Where will 2023-2024 points come from

[plydogg]

I’m watching the Utah State-Boise State game and these teams are both athletic and don’t run a set offense every time down the floor. Watching them I believe our roster isn’t worse than either of these teams, but you wouldn’t know it from watching how we play the game.

It got me thinking, where are our points coming from next year? Right now my guess is Neal Quinn leads us, but we’re going to need at least one player to average double digits with Tyler gone. I don’t have any idea who will or can step up and play a role

 

[MrTbone]

Neal could put up 15ppg consistently if we fed him even with all the misses. Someone will have to be at least a decent counterpoint to score for that to happen.

 

[plydogg]

I agree T. I’m not expecting anything but I certainly see a world where Neal has 12-15 points per game (I’ll be conservative and take the lower side of that) and has 3-6 assists per game (if we had better shooting I think he could put up some serious assist numbers).

I think people are also forgetting Nelson averaged 8ppg this year. He’s been getting a lot of criticism on here, but I have faith in him. He was asked to do a lot this season and I don’t think it’s fair to judge him based on those high expectations. You don’t give your 5th grader a pre-calc test and tell him he’s dumb when he fails it. We should have set him up for success instead of setting him up for failure. I like how he looked against GW (Edit-meant Mason). He didn’t hit the shots he created but he got himself open a half dozen times and that is something we haven’t really seen out of him since OOC play. I thought his effort on defense improved tenfold as well. Let’s help him get his confidence back so he can help himself and others make plays.

 

[spider23]

I'm riding with Team jaynel.

 

[8legs1dream]

Quinn could be a monster averaging 20 and 15 next season and we would still be in deep trouble

 

[brooklyn brownstone]

Over and over this year, the best stretches of play UR had were outside the offense. Often it came from pressing and creating a wide open game, generating turnovers or poor shots by the opposition and using tempo and pace to take advantage of our athletes - because we had some great ones.

Over and over we saw that when we played without pace, tempo and just ran the offense infinitum - starts of games, ends of games - bad things happened.

Over the long term we'll be better than .500, lower expectations. Every 3 or 4 years we'll compete for a top spot.

Never change, stay the course. All is well.

 

[Eight Legger]

Why play a fun and energetic style of basketball that our players probably love when we could turn back the clock 40 years and play a style that's guaranteed to win 55% of the time?

 

[SpiderK]

Better be a transfer or 4.

 

[spiderman]

it's an interesting question.
I just don't see Neal being a high scorer, though he should consistently score 10+ every night.
could be Bigelow. the door should be open for a big opportunity. he'll have to shoot better but I could see it.
I can picture Nelson being very improved. like Ply pointed out, he scored 8 ppg in a bad year.
but I voted for the transfer/incoming guy. more irons in the fire.

 

[MrTbone]

it's an interesting question.
I just don't see Neal being a high scorer, though he should consistently score 10+ every night.
could be Bigelow. the door should be open for a big opportunity. he'll have to shoot better but I could see it.
I can picture Nelson being very improved. like Ply pointed out, he scored 8 ppg in a bad year.
but I voted for the transfer/incoming guy. more irons in the fire.

Thoughts on why Quinn can’t be high teens?

He’s a moderately athletic 7-footer. I could see with the right volume he’s there. But I also get that if he becomes the focal point of the O he could struggle.

 

[RichmondNative]

Going to bring the Noyes. Obviously it will be a big jump from rarely playing to top scorer, but I think he has it in him. Has a nice looking outside stroke and we all know he is Uber athletic for a Spider. My best guess is that we have a number of guys all close together next year with no single dominant scorer and that Noyes edges them out. Granted the question is whether he sees the floor because I think his defense may be the lacking part of his game. But as everyone points out, someone has to score.

 

[fan2011]

Thoughts on why Quinn can’t be high teens?

He’s a moderately athletic 7-footer. I could see with the right volume he’s there. But I also get that if he becomes the focal point of the O he could struggle.

