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Transfer season

It is probably safe to surmise that Hans is our #1 target right now. I wonder if Jack (W&M) is in the mix. It would be nice to have another option and Jack, based on his stats and the obvious academics (W&M), appears to be a very worthwhile option. W&M and UR, in my experience, have very similar academic requirements.

Hans would be a huge upgrade for our front-line this coming fall, and would likely get significant playing time (and a great degree). Jack looks like he would be worth calling, and setting up a visit, but hopefully that call may not be needed. I am guessing that one of our assistants probably knows Hans very well, and hopefully that will make a difference for us.
 
nobody's getting a degree in one year. I think I'm in favor of making grad transfers sit out a year like every other transfer, eliminating the free agency going on these days. they'd then spend 2 years as the new school to play their one year of basketball and they'd actually get the grad degree they're supposedly after. if they don't want to sit, stay with the current school that you committed to 4 years ago in the 1st place.
 
spiderman said:
nobody's getting a degree in one year. I think I'm in favor of making grad transfers sit out a year like every other transfer, eliminating the free agency going on these days. they'd then spend 2 years as the new school to play their one year of basketball and they'd actually get the grad degree they're supposedly after. if they don't want to sit, stay with the current school that you committed to 4 years ago in the 1st place.
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It's possible to get a masters degree (complete the necessary course work) at a number of universities in one calendar year. At least that was so as recent as 12 years ago at two large prominent public universities in Virginia with which I am familiar. However, if the program is very demanding, it would be very difficult to also devote the time necessary to compete in a varsity sport.
 
yeah, that's my point. I don't think any basketball grad transfer is getting his grad degree in the one year he's playing. no chance.
 
spiderman said:
nobody's getting a degree in one year. I think I'm in favor of making grad transfers sit out a year like every other transfer, eliminating the free agency going on these days. they'd then spend 2 years as the new school to play their one year of basketball and they'd actually get the grad degree they're supposedly after. if they don't want to sit, stay with the current school that you committed to 4 years ago in the 1st place.
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I get your point, but I think it's more situational than a standard transfer case in many instances. I generally fall to the side of the player. If they've lived up to their four-year commitment somewhere and have an interest/opportunity to go somewhere else to a final year of eligibility, then so be it. There are clearly going to be some opportunists, but I think for most guys it's about finding an opportunity to either play when you weren't getting time, or to play somewhere you have a legitimate chance to make the tournament or otherwise showcase your talent. Those feel like reasonable conditions for a player to move.
 
Since it is the "off-season," why not speculate about things like eligibility rules and the like? We still have quite a few weeks until Summer B session, and the arrival of our incoming "large" class.
A change in the one-year grad transfer rule could have multiple benefits, but I do not see it happening. For example, it could make grad transfers a bit less attractive to "one-and-done" types of programs. It might also cut back on the numbers of grad transfers, since some players will not want to wait a year to become eligible. It might also reward programs like UR's, where "longer-term" thinking may prevail, and there may be more of a value attached to helping the student athlete to obtain a valuable graduate degree. The 34% figure, cited above, is just "scary," and suggest that this is more about wining basketball games than about earning the graduate degree. However, the extra year would require that the grad transfers remain academically eligible for two years, which may be a tall order for many transfers. The change, if it ever happens, would likely benefit "serious" student athletes like Hans and possibly UR, but it is "pie-in-the sky" right now. For now, the priority seems to be on getting the players in the door, not out with a marketable graduate degree.
 
I like the grad transfer thing just as it is. I don't really care if 0% of them get their grad degrees, honestly. Kids leave college after a year and go pro – and they mostly only take classes for a semester. If a kid has actually earned his college degree and has eligibility left, more power to him if he wants to go somewhere and take a couple grad courses in home brewing (which BTW we should more prominently market on behalf of our basketball program. :D)

I like the fact that they can be eligible right away, too. Candidly, we just need to get better at playing this game – whether it's on Admissions (as it seems to be lately) or the coaching staff.
 
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The key thing is the coach needs to be on the front of the curve on these types of changes to transfer rules. The guy who loses is the guy who watches and waits, the early adopters are the one's that prosper. Of course with our admissions we seem to work in a different world than much of our competition.
 
