URI In Game
- Thread starter SpiderHoops32
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So the university expects passionate support from the fans and have them donate and fill seats without trying to put a quality product on the court? Sad. It's gonna be tough to care about this program if you are telling me the admin doesn't care. Maybe if very few show up to games and donations go down they might see their $1M buyout a year to be a bargain.
I've wondered the same all season. Either he made the change or people at UR told him to tone it down. I don't like it either
I was joking. But seriously he will never leave because of no real pressure. Not enough people will actually be mad enough to email Gill or make a phone call
Ha I can't do that but almost to the end. Junior year already. I am learning after rooting for this team it might not be good to put too much passion behind it if all we can hope for is a lightning stike once a decade. It's like rooting for Iona. I know Wake has sucked the last few years but at least they won't rest on mediocrity or worse.
Weird but when he was in he didn't seem slow but he must have been less than 100% for him to sit so much.
He and fore combined for 0 points - you can't win in the a10 with that production out of your guards
I'm not usually one for the hyperbole after games, but....
I think we are at Code Red for this Fordham game.
I think we are at Code Red for this Fordham game.
But Julius did...
Right after that I noticed how much Shawndre was out. And that he seemed to off when he was in.
Pistol played too. Maybe Fore was being disciplined in the first half. Who knows how this team is run anymore. No rhyme or reason to it.
That was a direct suggestion to the poster I quoted who purports to pay tuition and nothing more.
It is clear to me that we need to play KF and MW much more, and play TD and DT much less. If we are going to give up 80 ppg and a bunch of 3's anyway, I see little benefit to the supposed defensive prowess of these two players. DT and TD are seniors, they know how loyal CM is to them, and they feel zero pressure to perform at the level we need them to in order to have a decent A10 performance this season.
We need much better guard play from SDJ and KF than we got last night. Their play over the weekend vs SJU was a big reason we were in that game right until the end. As someone else said, zero offensive production from your chief guard combo is going to win you zero A10 games.
Obviously, giving PF, JP, and JJ a few meaningful minutes per game will help our starters in tight games that will go down to the last minute (I now expect a lot more tight games this season), and will help them develop as players perhaps to the point where they can be reliable resources by A10 tourney time. And why not have a squad of these guys (JJ, JP, PF, DT, TD) who come in as a group for a few minutes and press the crap out of the other team (we had such a squad back in 2008 or 2009, forgot what we called them) just to mix things up? I gave up any hope of us playing any other defense than the one we always play a couple of years ago.
As far as CM is concerned, he knows he is practically guaranteed to be here and collect his 7-figure salary until 2021 for reasons I have already stated on this board many times. He has no motivation to change ANYTHING at this point. When CM was new here, he was very emotional, got a good number of technicals called on him, etc. Evidently, he was told to tone it down, and we have rarely seen him get fired up, take off his suit jacket, etc. I get the distinct feeling that for the past couple of years, CM has just been emotionally disinvested and appears to be "mailing it in". Hard to believe we pay him almost as much as Gonzaga pays Mark Few.
I have lowered my expectations for this program significantly. My only hope is that we happen to hit the jackpot with a few of our future recruits, and capture a bit of lightning in a bottle for a season or two. I think the days of expecting our program to approach a level of success that Gonzaga, Butler, Xavier, et. al. have reached are way in the rear view mirror. What we can expect from CM from here on out are perhaps 16 to 18 wins per season, mid-table in the A10, and maybe winning one or two games in the A10 tourney. Any higher expectations than that are big-time wishful thinking.
We need much better guard play from SDJ and KF than we got last night. Their play over the weekend vs SJU was a big reason we were in that game right until the end. As someone else said, zero offensive production from your chief guard combo is going to win you zero A10 games.