I feel like Quinn is on the cusp of being very good offensively. Not sure if he can get over that hump, but he has good moves near the basket and just needs to work on finishing strong.
He is also a great passer, hard to double team him IF we have shooters for him to pass to.

 

[spiderjpo]

Quinn should have the best chance to be our biggest impact player if used correctly. He is literally a Big, BIG man and his footwork improved tremendously as the year went along. Watched Perdue today and its obvious Zach Edey is the key to their success as he is so big and strong and controls the interior on both ends of the court. Quinn could also do this to some extent in the A10 if he continues to develop. Work hard Neil and good things will happen.

 

[Not-A-Homer]

Going to bring the Noyes. Obviously it will be a big jump from rarely playing to top scorer, but I think he has it in him. Has a nice looking outside stroke and we all know he is Uber athletic for a Spider. My best guess is that we have a number of guys all close together next year with no single dominant scorer and that Noyes edges them out. Granted the question is whether he sees the floor because I think his defense may be the lacking part of his game. But as everyone points out, someone has to score.

As stated, I'm with you on the Noyes team, his scoring potential seems sky high. However, going from less than a minute per game to leading scorer is a HUGE jump, and highly unlikely.

I don't think Mooney will let him play enough. Sadly, I bet he gets about 10-minutes a game. Knowing Mooney's history and skill level, my gut tells me that Noyes inherits the quick hook. While it will be good to remove the quick hook from Bailey's neck, it won't be good for Noyes or the team. And, of course, this is EXACTLY the wrong way to manage a shooter.

If he only gets 10-minutes a game, plays tentative, worried about being in the doghouse, then he will be much less effective than he should have been. See Jason Roche's season this year as exhibit # 1.

Coaching mismanagement irritates me to no end.

 

[SpiderK]

As stated, I'm with you on the Noyes team, his scoring potential seems sky high. However, going from less than a minute per game to leading scorer is a HUGE jump, and highly unlikely.

I don't think Mooney will let him play enough. Sadly, I bet he gets about 10-minutes a game. Knowing Mooney's history and skill level, my gut tells me that Noyes inherits the quick hook. While it will be good to remove the quick hook from Bailey's neck, it won't be good for Noyes or the team. And, of course, this is EXACTLY the wrong way to manage a shooter.

If he only gets 10-minutes a game, plays tentative, worried about being in the doghouse, then he will be much less effective than he should have been. See Jason Roche's season this year as exhibit # 1.

Coaching mismanagement irritates me to no end.

Agreed, for some reason Noyes is already in Mooney’s no handshake doghouse. Wouldn’t be surprised if he transferred.

 

[spiderman]

Thoughts on why Quinn can’t be high teens?

He’s a moderately athletic 7-footer. I could see with the right volume he’s there. But I also get that if he becomes the focal point of the O he could struggle.

I don't think a 5 will ever be the focal point (shots) of our offense. Grant was a significantly better offensive player. he averaged 14. but yes, if we don't have anyone else who can score we could ask Neal for 15 shots per game and that would make him our high scorer.

 

[spiderman]

Agreed, for some reason Noyes is already in Mooney’s no handshake doghouse. Wouldn’t be surprised if he transferred.

K, you wouldn't be surprised if everyone transferred.

 

[ur2K]

I don't think a 5 will ever be the focal point (shots) of our offense. Grant was a significantly better offensive player. he averaged 14. but yes, if we don't have anyone else who can score we could ask Neal for 15 shots per game and that would make him our high scorer.

TJ Cline?

 

[spiderman]

TJ Cline?

good point. but TJ took 4 three per game. take those away for Neal.
maybe Neal scores 12-14 ppg. that actually could be enough to lead us.

 

[SpiderK]

K, you wouldn't be surprised if everyone transferred.

Not a bit, the iceberg has been hit, time to jump.