I don't think making a grad transfer sit a year is punitive. it's certainly not if he's looking to get a post grad degree paid for. and I usually side with the student over the school, but I think the current rules are really tough on the university. a grad with a year left may stay or may leave. you don't know until it's way too late to do much about that spot. I don't get why it's treated so differently than regular transfers.
 
spiderman said:
I don't think making a grad transfer sit a year is punitive. it's certainly not if he's looking to get a post grad degree paid for. and I usually side with the student over the school, but I think the current rules are really tough on the university. a grad with a year left may stay or may leave. you don't know until it's way too late to do much about that spot. I don't get why it's treated so differently than regular transfers.
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I think it's treated differently because the student athlete has typically fulfilled their commitment to the university. It's absolutely punitive to the athlete to ask them to sit for a year, that's roughly akin to me graduating college and going to an employer or grad school and then instructing me that I have to hang out for a year not contributing in one major aspect of my skill set.
 
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Seriously, we need to keep the doors open, that is some very healthy competition and we would will be lucky to land Hans. Maybe we are exploring other options but if we are, you would think there would be media reports of said options.
 
Gotta think that Brase will be looking most closely at us (playing time and potential post season opportunity) and GT (ACC exposure and team that is on the upswing). Georgetown is a program that seems to be bottoming out, and not sure what will happen with Ewing at the helm, could be a frustrating experience. Nebraska nothing to write home about. Iowa State made the NCAA's last year, but they seem to be pretty loaded with underclassmen who are bigs, might be tough to get playing time.
 
MrTbone said:
I think it's treated differently because the student athlete has typically fulfilled their commitment to the university. It's absolutely punitive to the athlete to ask them to sit for a year, that's roughly akin to me graduating college and going to an employer or grad school and then instructing me that I have to hang out for a year not contributing in one major aspect of my skill set.
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the university fulfilled its commitment giving the student athlete 4 years of education ($250k here these days). they got back 3 years of basketball, presumably preserving that 4th year in the best interest of the athlete. to leave with basically no notice is pretty punitive to the school.

I don't see your example as being comparable at all unless you see every transfer year the same. you're a full time student getting an education while working on your game, just like if you left after your sophomore year. this free agency thing makes little sense to me in the college world.
 
spiderman said:
the university fulfilled its commitment giving the student athlete 4 years of education ($250k here these days). they got back 3 years of basketball, presumably preserving that 4th year in the best interest of the athlete. to leave with basically no notice is pretty punitive to the school.

I don't see your example as being comparable at all unless you see every transfer year the same. you're a full time student getting an education while working on your game, just like if you left after your sophomore year. this free agency thing makes little sense to me in the college world.
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So their redshirt year, whether medically induced or developmental, doesn't count as a year of basketball? I think that's a very lopsided view of what the student athlete does. They still do virtually all of the same stuff that other guys who sit the bench do, perhaps with the notable exception of actual practice/play time if they are injured, in which case they are instead rehabbing.

Again, I appreciate the distaste for having this feel like free agency, but I think these kids often get the short end of the stick for reasons that aren't anyone's fault. What are the main reasons a player grad transfers? My guess is reason #1 is playing time and reason #2 is opportunity to be on a winning team and make post-season play. In the case of reason #1, it's not a significant loss to the school if the player transferring wasn't going to get that much time, their contribution can be compensated by finding a different practice player. In case #2, I don't fault a guy for wanting to go someplace they think they are more likely to succeed at. Again, they've given four years to their original commitment, it doesn't feel to me like they are being underhanded, particularly since their college is not obligated to give them a 5th year scholarship.

And in the case of someone like Hans, he can't go back to Princeton and play, so it would be terribly unfair to make him sit for a year when they won't let him come back, right?
 
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yeah I guess in Han's case or when the school doesn't want you to stay then it's different. seems to me most of these grad transfer aren't leaving because they want more time, though. could be wrong. just seems they leave the school that invested all this time in them for the brighter lights. like ANO. not like he wan't going to play a lot, and not like we didn't have a chance to be good. but when you're a free agent, everyone comes sniffing around.
 
spiderman said:
yeah I guess in Han's case or when the school doesn't want you to stay then it's different. seems to me most of these grad transfer aren't leaving because they want more time, though. could be wrong. just seems they leave the school that invested all this time in them for the brighter lights. like ANO. not like he wan't going to play a lot, and not like we didn't have a chance to be good. but when you're a free agent, everyone comes sniffing around.
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I think that happens, and yes, that stinks. At the same time, I'm not so sure that someone like ANO was going to play a ton. He was definitely taking a backseat to TJC. I find myself in the untenable position often of defending ANO, but I think he found himself in a spot where he didn't have much upside at UR and figured he had more upside and interest from a P5 school. Sucks we lost him, no doubt. To me, that's a fail on the part of CM to convince him of his value here and show him he is going to play. If he's not going to do that, I don't fault the player for heading elsewhere.

