Coaching incompetence

[urmite]

Update of earlier post on history of series by Coach:

Slone (74-78) 43-63, 5-3 62.5%
Goetz (78-81) 38-44, 1-6 14.3%
Tarrant (81-93) 239-126, 9-15 37.5%
Dooley (93-97) 43-69, 1-6 14.3%
Beilein (97-02) 100-53, 7-3 70%
Wainwright (02-05) 50-41, 1-2 33.4%
Mooney (05-present) 358-287, 9-27 25%

Overall 1/29/76 to 2/25/25 33-62, 34.7%

Of course, which opposing coaches they faced might affect the outcomes as well.
Tarrant might be much better if there was no Barnett.
Beilein would still be good but probably less with different coaches.
And who knows Mooney might have an acceptable level if he faced Smith every year…

 

[spiderstudent17]

Kevin Keatts isn’t returning after leading NC state to ACC title and final four last year. I get that Keatts got let go, but this shows that coaches can be let go despite having a good year before. Honestly surprised they would fire him so quickly after the final four run. While I don’t think Mooney gets fired, I do think there’s a non-zero chance he retires the next 1-3 years.

 

[SpiderGuy]

Kevin Keatts isn’t returning after leading NC state to ACC title and final four last year. I get that Keatts got let go, but this shows that coaches can be let go despite having a good year before. Honestly surprised they would fire him so quickly after the final four run. While I don’t think Mooney gets fired, I do think there’s a non-zero chance he retires the next 1-3 years.

View embedded media

View embedded media

You “don’t think Mooney gets fired”. C’mon. There is 0 pct probability Mooney would get fired. Our “leaders” are ready to move on to next year - same results as this year or better; it doesn’t matter to them. Their actions speak loudly. Teams like NC State evidently truly value performance of what did you do for me this year. Not sure I agree with letting a one year ago final four coach go, but it shows they are serious about performance unless there are other internally unreported issues.

 

[Eight Legger]

Wild to fire him less than a year after a Final Four, but they obviously wanted to do it last year and then they caught fire randomly for a few weeks. Sound familiar?

I'd hire Keatts here in a heartbeat. And now he's available with NC State paying him $7M. Hmmmm...

He was great at UNCW, maybe a bit over his head at times at NC State. This would be a perfect level for him to really thrive.

 

[spiderstudent17]

You “don’t think Mooney gets fired”. C’mon. There is 0 pct probability Mooney would get fired. Our “leaders” are ready to move on to next year - same results as this year or better; it doesn’t matter to them. Their actions speak loudly. Teams like NC State evidently truly value performance of what did you do for me this year. Not sure I agree with letting a one year ago final four coach go, but it shows they are serious about performance unless there are other internally unreported issues.

“Don’t think” is my nice way of saying, won’t happen. I’ve mentioned before that my thoughts are UR won’t fire Mooney even if they want to let him go at whatever point. Out of respect, it’ll be worded as a mutual decision to part ways or saying Mooney is leaving on his terms/retiring.

I floated the idea that Mooney retires from head coaching and gets some sort of advisory role with the department as a win-win kind of situation for all parties. Doubt it happens, but something worth considering. Mooney has the same mentality - although far different results - as Jay Wright and Tony Bennett, which is a more traditional view of the student-athlete. Even with Dave Clawson for Wake football who all retired the past couple years. Mooney can say all he wants that he wants 4-5 year players, but that is no longer the reality in today’s college basketball era. So trying to do that is like forcing a square peg in a round hole. Either Mooney needs to adapt to the new college landscape, be okay with more similar bad seasons like this one, or retire if he’s tired of this new way of operating with college basketball.

Most people here would say Mooney picks the 2nd option of cashing in his checks, not caring about the results. Maybe. But I do think he cares more than he shows with the media. It’s got to be exhausting trying to keep up with all the players coming in and out and now we can directly pay them to come here. Far different from the days of getting a Gilly and Golden who stay their whole careers or a Justin Harper who develops into a star his last 2 years or a TJ cline who has to wait a year as a transfer to learn the system before playing. So trying to keep up with all that and see results like this, you’d have to ask yourself if it’s still worth it. He has made a lot of money in his life. He can enjoy spending time with family, travel, has the personality to be a TV media analyst if he wants, or again can help more behind the scenes here as an advisory role. Something really worth thinking about. If I was in his shoes, definitely something I would consider.

 

[72Spider]

Square peg in a round hole. Kind of like Mooney having an offense that relies on great shooters yet recruiting players that can't shoot.

 

[MrTbone]

Either Mooney needs to adapt to the new college landscape, be okay with more similar bad seasons like this one, or retire if he’s tired of this new way of operating with college basketball.

He hasn’t really adapted in 20 years with perhaps the exception that he finally came around to the importance of using the portal. But even that seems to be regressing towards HS recruits.

