FIRE MOONEY

[MrTbone]

I know 97 is a bit tongue in cheek, but our recruiting hasn't been terrible. Some really good players have come through during his tenure. Obviously there have been some misses. I'd agree that we have taken some guys who just seem like they were totally not a10 caliber, although I suspect he's picked some who far exceeded their recruiting profile (K0?). Eliminating the big misses is tbd I suppose.

 

[fan2011]

...

2. My other wish is that CM have a better ability to make an adjustment to strategy/player personnel decisions in season when needed. Last year, it was painfully obvious that the whole offense-defense take the air out of the ball at the end of game was not working at times. If you notice, he is not really doing that this year, I wonder why.

This year, it's Marshall Wood starting and playing the freshman more minutes or at all in big games. Marshall would probably be starting on every A-10 team in the conference right now. He has that much ability. And the fact that he doesn't start for the player who is undeniably our weakest starter is just really hard to swallow.

...

Wood is a good player but his praise on here is getting really ridiculous. He plays 30 minutes, gets only 3 rebounds, 1 assist and shoots 1-6 from the field and everyone thinks the answer is to play him more? Deion in the same amount of time, coming off an injury, gets 2 steals, 4 rebounds, 1 assist, 1 block, shoots 1-1 from the field and of course everyone says we should play him less. Do you really think Wood is better than Pollard/Pierre/Cooke at Dayton? Garino or Cavanaugh at GW? Bembry or Miles at Saint Joe's? Do you really think a defense first team like VCU or URI would start a player who is such a defensive liability? I doubt Wood would start at any of the top A10 teams this year, he would probably get less playing time than he does here on any of the top 5 or 6 A10 teams this year. He is a good player, but he is very one dimensional (3 point specialist) and isn't an all-A10 caliber player this season.

 

[SpiderK]

Do you really think Wood is better than Pollard/Pierre/Cooke at Dayton? Garino or Cavanaugh at GW? Bembry or Miles at Saint Joe's? Do you really think a defense first team like VCU or URI would start a player who is such a defensive liability? I doubt Wood would start at any of the top A10 teams this year, he would probably get less playing time than he does here on any of the top 5 or 6 A10 teams this year. He is a good player, but he is very one dimensional and isn't an all-A10 caliber player this season.

I don't know about MW starting for every A-10 team but he sure as hell should be starting for this team. That is painfully obvious every time I see the stat sheets full of 0's by a certain injured starter.

 

[Eight Legger]

2011, not sure why it matters which other teams in the league Wood might start for or not start for. It matters whether he is one of THIS team's best players, and specifically if he should play more minutes than Taylor. Of course he's not going to score 25 points a game all the time, but he's also not going to allow 25 more points per game than Taylor does.

 

[fan2011]

2011, not sure why it matters which other teams in the league Wood might start for or not start for. It matters whether he is one of THIS team's best players, and specifically if he should play more minutes than Taylor. Of course he's not going to score 25 points a game all the time, but he's also not going to allow 25 more points per game than Taylor does.

I agree, it doesn't matter, and if Mooney decided to start Wood you would not hear me complain. I am frustrated from yesterday's loss and the aftermath on the board. I think the praise for Marshall Wood is getting really extreme, people on this board have somehow convinced themselves that all our problems can be solved by simply sticking him in the starting lineup. Fixing our team is not going to be that simple and seeing this sentiment repeated ad nauseam just frustrates me more and more. When someone posts something as ridiculous as saying Wood would start on every single A10 team to me it embodies how out of touch some posters are with the basketball landscape and how much perspective is lacking from many posts on this board. It really shouldn't frustrate me this much but it just gets under my skin and I feel compelled to respond.

 

[Marley13]

Stats-wise, who should start Taylor or Wood?

 

[urfan1]

has anybody ever found a board (particularly a sports message board) on which every post and every poster made perfect sense and was well thought out and well supported? If so please let me know which one it is.

 

[Eight Legger]

I agree, it doesn't matter. I am frustrated from yesterday's loss and the aftermath on the board. I think the praise for Marshall Wood is getting really extreme, people on this board have somehow convinced themselves that all our problems can be solved by simply sticking him in the starting lineup. Fixing our team is not going to be that simple and seeing this sentiment repeated ad nauseam just frustrates me more and more. When someone posts something as ridiculous as saying Wood would start on every single A10 team to me it embodies how out of touch some posters are with the basketball landscape and how much perspective is lacking from many posts on this board. It really shouldn't frustrate me this much but it just gets under my skin and I feel compelled to respond.