Obviously, giving PF, JP, and JJ a few meaningful minutes per game will help our starters in tight games that will go down to the last minute (I now expect a lot more tight games this season), and will help them develop as players perhaps to the point where they can be reliable resources by A10 tourney time. And why not have a squad of these guys (JJ, JP, PF, DT, TD) who come in as a group for a few minutes and press the crap out of the other team (we had such a squad back in 2008 or 2009, forgot what we called them) just to mix things up? I gave up any hope of us playing any other defense than the one we always play a couple of years ago.
As far as CM is concerned, he knows he is practically guaranteed to be here and collect his 7-figure salary until 2021 for reasons I have already stated on this board many times. He has no motivation to change ANYTHING at this point. When CM was new here, he was very emotional, got a good number of technicals called on him, etc. Evidently, he was told to tone it down, and we have rarely seen him get fired up, take off his suit jacket, etc. I get the distinct feeling that for the past couple of years, CM has just been emotionally disinvested and appears to be "mailing it in". Hard to believe we pay him almost as much as Gonzaga pays Mark Few.
I have lowered my expectations for this program significantly. My only hope is that we happen to hit the jackpot with a few of our future recruits, and capture a bit of lightning in a bottle for a season or two. I think the days of expecting our program to approach a level of success that Gonzaga, Butler, Xavier, et. al. have reached are way in the rear view mirror. What we can expect from CM from here on out are perhaps 16 to 18 wins per season, mid-table in the A10, and maybe winning one or two games in the A10 tourney. Any higher expectations than that are big-time wishful thinking.
Very good post – especially the first two lines, which are spot on. It was one thing to play our alleged defensive stalwarts when we actually had a good defense. But we don't have anything close to a good defense this season, so why hamstring ourselves even more by playing 3-on-5 offensively for 25 minutes a game? It's a joke.
I'm also starting to think that it is actually our failed attempt to play "our" defense that is CAUSING many of our defensive issues. This means either the coaches cannot effectively teach the defense, the players cannot effectively learn the defense or the defense just isn't good. Or, I suppose, that every opponent we play just happens to have the shooting night of their lives when we play them. (Yeah, ok.) None of these are acceptable. So either ditch the whole defense and try something new, like a straight 2-3 zone or man to man – neither of which is foreign to any kid who has ever played basketball – or find a way to improve "our" system really quickly.
I have little faith in the latter, so at this point I feel like we have nothing to lose by trying the former. Our defense repeatedly has allowed buckets inside because of failed switches or switches that put SDJ on a big man, and it's repeatedly allowed wide open threes from all over the place because of failed switches and confusion up top.
On top of everything, this team reflects its leaders. When there is no sense of urgency and no toughness coming from the top, that's what kind of effort we see on the court. This is nothing new. The team often plays as if it's just out there to fill time, nothing more. Mooney conveys a similar message in his actions. There is something to be said for maintaining your composure and the same level-headed attitude through thick and thin, but there's also something to be said for getting guys motivated to want it more than their opponents. This is what we need at the moment, IMO. I think a good coach can do both.
With lowered expectations I can be more chilled at games. Kind of like back in the day when we never had a winning record while I was a student and the most exciting/nonexciting thing that happened was when Lefty at Davidson took the air out of the ball when there was no shot clock. That way we were usually down only 4 to 6 points while the game wound down. Now it is back to hope for the best, expect the worst, and that way you will not be disappointed. And to end on Shakespeare - We know what we are, but know not what we may be.
^^Good post, but again, CM knows that short of a stroke or a scandal, he is here for the long haul, and has ZERO reason or motivation to change ANYTHING he has been doing (despite all of our opponents knowing exactly what to expect from our team). As long as we are a .500 program, and CM stays healthy, he gets his fat paycheck, his free Benz from McGeorge, and his free suits from Franco's. Nice payoff for a single year of success.
There is no point for any of us to call for his head, it just ain't happening. Settle in for more of the same that we have seen for the past 3-4 seasons, no more, no less.
There is no point for any of us to call for his head, it just ain't happening. Settle in for more of the same that we have seen for the past 3-4 seasons, no more, no less.