But yes, it does suck for the team losing the player, particularly if they were counting on them. I'd be very curious to know what percentage of the time that's the case, my guess is it's relatively low.
 
I always like being the 1st listed. not sure how often #1 is the final destination, but I know I'd list the leader 1st if I had one.
 
urmite said:
That is not Alphabetical. I wonder if it is Chronological. Or another meaning or no meaning to the order...
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I would think the Princeton connection to Mooney is a plus as is TJ's experience as a big man in this offense. It would not be difficult for Brase to see how he would be used and the opportunities the offense creates. Academics should work for us as well if that is an issue which is probably questionable. On the negative side is that we are the only mid-major in this group. If he wants a P-6 experience then we're in trouble. If he wants to play on a team that should be pretty good in a system that will highlight his strengths and give him plenty of opportunities then we stand out I think. I believe we are legitimately in this.
 
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spiderman said:
yeah I guess in Han's case or when the school doesn't want you to stay then it's different. seems to me most of these grad transfer aren't leaving because they want more time, though. could be wrong. just seems they leave the school that invested all this time in them for the brighter lights. like ANO. not like he wan't going to play a lot, and not like we didn't have a chance to be good. but when you're a free agent, everyone comes sniffing around.
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I think almost all grad transfers leave because they want more playing time. That's reason # 1. Reason #1A, somewhat tangentially, would be to play on a bigger stage. But if you are moving upward to a bigger stage, you usually are good enough to play a lot anyway. ANO was a rare one who moved "up" but played significantly less. However, when he made the move, I think he assumed he would play similar minutes and do so on a bigger stage than he would have here, thereby helping his pro status.

Instead, they brought in two other guys who played the same position and he ended up being behind both of them.
 
Last year Kansas signed center Evan Maxwell from Liberty, who had to sit a year and then had two years of eligibility remaining. But he left Kansas in December, and I haven't heard whether he is planning to continue playing ball or not. I was very interested in him last year for us. Scanning Google, I can't find anything about what he has decided to do moving forward.
 
Hans could make a difference on our front-line and could earn some significant minutes. He could also earn a great Master's degree at UR, possibly in Human Resources Management. Here's hoping that our Princeton connections (CM and one of our more recent assistants) will make a positive difference too. Hans could make the difference between an NIT bid and a strong NCAA showing.
 
MrTbone said:
I think that happens, and yes, that stinks. At the same time, I'm not so sure that someone like ANO was going to play a ton. He was definitely taking a backseat to TJC. I find myself in the untenable position often of defending ANO, but I think he found himself in a spot where he didn't have much upside at UR and figured he had more upside and interest from a P5 school. Sucks we lost him, no doubt. To me, that's a fail on the part of CM to convince him of his value here and show him he is going to play. If he's not going to do that, I don't fault the player for heading elsewhere.

But yes, it does suck for the team losing the player, particularly if they were counting on them. I'd be very curious to know what percentage of the time that's the case, my guess is it's relatively low.
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ANO was always an underachiever, and proved that it wasn't all Mooney's fault by playing very little and poorly at Pittsburgh.

Hopefully Hans wants to play a lot and be a mentor to some youngsters. We will see soon.
 
SpiderK said:
ANO was always an underachiever, and proved that it wasn't all Mooney's fault by playing very little and poorly at Pittsburgh.

Hopefully Hans wants to play a lot and be a mentor to some youngsters. We will see soon.
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ANO was soft and an underachiever just like the other 3 guys that were supposed to propel us to new heights. I'll take the guys we have now all day long. Those others set our program back. If Mooney is guilty of anything the last 4 years or so it's banking on those guys to step up.
 
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Kansas doesn't need grad transfers. Weird that they are taking them. When you have your pick of NBA one and dones, strange that Kansas would be picking up a 5th year senior.
 
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they're forced to fill roster spots very late sometimes. I assume all the top kids in the 2017 class signed a long time ago.
 
Personally, I think you guys land Hans. He's a perfect fit and I'm sure he sees that
 
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