I certainly agree that he is not someone who would start for every A-10 team. That's definitely inaccurate. I do think that he is a valuable player for us and one who is capable, as we've seen, of producing a lot of offense and opening things up for our other key scorers.

He and Taylor both played 30 minutes yesterday and had similar lines, although obviously Wood took and missed more shots. That will happen sometimes with a shooter. They have bad nights, but they also have good nights. We don't know enough about Wood to know whether he is capable of having really good nights against really good teams consistently. He's done it against Cal and Wake, two "good" teams, but has failed to do it against St. Joe's and VCU, two other "good" teams. He played great against two lousy teams.

Personally, I just want to find out what we have in him as soon as possible, because he's only here for two years, and also because whatever else we've been doing lately hasn't really worked well enough to result in the number of wins we need.

 

[fan2011]

Stats-wise, who should start Taylor or Wood?

Here is a paraphrased quote from someone much smarter than me:

'If determining playing time / the best lineup was as easy as playing the people with the best stats, everyone in the world would be an amazing coach'

The original quote was stated much more eloquently.

 

[urfan1]

And if it were as simple as comparing stats, why play the games? Las Vegas would surely hate it, who would bet? Players win and lose games, coaches assemble the players and put them in the position to have their best chance to win.

 

[97spiderfan]

Oh 2011, I knew I could drag you back into the discussion from your stat cave. But wait, you are always 15 feet up Mooney's a** with praise and now you state fixing our team is not as simple as 1 solution. Whoa, cowboy, I thought Mooney was some coaching prodigy and now his team is so broken, you can't even suggest a fix.

So, what are your solutions to the problems. And it has to be a real tangible solution not some sabermetrical efficiency standard you drag up from the Kenpom site. .

I mean the obvious ones, like starting the guy the poured in 47 points in the past 2 games or playing more than 6 players in a game is obviously something only a mouth breathing Neanderthal would do. Please bless us with your wise expertise. I doubt we will understand it though because our brains are much to small and simple. Why just the other day, I walked and chewed gum at the same time, so maybe I will grasp a tiny portion.

And please continue to tell us how much of great shape we are in for an at large. Yep, we are right where we need to be right now.

 

[Stonewall D]

UR is a developmental basketball school. If you think it is something else, you are fooling yourself. Mooney is an excellent coach. The good guys did shoot 51.5% from the field and had 4 double figure scorers.

 

[Marley13]

A little harsh and a lot funny 97. While I'm no fan of stat heads he definitely knows his shit.

 

[SpiderRick]

Uh, why would I want to retitle this thread, The Ulla? It's a message board, I happen to enjoy the back and forth, the good ideas, the bad ideas, even FRS and the trolls. It would be equally boring if we were all hate mongers or all ra-ra guys. I enjoy the conversation. Besides, this thread has over 130 posts and 3000 views. If I was an ad agency guy I would be getting a raise.

 

[fan2011]

Oh 2011, I knew I could drag you back into the discussion from your stat cave. But wait, you are always 15 feet up Mooney's a** with praise and now you state fixing our team is not as simple as 1 solution. Whoa, cowboy, I thought Mooney was some coaching prodigy and now his team is so broken, you can't even suggest a fix.

So, what are your solutions to the problems. And it has to be a real tangible solution not some sabermetrical efficiency standard you drag up from the Kenpom site. .

I mean the obvious ones, like starting the guy the poured in 47 points in the past 2 games or playing more than 6 players in a game is obviously something only a mouth breathing Neanderthal would do. Please bless us with your wise expertise. I doubt we will understand it though because our brains are much to small and simple. Why just the other day, I walked and chewed gum at the same time, so maybe I will grasp a tiny portion.

And please continue to tell us how much of great shape we are in for an at large. Yep, we are right where we need to be right now.

I am retiring to the stat cave (aka Mooney's a**) to run some numbers. The computer will spit out the solution eventually, I'll get back to you when I have the results.

 

[Eight Legger]

This thread rules. Pin it.

 

[SpiderRick]

UR is a developmental basketball school. If you think it is something else, you are fooling yourself. Mooney is an excellent coach. The good guys did shoot 51.5% from the field and had 4 double figure scorers.

"Losing good ain't always good enough". A direct quote from my brother Mark when he came off center court at the 1981 US Open, after losing a tough hard fought match against Ivan Lendl, who was the No. 1 ranked tennis player in the world at that time. Even at age 58, lil' bro still gives 110% every time he laces up.

 

[Marley13]

OK I'll bite. Who's your brother? Sure it's been told before but I don't recall.

