He didn’t mean getting this recruit. He meant now that you have an assistant who was here will your recruiting look like ours did when he was here.
Tyler Burton - 2019 Richmond Commit
- Thread starter Ulla1
- Start date
Always have enjoyed this size player who gives us speed, athleticism and
position versatility. Looks like he can jump out of the gym and has high release point
on shot like Johnny Newman.
position versatility. Looks like he can jump out of the gym and has high release point
on shot like Johnny Newman.
Our recruiting seems to be improving over the past few years??? Do you even follow what other A-10 teams are doing recruiting wise?
Let me summarize our last 3 years of recruits
2017:
Gilyard: A-10 level starter
Schneider: Redshirt, no one is talking about him being a contributer, 3 other lesser offers (plus family connection at Texas Tech). Look at Mooney track record with redshirts, it isn't good.
Verbinskis: Redshirt: Two other small mid-major offers besides us
AJ Ford: Two other small mid-major offers, transferred to D-2/Juco program
Cayo: Projects as a bench player in a good A-10 team.
2018:
Sal: Seton Hall, Minnesota offers, among many other. This should be the norm for the type of player that we are recruiting, instead it is the exception.
Francis: Quality transfer from Wagner, should be a starter after sitting out this year. Him and Gilyard present a very small backcourt with lots of defensive challenges though.
Wojcik: Decommitted from Siena, who was his only offer. Could be a good player, doesn't have star potential
Gustavson: We were his only offer and he signed in late spring.
Grace: One other offer, IUPUI. For a player who is 6'9, this should scream red flag, see AJ Ford, Kovien Dominaus
2019:
Burton: Only open scholarship, seems like a good get but again no biggies were sniffing around, URI and St. Bonnies offered but they also seemed to had other priorities at this position.
The 2017 and 2018 classes could go down as Mooney's worst classes. One player out of 10 had legit BCS offers. Most of them didn't even have A-10 offers. Gilyard and Francis might be the only guys out of those two classes who turns out to be an upper echelon A-10 players and they are both under 6 feet tall.. Sal has potential but needs major body work. The other players were either redshirted on a 12 win team or for the 2018 guys were very late signees that not many other schools were interested in.
Please go look at what Dayton, Rhody, St. Louis, and VCU has done with these last 3 classes and then compare them to what Mooney has done. There is a VAST difference in level of talent being brought in.
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man, you're always glass totally empty, 97.
can we see what these guys look like this year before writing them off?
also, you didn't include Cayo or Blake Francis. I know Francis didn't carry the offer list you require to prove talent, but many people think very highly of him.
can we see what these guys look like this year before writing them off?
also, you didn't include Cayo or Blake Francis. I know Francis didn't carry the offer list you require to prove talent, but many people think very highly of him.
My bad on forgetting Cayo. I didn't add Francis as he was a transfer. Francis is a difference maker, Cayo looks to be a role player at best. I'll amend my chart.
Ulla, I know the ladies must love you, because every girl is a 10 in your book.
It's been a long time since my single days, but at last call they were all Kate Upton.
agreed Nathan is a role player, even if that role is starter. all of our best teams had great role players. we have 3 go-to guys. 5 go-to guys doesn't seem to work. need some guys who do the dirty work.
I think you sell Gilyard short. "A-10 level starter" doesn't begin to describe a PG who'll likely put up 1800+ points. I think he'll go down as one of the PG greats here.
I think you sell Gilyard short. "A-10 level starter" doesn't begin to describe a PG who'll likely put up 1800+ points. I think he'll go down as one of the PG greats here.
Wasn't trying to sell Gilyard short. A-10 level starter was a descriptor. To field a really high level team, you need to recruit 2-3 players per class who are A-10 level starters. Mooney at most gets one A-10 level starter per year. Sal might be that guy this year, but I have concerns about his frame right now and how that translates to college ball.
As for Gilyard, I like the kid a lot. He will put up a lot of points, assists for us. Feel his upside is that of a poor man's Kendall Anthony, which isn't bad at all. Offensively, you couldn't stop Kendall Anthony, but defensively he was often a liability. Same with Gilyard, except Gilyard has a much slighter frame than Kendall.
In the Mooney era though here is how I would rank his PG's.