 

[8legs1dream]

Agreed, for some reason Noyes is already in Mooney’s no handshake doghouse. Wouldn’t be surprised if he transferred.

it's because he plays with intensity and athleticism which are two things Moonie looks to remove from players before giving them big minutes

 

[97spiderfan]

If we have any chance of being a "competitive team" next year, that player is not on the roster yet. If we don't go out and get a scoring stud, we are looking at a season probably worse than this years. Temper your expectations guys,

 

[Spider2020]

Voted for a transfer because that’s the only way we’ll field a decent team. I’m holding out hope we can add at least one scorer

 

[VT4700]

it's an interesting question.
I just don't see Neal being a high scorer, though he should consistently score 10+ every night.
could be Bigelow. the door should be open for a big opportunity. he'll have to shoot better but I could see it.
I can picture Nelson being very improved. like Ply pointed out, he scored 8 ppg in a bad year.
but I voted for the transfer/incoming guy. more irons in the fire.

If Tyler does not come back, I hope it is a transfer or Trevor Smith who leads us in scoring.
Quinn played better late, but I don't see more than 12 a game for him if he gets good minutes again. He averaged about 10 this year, and rarely got doubled. Most teams we play would be fine giving up a bunch of 2s and having a big be your leading scorer, but I don't think that is what we want.
I don't see how Bigs could lead us in scoring unless he improve his shooting dramatically.
I doubt Nelson gets nearly the minutes he got this year, so I don't see double figures for him.
If Roche gets more minutes, he could be 10+, but I don't see him leading us in PPG.
I don't want to put all this pressure on Smith, but if he starts from day 1, and we don't get a big scorer in the portal, why not him?

 

[VT4700]

If we have any chance of being a "competitive team" next year, that player is not on the roster yet. If we don't go out and get a scoring stud, we are looking at a season probably worse than this years. Temper your expectations guys,

You all know I am almost always optimistic, but I agree with this.

 

[SpiderGuy]

A lot of mention of a scorer via the portal. We got Roche last year via the portal and for whatever reason (underutilized, lack of plays set, or just missing shots) he didn't score the numbers of points many expected / wanted. Maybe next year we get more out of him.

I doubt we get some big scorer out of the portal this year that steps up & dumps a lot of points. We're going to have scoring issues. Big void assuming Burton doesn't return.

 

[spiderman]

I don't see how Bigs could lead us in scoring unless he improve his shooting dramatically.

agreed he needs to shoot better. and it's not like he didn't get minutes. but there should be a lot more opportunity at forward with both Grace and Burton (likely) gone.

 

[Not-A-Homer]

If Tyler does not come back, I hope it is a transfer or Trevor Smith who leads us in scoring.
Quinn played better late, but I don't see more than 12 a game for him if he gets good minutes again. He averaged about 10 this year, and rarely got doubled. Most teams we play would be fine giving up a bunch of 2s and having a big be your leading scorer, but I don't think that is what we want.
I don't see how Bigs could lead us in scoring unless he improve his shooting dramatically.
I doubt Nelson gets nearly the minutes he got this year, so I don't see double figures for him.
If Roche gets more minutes, he could be 10+, but I don't see him leading us in PPG.
I don't want to put all this pressure on Smith, but if he starts from day 1, and we don't get a big scorer in the portal, why not him?

Best thing that Spiders could do for both Quinn and Roche is to play them along side legitimate 3-point threats. It would open it up for Quinn down low, and for Roche since the defense couldn't focus on him alone.

 

[SpiderK]

If we have any chance of being a "competitive team" next year, that player is not on the roster yet. If we don't go out and get a scoring stud, we are looking at a season probably worse than this years. Temper your expectations guys,

I am so tempered that 10 wins will exceed my expectations.

 

[Eight Legger]

agreed he needs to shoot better. and it's not like he didn't get minutes. but there should be a lot more opportunity at forward with both Grace and Burton (likely) gone.

