeah, I originally figured he's a 4. but he's certainly a perimeter offensive guy. and he needs a lot more muscle to play big forward defensively. I don't see it yet but he's got this offseason.

 

[spiderman]

Will be very interesting to see how roster plays out. It is kind of a tough spot - you have Goose coming back, or coaches pushing for it anyway. Then a bunch of 2/3's on the roster in Crab, Dji, Randolph looking for big minutes. To land that 3pt shooter, like Wright, I feel like you are going to sell them on the spot basically being their position to lose. Not owned by the new player, but basically "1st opportunity to win the slot" for lack of better term. I don't see Mooney being very good at this.

agreed. Wright had a big role on a good Princeton team. he's going to want to hear your plan for him. he has to believe he'll be an important piece. I'm not sure we can show that particularly if Goose is coming back. other schools might have a more clear opening.

 

[Eight Legger]

Transfers who can will either prioritize winning or playing a lot. The best ones will get both. But most will get one or the other. You're not just walking in the door at Duke into a guaranteed starting role unless you are a top-10 type of transfer.

I'd love to have Wright, but he averaged 15 ppg at Princeton – he is not really going to be handed a starting 2-guard spot on a guaranteed tourney team. We should have as good a shot as most at getting him. He'd have a chance to start and play 25 mpg, that would be my pitch to him.

 

[MrTbone]

we never saw much size incease with Sal and a few others in the weight program.
is Creatine talked about at all? I don't know much about it but I think it's legal and supposedly safe. or any other supplements?

At one point last year they talked about Sal's weight training and he was universally considered the strongest guy on the team pound for pound, so I don't think it's a question of strength as much as bulk. He never did get bulky, some guys can't put on weight no matter how much they try.

I am the opposite.

 

[spider23]

Haha Tbone, join the majority club . This debate always leads me to Jim Shields. That guy could eat like a horse and funnel 6 beers at a time, but never put on weight. 10 years or so after he was out of school, I saw an article on Eurobasket stating with increased weight he could be an NBA prospect. Sal's problem - will be a good one to have for him for the next 60 years of his life.

 

[SpiderK]

At one point last year they talked about Sal's weight training and he was universally considered the strongest guy on the team pound for pound, so I don't think it's a question of strength as much as bulk. He never did get bulky, some guys can't put on weight no matter how much they try.

I am the opposite.

I am sure it wasn’t a strength problem, more of a mass x acceleration problem, or lack of mass. 😊

 

[spiderman]

agreed. lower body mass is key if you have to play inside. unless you're Chet Holmgren and can just block everything.

 

[KE Spider]

Does this mean one needs big buttocks to play in the post? Damn, maybe I missed my calling.

 

[LongTimeSpiderFan]

Haha Tbone, join the majority club . This debate always leads me to Jim Shields. That guy could eat like a horse and funnel 6 beers at a time, but never put on weight. 10 years or so after he was out of school, I saw an article on Eurobasket stating with increased weight he could be an NBA prospect. Sal's problem - will be a good one to have for him for the next 60 years of his life.

I saw Jim Shield at Robin's Center a number of years ago and he put on that weight... Looked great... Very big man

 

[spider23]

I saw Jim at the NCAA game in Providence. Good dude. Think I saw he had a daughter that was a good player?

 

[UR Fan 2]

Goose is the best on ball defender we have had since Tony Dobbins. Our efforts should start with convincing him to return.

basketball-wise, I think Grace should come back. I don't think he'll find a much better basketball opportunity. but I don't know why he'd even talk about astronomy in that interview if coming back was in his thought process. maybe our late success changed his mind though. I agreed it's probably a 50% chance he returns.

Goose I just don't know. he still hasn't shown he can be a shooter. he was coming off surgery. he probably could have a really good year here and boost his stock. and I don't know if he'd be in demand for a high major in a transfer so this may be his best place to play. but the fact that we're talking to 6'5" guard transfers make me wonder what we know when our obvious needs are bigs and a backup PG. no idea if his goal is to return to play in Finland but if it is and he's got his degree, not sure I'd wait another year. heck, he could even lose time to Dji or an incoming transfer. and hopefully not but we could have a losing team. I'll handicap him at a 40% chance to return.

 

[SpiderK]

Goose is the best on ball defender we have had since Tony Dobbins. Our efforts should start with convincing him to return.

I would start with Burton, because if he doesn’t come back it doesn’t matter who else you talk to. However Goose would be my second choice to talk to.