1. KA
2. Ced
3. Kendall
4. SDJ
5. Gilyard
I'll say many unkind things about Mooney but one thing I won't say his ability to recruit and develop the PG position. He is excellent at that. Gilyard still comes in towards the bottom because of his size and really that is it the only reason why. I think he might be better at the end than SDJ, but I think the bar is set for him to go no higher than the 3 above. Those 3 are all time greats in my book, so again coming in 4th isn't a diss
in general, I think people always remember a guy's senior year, i.e. "the best of", when thinking back to a player. you're comparing "best of" Ced, Kendall and SDJ to freshman year Gilyard.
I'm projecting a bit, but I think Jacob finishes 2nd on the list. knowing it's sacrilege, I won't predict any higher. Jacob's also the 1st one since KA to play PG as a freshman.
time will tell. love them all.
I'm projecting a bit, but I think Jacob finishes 2nd on the list. knowing it's sacrilege, I won't predict any higher. Jacob's also the 1st one since KA to play PG as a freshman.
time will tell. love them all.
For some inexplicable reason Mooney is Ulla’s Kate Upton.
K0 was a pretty good defender even at his size - scheme was more of an issue where he’d get caught on switches with bigger players. Think Gil can be a better all around player than SDJ in his time here - he’s shown he can be a very disruptive defender.
6th in the country in steals per game last year. Over 11 points and 4 assists with fewer than 2 turnovers playing over 36 minutes a game. Yep, I would say that is a lot better than "A-10 level starter".
97,
I think you are underselling Gilyard. It's tough to compare the stats of the players you listed, specifically Kendall, Cedric, and SDJ because there careers overlapped and none of them really started their FR year like KA and Gilyard. There are also differences in the quality of the team/roster, which I think KA and Gilyard benefited from in their FR years. I also understand that stats don't measure everything but it is something we should still look at.
Ced was a FR when KA was a SR. But even his SO year stats on a 16-16 team were not as good as Gilyard's FR year. Kendall was a FR when Ced was a SO and played more OG than PG. But both his FR and SO stats are on par or worse than Gilyard's FR year. That SO year team was better than the FR year team but not great by any stretch. For SDJ comparing FR years is too tough because that team had Ced as a SR and Kendall as a JR. But if you look at his SO year it was pretty well below what Gilyard did in every category. Most of these guys didn't take off until there JR years. We have to remember that Gilyard was only a FR last season.
Where I think the comparison is more reasonable is KA vs Gilyard as FR. Neither team was very good. KA's team probably had more veteran leadership but both teams needed a PG and both players stepped in as FR and started. Take a look below and tell me who had a better year?
G GS MP FG FGA FG% 2P 2PA 2P% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS
31 23 34.8 3.6 9.4 0.385 2.5 5.9 0.434 1.1 3.5 0.303 2.4 3.0 0.815 0.9 1.8 2.7 3.0 1.8 0.2 2.2 2.2 10.7
32 32 36.4 3.9 8.7 0.452 2.1 4.0 0.531 1.8 4.7 0.384 1.8 2.1 0.836 0.5 1.7 2.2 4.1 2.8 0.0 1.7 1.8 11.4
The bottom player is Gilyard with just about every stat better than KA. not saying he is as good just saying you are probably selling Gilyard short because your comparing your memory of their 4 year careers to Gilyard as a FR. Not any one of the other 4 players averaged as many Assists or Steals in any of their 4 seasons as Gilyard averaged as a FR.
In terms of recruiting, your thoughts while a bit too negative (we have to see how things pan out first) have a lot of merit. IMO, we should expect to be able to bring in 1 stud (for the A10), 1 future starter, and 1 solid roll-player every year. I think Gilyard can fit that mold for 1 stud. But I don't necessarily see that in other years, at least not yet. Maybe Sal can be that player for the current FR year and maybe Burton can be for next years class. But they likely fit the mold of future starter.
Another issue I see is Mooney reaching on guys (97 gave plenty of examples). I think we can be better off not filling out all scholarships and using them to balance the future recruiting classes and holding for transfers. The constant movement and having FR/SO transfer out to lower level schools is not helping us.
Instead of what I described above, I think Mooney has been landing a future starter (occasional stud), a solid roll-player, and a bunch of reaches in every class. That isn't going to cut it at this level.