Agree, Gill won't fire Mooney. But only way Mooney can turn ship is to run it aground. CM is, and has been, overmatched. Terrible hire from day 1. One run to the Sweet Sixteen, due to stars aligning, gave rise to a nightmare contract.
Problem is we've been stuck in this grey zone, where we havent completely sucked like many other A10 teams but we haven't been good enough to edge above the cutoff line for the NCAAs. I think that's what has been so frustrating. Let's look back.
2012-2013 Charlotte debacle should have been a NIT year.
2013-2014 Sitting around the NCAA bubble all year Ced goes down DWill leaves season over.
2014-2015 Poor start come on strong end up as the 1st team left out of the NCAA's, NIT
2015-2016 Expecting to be a NCAA year by many we start out strong OOC, NCAA bubble talk again hit a major slump here our starting PG gets hurt, you finish the end of the story...
It's not over yet we still have time to right the ship but it's becoming a familiar script.
Good but not quite good enough.
No the coach doesn't suck, it's just that he needs to find a way to get our team over the cutoff line THIS year.
Atleast we don't have Jim Crews that is a no brainer fire but we have too good a history, investment, facilities, and I hope standards to middle for too long below the line. We shall see what happens
2012-2013 Charlotte debacle should have been a NIT year.
2013-2014 Sitting around the NCAA bubble all year Ced goes down DWill leaves season over.
2014-2015 Poor start come on strong end up as the 1st team left out of the NCAA's, NIT
2015-2016 Expecting to be a NCAA year by many we start out strong OOC, NCAA bubble talk again hit a major slump here our starting PG gets hurt, you finish the end of the story...
It's not over yet we still have time to right the ship but it's becoming a familiar script.
Good but not quite good enough.
No the coach doesn't suck, it's just that he needs to find a way to get our team over the cutoff line THIS year.
Atleast we don't have Jim Crews that is a no brainer fire but we have too good a history, investment, facilities, and I hope standards to middle for too long below the line. We shall see what happens
Heck, he even put his arm around MW after yanking him and appeared to be coaching him.
It seems like the Spiders do just fine nearly every game. The problem is getting it done at "winning time". Having never played at the collegiate level, I have watched certain teams perform and the when the time came to win the game, they really turned it on. I was around to witness the great John Wooden-coached UCLA teams; when the time came, they ruthlessly took over the game. Why can't the Spiders do this? The talent seems to be available this year to beat most teams on our schedule. We lead most of the games we have played. But when it comes to "winning time", the Spiders fade. Is this a matter of psychology, something mental? Is it coaching strategy? Sorry, while I am do not profess to have the knowledge to properly assess this situation, it seems like there should be a solution. Unlike others on this board, I think Chris Mooney is a very good coach. He and his staff do a good job of preparing the team and making them competitive, even at the highest level (witness games against Cal. West Virginia, et c.). The problem is "winning time". And yes, I too am very frustrated as I spend 7 hours roundtrip in my car, spend numerous nights in hotels, just to attend each Spider game. I can tell you that the drive home is immensely more pleasant following a Spider win than a Spider loss. OSC
I would love to see a return of the posse. Too bad Mooney abandoned that pretty early in 2009 too
To quote Yogi Berra with "basketball" instead of "baseball"
"Basketball is ninety percent mental and the other half is physical."
I don't think any of us think there is a point to it , it is said because of frustration as fans and a real desire for the program to prosper. It will never rise up to a level of Buzz Out and the ur ad and admin have less motivation to put a high quality product on court than bcs schools, plus the fan base seems to know that ur spider fans should only expect to get so good, "we are a small school". I've only watched passionately for four years and have seen the same deficiencies since day 1 and I have seen a good coach immediately turn programs around on a large scale. Cbball is all about the coach. We have seen it with Greg Marshall Mark few Bennett Martin at usc. We have all seen it and it happens. It's just as easy to see when you know it isn't happening. I think it's a hopeful gesture out of desperation, nothing more.