The way he could lead us in scoring is if he plays more like a 4 next year, pounds the offensive boards and scores inside and within the key. I don't expect him to do that nearly enough to lead us in scoring (though I think he is capable of it) because it would require a dramatic shift in our offensive philosophy, which we all know will not happen.

 

[spiderman]

The way he could lead us in scoring is if he plays more like a 4 next year, pounds the offensive boards and scores inside and within the key. I don't expect him to do that nearly enough to lead us in scoring (though I think he is capable of it) because it would require a dramatic shift in our offensive philosophy, which we all know will not happen.

yeah, but who then? maybe Bigelow shouldn't be the lead scorer but we don't have one.
end of the day we're still going to score 65+ ppg. someone's got to score.

 

[RichmondNative]

As stated, I'm with you on the Noyes team, his scoring potential seems sky high. However, going from less than a minute per game to leading scorer is a HUGE jump, and highly unlikely.

I don't think Mooney will let him play enough. Sadly, I bet he gets about 10-minutes a game. Knowing Mooney's history and skill level, my gut tells me that Noyes inherits the quick hook. While it will be good to remove the quick hook from Bailey's neck, it won't be good for Noyes or the team. And, of course, this is EXACTLY the wrong way to manage a shooter.

If he only gets 10-minutes a game, plays tentative, worried about being in the doghouse, then he will be much less effective than he should have been. See Jason Roche's season this year as exhibit # 1.

Coaching mismanagement irritates me to no end.

I know it is a very big jump, but there is no known returner that I think will make the jump. I also highly doubt that there is going to be a transfer that comes in to lead the team - it just isn’t something Mooney does. I’m not counting Blake as such a player because he had to sit out a year as per NCAA rules at the time and I think that such a “transition period” is what Mooney requires.

If Mooney tells Noyes that he is getting 10 minutes a game, then I don’t see him staying unless he loves something else at Richmond other than basketball. Who is getting the minutes? Obviously hard to say with certainty since there has been no official word on Bigelow”s status nor Burton’s for that matter.

 

[GKiller]

I don't want to put all this pressure on Smith, but if he starts from day 1, and we don't get a big scorer in the portal, why not him?

Well I'd say we don't really know what we have in Smith yet. It's got to be extremely rare for a freshman to come in and do that at UR. Tho not unprecedented. Geriot did but that was basically a team full of frosh, our top 4 scorers were frosh. Charles Stephens I think did too. Also idk but Trevor Smith doesn't strike me as a big scorer in hs. That said Kevin Anderson was not either and was more a game manager in HS. If he starts from Day 1 yes he'll score. But our recruiting has not been stellar for a while now so it would be an outlier.

 

[Eight Legger]

We haven't really had a better state recruit than Nelson and Sherod, and neither of them led us in scoring as freshmen. I hope Smith is good, but he's not more accomplished in high school than Nelson was. Maybe he'll have a more effective transition as a freshman, who knows. But I'm not necessarily counting on it.

 

[VT4700]

We haven't really had a better state recruit than Nelson and Sherod, and neither of them led us in scoring as freshmen. I hope Smith is good, but he's not more accomplished in high school than Nelson was. Maybe he'll have a more effective transition as a freshman, who knows. But I'm not necessarily counting on it.

Not sure what you are going by when saying we haven’t had a better state recruit than Nelson and Nick. Smith has been listed as a top 150 recruit. If you go by 247's site, he is our highest rated recruit ever, while Nick is 9th and Nelson 23rd.

247 currently has Smith 187 overall, 28th overall at PG, and 5th ranked player in the state.
Nick was 249th overall, 50th ranked shooting guard, and 20th ranked player in Va., and Nelson was 340th overall, 56th overall at PG, and 13th ranked player in the state.

Maybe he will score a lot next year or maybe he won't, but why do you think he wasn't more accomplished than Nelson? He had better offers, was ranked higher, and, if you are only talking about winning, just won a state title.