 

[fan2011]

I am retiring to the stat cave (aka Mooney's a**) to run some numbers. The computer will spit out the solution eventually, I'll get back to you when I have the results.

Ok, after a lot of churning the computer finally spit out the answer to life, the universe, and Richmond basketball: 42. Or at least I thought it was 42 at first, but then I looked at it in a mirror and realized it actually said 24. Play Marshall Wood.

 

[Eight Legger]

OK I'll bite. Who's your brother? Sure it's been told before but I don't recall.

Mark.

 

[Marley13]

You do realize that 42 was the answer to life by Douglas Adams in "The Life, the Universe, and Everything"? Hilarious reading. Start with "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Universe".

 

[fan2011]

You do realize that 42 was the answer to life by Douglas Adams in "The Life, the Universe, and Everything"? Hilarious reading. Start with "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Universe".

Yep, great books. Changed the post to make the reference more obvious.

 

[SpiderRick]

OK I'll bite. Who's your brother? Sure it's been told before but I don't recall.

Mark Vines. Unless you're old and a big tennis fan you probably never heard of him. He was an all-American back in the 70s at SMU and played professionally for a while until rotator cuff problems. He only won one top tier tournament, the Paris indoor, which incidentally won him $12,000, and last year had a top prize of 1.2 mil. He still plays competitively on the ITP senior tour and two years ago was ranked#1 in the world in men's 55 and over. And if you think 58 year olds can't hit, well last year Mark barely lost to a UVa kid who just happened to be NCAA champ. Thanks for asking

 

[Marley13]

I'm 52 and that name sort of sounds familiar. Played tennis (badly) growing up and my mom is a huge fan. Were you his doubles partner?

 

[KWeaver]

So, under the current "playing time" philosophy, Buckingham and Sherod won't see any meaningful time until when....2017-18 season?? 2018-19? I can't envision this strategy holding firm because there won't be anybody left next year for those 2 to sit behind (other than ShawnDre and Khwan).

Or will we see status quo and they sit behind Joe Kirby, etc because he has more seniority within the program?

Which speaks to the recruiting failures which have led us to this position, right?

In fairness, it's not Ododa dropped a bomb on us the night before the JMU game. We had many months to prepare for life without him. Do we miss his interior presence on D? Yes, we do.

I think missing Josh Jones hurts because it was unexpected and he had started to become a legit scoring option and a capable defender. I am curious how the minutes would look if he were here. Would he get some of the Trey/Deion minutes? Or would he just take a few from SDJ here and there and most of Fore's minutes?

Not just his interior presence but his FT shooting.

 

[Eight Legger]

has anybody ever found a board (particularly a sports message board) on which every post and every poster made perfect sense and was well thought out and well supported? If so please let me know which one it is.

Yes - vcuramnation.com

 

[CarolinaSpider]

Watch the common sense, it's frowned upon on this board. Tow the party line or be skewered.

K take a chill pill man! Not saying you are wrong, but you are going to develop an ulcer
at this pace!

 

[SpiderGuy]

Wood is a good player but his praise on here is getting really ridiculous. He plays 30 minutes, gets only 3 rebounds, 1 assist and shoots 1-6 from the field and everyone thinks the answer is to play him more? Deion in the same amount of time, coming off an injury, gets 2 steals, 4 rebounds, 1 assist, 1 block, shoots 1-1 from the field and of course everyone says we should play him less. Do you really think Wood is better than Pollard/Pierre/Cooke at Dayton? Garino or Cavanaugh at GW? Bembry or Miles at Saint Joe's? Do you really think a defense first team like VCU or URI would start a player who is such a defensive liability? I doubt Wood would start at any of the top A10 teams this year, he would probably get less playing time than he does here on any of the top 5 or 6 A10 teams this year. He is a good player, but he is very one dimensional (3 point specialist) and isn't an all-A10 caliber player this season.

If MW is a one dimensional player, how many dimensions in your opinion does DT bring?

 

[SpiderK]

Stats-wise, who should start Taylor or Wood?

Stats wise, anyone on this board could start ahead of Taylor. Not bragging at all but I can shoot 60% from the free throw line with no practice. Mo would get at least 4 fouls a game. No doubt Fan2011 could calculate a way to get 3 rebounds and UR Fan could swat one away for a block. I am sure we could get one of these RPI trolls to make a couple of steals. Ulla could sink 1 of 9 from 3 point range and be optimistic about it. Lastly even FatherSpider makes a point every now and then.