 

[UR Fan 2]

kind of assuming Burton will return but if there is risk there, then I agree

 

[spiderman]

Does this mean one needs big buttocks to play in the post? Damn, maybe I missed my calling.

definitely helps! uh ... a friend of mine told me.

 

[urmite]

I still remember when someone commented on Drew Crank's grades and physique.

A beautiful mind...AND a big behind...

 

[spider23]

Telling you. Mike Skrocki 2.0.

This comment was in regards to Noyes. I'll admit, with lack of tv games back then, I did not see a ton of Skrocki. Looking at his stats, was not a plus shooter. I was thinking he was more of a point forward type, doing a little bit of everything but not necessarily wowing you with his hops or shooting. With Noyes, obviously have not seen him in college yet, but think of him as more of a shooter with pretty good hops.

Any reason for the comparison? Just curious b/c anyone that has seen a lot of these two would know more thatn me, but off what I THINK, they are fairly different.

 

[spiderman]

eh, pretty similar I think. both 6'6" ish and 190 lbs, good shooters and pretty athletic.

from uncontested video, Noyes does have more bounce than almost anybody. I can't call him a better shooter from a video of him shooting off the gun though. let's see him put up 1400 points first.

 

[coach fezz]

Yep, it seems his main duty is yelling at the refs from the bench.

i am glad you understand I think he does poor job on basketball players

 

[spider23]

eh, pretty similar I think. both 6'6" ish and 190 lbs, good shooters and pretty athletic.

from uncontested video, Noyes does have more bounce than almost anybody. I can't call him a better shooter from a video of him shooting off the gun though. let's see him put up 1400 points first.

I was going off these stats for Skrocki, overall pretty poor fg%, good FT shooter, OK from 3, wouldn't be considered great today. Sounded like a good passer and intangible guy. Though not sure how accurate these stats are.

Mike Skrocki College Stats | College Basketball at Sports-Reference.com

Mike Skrocki - Stats, Game Logs, Splits, and much more

www.sports-reference.com

 

[urmite]

This comment was in regards to Noyes. I'll admit, with lack of tv games back then, I did not see a ton of Skrocki. Looking at his stats, was not a plus shooter. I was thinking he was more of a point forward type, doing a little bit of everything but not necessarily wowing you with his hops or shooting. With Noyes, obviously have not seen him in college yet, but think of him as more of a shooter with pretty good hops.

Any reason for the comparison? Just curious b/c anyone that has seen a lot of these two would know more thatn me, but off what I THINK, they are fairly different.

The hops may be different, but thin 6'6" to 6'7", and Skrocki shot 82% from 15 feet whether it was at the foul line or getting is own shot along the baseline...

Which is why I changed the Apollo 440 lyrics to Stop the Skrock...

 

[fan2011]

I was going off these stats for Skrocki, overall pretty poor fg%, good FT shooter, OK from 3, wouldn't be considered great today. Sounded like a good passer and intangible guy. Though not sure how accurate these stats are.

Mike Skrocki College Stats | College Basketball at Sports-Reference.com

Mike Skrocki - Stats, Game Logs, Splits, and much more

www.sports-reference.com

What stands out to me are Skrockis rebounding numbers. Despite playing ~35 minutes a game he only averaged 3.2 rebounds his senior year, 3.6 his junior year. Strange for someone his size.

 

[urmite]

What stands out to me are Skrockis rebounding numbers. Despite playing ~35 minutes a game he only averaged 3.2 rebounds his senior year, 3.6 his junior year. Strange for someone his size.

Hard to rebound from 15 feet...

 

[ur2K]

He played more like a tall guard than a big guy.

 

[Ferrum Spider]

This comment was in regards to Noyes. I'll admit, with lack of tv games back then, I did not see a ton of Skrocki. Looking at his stats, was not a plus shooter. I was thinking he was more of a point forward type, doing a little bit of everything but not necessarily wowing you with his hops or shooting. With Noyes, obviously have not seen him in college yet, but think of him as more of a shooter with pretty good hops.

Any reason for the comparison? Just curious b/c anyone that has seen a lot of these two would know more thatn me, but off what I THINK, they are fairly different.

Can't really comment from the stats angle too much other than transitioning to Wainwrights system did not help at all with his shooting #s. His junior year which happened to be JW first which coincided with his shooting numbers. Different era as well.

Just from the limited film I have seen of Noyes just see similar games between the two, but I will admit think he is more athletic than MS.