So that really leaves the other two options you’re posing.

 

[Eight Legger]

This is arguably Mooney's worst season ever as a head coach. His first couple here were ugly but he was starting from scratch. This is his 20th season here. TWENTIETH. I can't emphasize that part enough. Everything about this season has been a total failure.

And if ever there were a season for him to say, after the OOC season, "You know what? Let's try something completely different, because what the hell do we have to lose at this point?" this was it.

What did he do instead? He changed nothing. He said publicly, in as many words, "We stink at doing the things I thought we would be really good at... So my solution is that we're going to keep trying to do them better no matter what."

We suck at shooting, so let's try to shoot better. We suck at defense, so let's try to defend better.

Instead of "We suck at shooting threes, so we're going to try to outphysical teams" or "We suck at defense and switching, so we're going to try a 1-3-1 or a 2-3, just for shits and giggles."

Nope. We got none of that. Just "stay the course, no matter what." Ok boss. Great plan. It's what all great leaders do, refuse to adapt or change, ever.

 

[Dr. Spidey]

Bring back the billboard for Mooney. I don’t think we could have a beaten a good high schol this year.

 

[spider23]

 

[Eight Legger]

Geez, he only had two 20-loss seasons...

 

[spider23]

AS I recall , he had a couple really good years with his version of Kevin Anderson.

 

[SpiderGuy]

This is arguably Mooney's worst season ever as a head coach. His first couple here were ugly but he was starting from scratch. This is his 20th season here. TWENTIETH. I can't emphasize that part enough. Everything about this season has been a total failure.

And if ever there were a season for him to say, after the OOC season, "You know what? Let's try something completely different, because what the hell do we have to lose at this point?" this was it.

What did he do instead? He changed nothing. He said publicly, in as many words, "We stink at doing the things I thought we would be really good at... So my solution is that we're going to keep trying to do them better no matter what."

We suck at shooting, so let's try to shoot better. We suck at defense, so let's try to defend better.

Instead of "We suck at shooting threes, so we're going to try to outphysical teams" or "We suck at defense and switching, so we're going to try a 1-3-1 or a 2-3, just for shits and giggles."

Nope. We got none of that. Just "stay the course, no matter what." Ok boss. Great plan. It's what all great leaders do, refuse to adapt or change, ever.

Agree. Even though we had back to back 20 loss seasons 2017 and 2018, this is the worst. Coming off a championship season prior year he’s regressed. Granted injuries didn’t help, but good teams lead by good coaches find a way. The portal was not our friend, and that’s on coach. His inflexibility is a major liability. So tired of watching the weave, shot clock violations or last second shots, lack of offensive rebounding, giving up 2nd chance points to opponents, not guarding 3 point shooters, and having short guards cover guys nearly a foot taller. All a formula for losses unless you have a top notch team.

 

[spiderman]

never a better time to play 2 bigs together against a big team who destroyed us on the boards in the first meeting and who is #1 in the league defending the 3.

 

[8legs1dream]

This is arguably Mooney's worst season ever as a head coach. His first couple here were ugly but he was starting from scratch. This is his 20th season here. TWENTIETH. I can't emphasize that part enough. Everything about this season has been a total failure.

once again I recommend the horrifying thought experiment of picturing where you were and what you were doing when Moon was originally hired here. That really helps put it in perspective.

 

[SpiderGuy]

never a better time to play 2 bigs together against a big team who destroyed us on the boards in the first meeting and who is #1 in the league defending the 3.

Did this a little this season but seemed to stop. Wondering why? GM certainly had 2 big and aggressive players. Dominant inside. No counter by CM. You are right - the right time to play 2 of our 3 bigs together.

 

[SpiderRick]

once again I recommend the horrifying thought experiment of picturing where you were and what you were doing when Moon was originally hired here. That really helps put it in perspective.

I had no grandchildren when Mooney was hired. I now have 10 and the oldest is driving and going off to college soon...

 

[GKiller]

View embedded media

I’d replace any of our assistants with him

 

[8legs1dream]

I had no grandchildren when Mooney was hired. I now have 10 and the oldest is driving and going off to college soon...

I had not yet met my wife and we have now been married 16 years and have 3 kids.

 

[spider23]

never a better time to play 2 bigs together against a big team who destroyed us on the boards in the first meeting and who is #1 in the league defending the 3.

He's not reading your posts apparently. I would drop a text to Ivan to call into the show and drop this idea. Worth a try.

 

[GKiller]

I was gonna say 99%+ but didn’t want to sound hyperbolic…

More on Spiders tourney odds. Still 0% baby. Tho technically I think they’re rounding. We gotta be at least .001.

U can get us at +30000 on Draftings. 300-1. VCU is -120.