At the end of the day, I think we can place a lot of the blame on recruiting failures, which can be placed at the feet of CM and the coaching staff. The biggest difference between our current team and the CM NCAA teams is what is between the player's ears and inside their chests.
We don't have anyone on this current team who would rather leave 101% of themselves on the floor rather than lose. The closest we have had recently was K0. Back in 2008-2011 we had Gonzo, Smitty, KA, and Dan Geriot. Except for KA, they were not the most talented bunch, but those guys hated to lose more than anything. Any lack of physical talent they had was more than compensated for by a desire to win.
Some of the guys we have now are probably more talented basketball players (except for KA), but no one is a real leader, no one is that guy who will not back down without a fight. I don't know what we did in the past to recruit guys with those kinds of chips on their shoulders, but we need to figure out some kind of test we can give future recruits to see what sort of competitive fire they have in their bellies.
Yeah, a lot of our problems are rooted in complacency and rigid thinking by our coaching staff, but a certain amount of the problem is that we don't have enough guys on our team who are willing to lay it all on the line to win.
We don't have anyone on this current team who would rather leave 101% of themselves on the floor rather than lose. The closest we have had recently was K0. Back in 2008-2011 we had Gonzo, Smitty, KA, and Dan Geriot. Except for KA, they were not the most talented bunch, but those guys hated to lose more than anything. Any lack of physical talent they had was more than compensated for by a desire to win.
Some of the guys we have now are probably more talented basketball players (except for KA), but no one is a real leader, no one is that guy who will not back down without a fight. I don't know what we did in the past to recruit guys with those kinds of chips on their shoulders, but we need to figure out some kind of test we can give future recruits to see what sort of competitive fire they have in their bellies.
Yeah, a lot of our problems are rooted in complacency and rigid thinking by our coaching staff, but a certain amount of the problem is that we don't have enough guys on our team who are willing to lay it all on the line to win.
Do the Texas Tech & URI games (2 of our last 3 games) qualify as "the Spiders do just fine nearly every game", or are they aberrations? I forgot to mention JMU & Florida. But in sum they are only 4 games out of how many we've played YTD?
We had Carlin Hartman as our lead recruiter, that's what. No surprise that he is now landing top-level recruits at Rice, either.
I don't have answers, but I don't see some of what some of you see. Questioning their heart/guts? We've had a lot of guys who gave it everything, but I don't think anyone gave any more than TJ gives. The guy plays to near exhaustion every game. He was awesome last night. A warrior.
Terry is an absolute stud. One of the best we've ever had. He plays hard and well every game. He was good last night too outside of a mind numbing stretch where I guess he lost focus on his footwork.
SDJ was clearly not right. I appreciate him trying, but something wasn’t right. And we can’t play with just 2 threats on the floor.
The others have limitations. I know everyone likes the unknown guys, but outside of some flashes from Khwan they don’t look ready. There’s talent there. They’re just not ready yet.
So we’re frustrated because after a solid start we’ve lost 3 in a row. Texas Tech was a disaster waiting to happen. The storm and travel problems contributed a lot, but TT is good too. Joes was a game we needed. Played pretty well but have to pull it out at home. If we win that one, URI doesn’t hurt as much. You’re going to lose some conference road games. Needed the Joes game, though.
Terry is an absolute stud. One of the best we've ever had. He plays hard and well every game. He was good last night too outside of a mind numbing stretch where I guess he lost focus on his footwork.
SDJ was clearly not right. I appreciate him trying, but something wasn’t right. And we can’t play with just 2 threats on the floor.
The others have limitations. I know everyone likes the unknown guys, but outside of some flashes from Khwan they don’t look ready. There’s talent there. They’re just not ready yet.
So we’re frustrated because after a solid start we’ve lost 3 in a row. Texas Tech was a disaster waiting to happen. The storm and travel problems contributed a lot, but TT is good too. Joes was a game we needed. Played pretty well but have to pull it out at home. If we win that one, URI doesn’t hurt as much. You’re going to lose some conference road games. Needed the Joes game, though.
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