 

[spiderman]

I totally understand soapboxing for MW after the two big games and he may still be the best option, but the answer to our problems might not be as simple as him starting if when he plays 30 minutes against a team that actually decides to defend him he goes 1-6 with 3 boards.

he's getting a good amount of time. doesn't really matter who starts.

I understand the frustrations, and I know the outcome is what matters, but I think that was one of our best games this season. fell just short, but if we play like that every night I like our chances.

 

[spiders13]

I admittedly haven't read this entire thread, but one thing we need to keep in mind is that we lost two players that would've been valuable contributors this year. If Josh and Zo were still with the program, our rotation would actually be pretty deep and the guys wouldn't be gassed. I realize we still need to develop the young guys, but I do think losing those two hurt us much more than we initially realized. Alonzo was a great help side defender and got lots of his blocks that way, we are obviously missing that this year.

 

[SpiderRick]

I'm 52 and that name sort of sounds familiar. Played tennis (badly) growing up and my mom is a huge fan. Were you his doubles partner?

Nothing serious because I'm 8 years older than he is, but we played a few local local tournaments (had to stop because our opponents would hit everything to me lol). Now, I just play in a fun senior league with a bunch of old folks (I'm 67)

 

[97spiderfan]

To clarify, I am certainly not saying starting MW is some magic elixir and we will never lose again if he starts. What I am and I think others (and honestly when I say others, I think it is all of us, I mean when S-man and 2011 say they think he should start, you know the universe has aligned) is that Marshall Wood is a BETTER option to start than is Deion Taylor.

And I think it does matter who starts in this case. MW has played much better in his 2 starts than coming off the bench, perhaps that is what he needs to get him going. As for VCU game planning to take MW out of the game, 2 things:

1. Great: You know what the does, open up the game for Terry, SDJ, and TJ. If you have to have a defender stuck to you like glue 30 feet from the basket because you can hit those shots, that is one less defender in the lane. I don't find it surprising that we scored really well inside against VCU. TJ, Terry, and SDJ are going to score when they are not doubled team. Heck, even Trey took his man off the dribble. Defenses can pack the lane when Trey and Deion are on the court and play out on our other shooters, because they can play off Trey/Deion.

2. Name one team that has ever game planned to take Deion out of the game. That is kind of a trick question.

 

[MolivaManiac]

Wood is a good player but his praise on here is getting really ridiculous. He plays 30 minutes, gets only 3 rebounds, 1 assist and shoots 1-6 from the field and everyone thinks the answer is to play him more?

For the life of me, i cannot understand this either.

 

[SpiderGuy]

I totally understand soapboxing for MW after the two big games and he may still be the best option, but the answer to our problems might not be as simple as him starting if when he plays 30 minutes against a team that actually decides to defend him he goes 1-6 with 3 boards.

he's getting a good amount of time. doesn't really matter who starts.

I understand the frustrations, and I know the outcome is what matters, but I think that was one of our best games this season. fell just short, but if we play like that every night I like our chances.

For the life of me, i cannot understand this either.

As others have pointed out, as a starter in 2 prior games MW torched for 47 points. Do two games make a trend...no, but it's certainly a possibility that someone performs better as a starter than coming off the bench. There are a lot of psychological aspects to sports. Unfortunately in the case of MW, we probably won't get the true picture of how he consistently performs as a starter until next year because this year's lineup is set...come hell or high water.

By the way, how many games doers it take DT to light up 47 points as a starter? Second question - in two games does his defense prevent 47 points from being scored? There's your cost benefit analysis.

 

[Eight Legger]

Yeah, if Deion prevented 24 points from being scored on Saturday by himself, then it's a good thing he was in there for 30 minutes or else we would have given up 118!

 

[MrTbone]

Yeah, if Deion prevented 24 points from being scored on Saturday by himself, then it's a good thing he was in there for 30 minutes or else we would have given up 118!

I smell a math error somewhere...

 

[Eight Legger]

I smell a math error somewhere...

Half of 47 = 24, more or less. 24+94 = 118.

 

[McSpider67]

Mark Vines. Unless you're old and a big tennis fan you probably never heard of him. He was an all-American back in the 70s at SMU and played professionally for a while until rotator cuff problems. He only won one top tier tournament, the Paris indoor, which incidentally won him $12,000, and last year had a top prize of 1.2 mil. He still plays competitively on the ITP senior tour and two years ago was ranked#1 in the world in men's 55 and over. And if you think 58 year olds can't hit, well last year Mark barely lost to a UVa kid who just happened to be NCAA champ. Thanks for asking

 

[McSpider67]

I am old and a tennis fan. Mark is a terrific lefty and super person!