 

[SpiderTrap]

I was optimistic when this year started that we would be a better team next year, despite losing Grace, Goose, and likely Burton. My optimism was rooted in the following.
1) Nelson - I thought he would have his ups and downs this year playing like his frosh year, but I was optimistic that as the year progressed and his minutes progressed, he would get better and better and be the stud PG we need to succeed under Mooney.
2) Quinn - I thought it might take some time for Quinn to acclimate to A10 competition, but I was hopeful he would be a force down low and provide scoring and rebounding to compliment Nelson at PG.
3) Roche - I thought he would be the sharpshooter off the bench we needed to provide a spark, and thinking next year he would be a guy we could count on to knock down shots, playing off of Nelson drive and kicks. Remember Jameer Nelson and Pat Carroll at St. Joes - that kid made a living just shooting off the kick outs.
4) Role Players - I thought we had a good mix of supporting role players in Bigelow, Bailey, Randolph, Noyes, or even Walz. Guys we could count on to fill in and support our main 3 next year of Nelson, Quinn and Roche.

But after this season - my optimism has changed, based off what I saw in 33 games.

1) Nelson - he is a good player, but he simply might not be good enough. I am not giving up on him cause quite frankly - we can't. But all Mooney teams that are good have their best player at PG. And I can't remember a time when our young PG played so poorly - they had to bench him for a few games. That to me shows he might not be ready (I hope I am wrong) to be the PG Mooney needs.

2) Quinn and Roche - I was optimistic they would get better and Quinn had flashes, but they were limited. I am concerned we have seen their ceiling and it is pretty much where they are today. If that is the case, we will struggle to score, and our defense is already not very good.

3) Role players - aside from Bigelow - we didn't get much elsewhere, and we could be looking at another season where our bench gets us little to no production. Unless some frosh come in and change that narrative - I have a hard time believing at this point we have depth and production at any position.

 

[ManiBenton]

If we talking great in state guys we've gotten, we gotta talk about Demonte Buckingham. I believe after his freshman year, he was ranked a top 50 college player going into next year.

 

[Eight Legger]

Not sure what you are going by when saying we haven’t had a better state recruit than Nelson and Nick. Smith has been listed as a top 150 recruit. If you go by 247's site, he is our highest rated recruit ever, while Nick is 9th and Nelson 23rd.

247 currently has Smith 187 overall, 28th overall at PG, and 5th ranked player in the state.
Nick was 249th overall, 50th ranked shooting guard, and 20th ranked player in Va., and Nelson was 340th overall, 56th overall at PG, and 13th ranked player in the state.

Maybe he will score a lot next year or maybe he won't, but why do you think he wasn't more accomplished than Nelson? He had better offers, was ranked higher, and, if you are only talking about winning, just won a state title.

I just meant accomplished on the court in some measurable way. Nick I believe was the all-time leading scorer in state history when he graduated, and Nelson won two state titles for two different teams. I realize there are many different ways to measure players and these are just a couple. I think Smith will be very good for us, I just don’t expect him to come in and lead us in scoring as a freshman.

 

[bullfrog91]

Not sure what you are going by when saying we haven’t had a better state recruit than Nelson and Nick. Smith has been listed as a top 150 recruit. If you go by 247's site, he is our highest rated recruit ever, while Nick is 9th and Nelson 23rd.

247 currently has Smith 187 overall, 28th overall at PG, and 5th ranked player in the state.
Nick was 249th overall, 50th ranked shooting guard, and 20th ranked player in Va., and Nelson was 340th overall, 56th overall at PG, and 13th ranked player in the state.

Maybe he will score a lot next year or maybe he won't, but why do you think he wasn't more accomplished than Nelson? He had better offers, was ranked higher, and, if you are only talking about winning, just won a state title.

Where did d. buck rank?

 

[spider23]

De'Monte Buckingham, Richmond Spiders, Point Guard

De'Monte Buckingham is a 6-3, 185-pound Shooting Guard from Richmond, VA.

247sports.com

Looks like 205 Nationally 37 Shooting Guard, 15th in state