 

[DTSpider]

Skrocki could score the ball - he was made for Mooney’s system. Would have put up huge points.

 

[72Spider]

Skrocki could score the ball - he was made for Mooney’s system. Would have put up huge points.

For sure. Just watch the highlights of the 2004 Kansas game at the Phog.

 

[Ferrum Spider]

Skrocki could score the ball - he was made for Mooney’s system. Would have put up huge points.

And the guy who recruited him as well. To JW credit he turned a lot of JB's players into really good defenders by the time he left especially Tony Dobbins.

I just had another thought since Dobbins popped in my head. I always like to imagine spiders from different eras playing with one another. A Gilyard/Dobbins backcourt would be a nightmare to bring the ball up the court against.

 

[GKiller]

I was going off these stats for Skrocki, overall pretty poor fg%, good FT shooter, OK from 3, wouldn't be considered great today. Sounded like a good passer and intangible guy. Though not sure how accurate these stats are.

Mike Skrocki College Stats | College Basketball at Sports-Reference.com

Mike Skrocki - Stats, Game Logs, Splits, and much more

www.sports-reference.com

I gotta go with sman on this one. I think you are discounting what a good player Skrocki was. Far from an intangible guy imo. Not a point forward. Not a big guy either. As ur2k said a tall guard, maybe a true wing. I was local & had season tix then so watched him a lot. He was actually pretty athletic. I can't compare to Noyes bc we haven't seen Noyes but their frames & height r similar and maybe style of play. That's about only comparison so far. I can only hope he's nearly as good as Skrocki.

Skrocki as a freshman was on that good final CAA team that just missed NCAA after being banned from tourney. Good role guy off bench but I remember Beilein staff telling me watch out Skrocki will be the man going forward and they were right.

Remember those JW teams were offensively challenged it wasn't "fluid" in Mooney terms. Now I would have thought his 3 numbers would be higher but as a team our shooting % was not very good. And Skrocki got most of the defense attention. He did have some other talent around him obv Dobbins but Bucknor Steenberge Reggie Brown but we still had to rely on Skrocki primarily on offense.

 

[KE Spider]

The words that come to mind with Skrocki are scrappy and crafty. Not the most athletic guy, but seemed always to be a pain in the butt for our opponent.

Not sure how that compares to Noyes since haven't seen him play. Same height tells us nothing.

 

[MrTbone]

What stands out to me are Skrockis rebounding numbers. Despite playing ~35 minutes a game he only averaged 3.2 rebounds his senior year, 3.6 his junior year. Strange for someone his size.

He played mostly outside the arc, put up a lot of shots, was not afraid to pull the trigger. He was surprisingly athletic but did not look it. BP probably never got above 100/70.

 

[Eight Legger]

Skrocki may have played the 3, but I always thought of him as a 2. He basically played like one.

 

[fan2011]

Gilyard averaged more rebounds per game as a senior than Skrocki.... I wasn't a fan of Richmond at the time so I don't know what his game was like, just find it interesting.

 

[CarolinaSpider]

Skrocki could be an assassin at key times. Agreed he had ice in his veins and was not scared to take the big shot.
Built like Ryan Butler with a quick first step.

 

[spider23]

PG - Dji / Nelson
SG - Goose / Randolph/Dread
SF - Burton/Crabtree
PF - Grace/Noyes
C - Quinn/ Walz

New roster update. Still like to see a shooter and athletic big added. I feel like Quinn likely rules out Stephen's but just my guess.

 

[SFspidur]

Would be hard to say no to Stephens, but I agree it looks unlikely. I'd like Walz to not have to be pressed into service significantly, but I think we can already do that with Quinn and Grace at the 5 with Grace splitting time between 4 and 5.

Still would like another big, but it's more likely to be a 4 than a pure 5 like Quinn or Stephens. Unfortunately, we don't seem to be involved with any guys like that (maybe Nweke, but haven't heard anything beyond initial contact after he portaled). I think we'll get a guard like Funk and that might be it.

 

[urmite]

I'd still like to add Stephens & Spencer...

 

[LongTimeSpiderFan]

PG - Dji / Nelson
SG - Goose / Randolph/Dread
SF - Burton/Crabtree
PF - Grace/Noyes
C - Quinn/ Walz

New roster update. Still like to see a shooter and athletic big added. I feel like Quinn likely rules out Stephen's but just my guess.

How about Noyes as SF... I like the rest