I think you are underselling Gilyard. It's tough to compare the stats of the players you listed, specifically Kendall, Cedric, and SDJ because there careers overlapped and none of them really started their FR year like KA and Gilyard. There are also differences in the quality of the team/roster, which I think KA and Gilyard benefited from in their FR years. I also understand that stats don't measure everything but it is something we should still look at.
Ced was a FR when KA was a SR. But even his SO year stats on a 16-16 team were not as good as Gilyard's FR year. Kendall was a FR when Ced was a SO and played more OG than PG. But both his FR and SO stats are on par or worse than Gilyard's FR year. That SO year team was better than the FR year team but not great by any stretch. For SDJ comparing FR years is too tough because that team had Ced as a SR and Kendall as a JR. But if you look at his SO year it was pretty well below what Gilyard did in every category. Most of these guys didn't take off until there JR years. We have to remember that Gilyard was only a FR last season.
Where I think the comparison is more reasonable is KA vs Gilyard as FR. Neither team was very good. KA's team probably had more veteran leadership but both teams needed a PG and both players stepped in as FR and started. Take a look below and tell me who had a better year?
G GS MP FG FGA FG% 2P 2PA 2P% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS
31 23 34.8 3.6 9.4 0.385 2.5 5.9 0.434 1.1 3.5 0.303 2.4 3.0 0.815 0.9 1.8 2.7 3.0 1.8 0.2 2.2 2.2 10.7
32 32 36.4 3.9 8.7 0.452 2.1 4.0 0.531 1.8 4.7 0.384 1.8 2.1 0.836 0.5 1.7 2.2 4.1 2.8 0.0 1.7 1.8 11.4
The bottom player is Gilyard with just about every stat better than KA. not saying he is as good just saying you are probably selling Gilyard short because your comparing your memory of their 4 year careers to Gilyard as a FR. Not any one of the other 4 players averaged as many Assists or Steals in any of their 4 seasons as Gilyard averaged as a FR.
In terms of recruiting, your thoughts while a bit too negative (we have to see how things pan out first) have a lot of merit. IMO, we should expect to be able to bring in 1 stud (for the A10), 1 future starter, and 1 solid roll-player every year. I think Gilyard can fit that mold for 1 stud. But I don't necessarily see that in other years, at least not yet. Maybe Sal can be that player for the current FR year and maybe Burton can be for next years class. But they likely fit the mold of future starter.
Another issue I see is Mooney reaching on guys (97 gave plenty of examples). I think we can be better off not filling out all scholarships and using them to balance the future recruiting classes and holding for transfers. The constant movement and having FR/SO transfer out to lower level schools is not helping us.
Instead of what I described above, I think Mooney has been landing a future starter (occasional stud), a solid roll-player, and a bunch of reaches in every class. That isn't going to cut it at this level.
we have a stud junior, and two stud sophomores ... maybe a 3rd in Francis next year. and a freshman who had some big offers. and we just landed a good one to fill the only current opening in the 2019 class.
I assume the balance of the roster is somewhere north of what 97 thinks of them and somewhere south of what Ulla and I think of them. if there's a few good pieces in there, we will be better than most expect.
I assume the balance of the roster is somewhere north of what 97 thinks of them and somewhere south of what Ulla and I think of them. if there's a few good pieces in there, we will be better than most expect.
Vol, I may indeed be underselling Gilyard. He is a player and I'm not saying he isn't. I like him as a player. I like how he has already shown he can be clutch (which is something SDJ never had). It's just his height and stature really concern me. Yes, he is going to be put up some great offensive stats but I think on defense he is going to be a liability. KA and Ced both were pretty good defensive players (KA was outstanding). Gilyard excels at steals, much as K-Zero excelled at taking charges, but a good offense coach will find lots to exploit the size differential, particularly with our match-up zone defense Mooney likes to use. Just switch, Gilyard on a taller wing player who can shoot and you have your mismatch.
Jacob is not a liability on defense. Just the opposite. I think he is weapon we have who prevents points on the defensive end and leads to points for us after his steals on the offensive end. Every offense tries to take advantage of possible mismatches, but if Jacob ends up on a taller wing player, how is that any different from a 6'1 or 6'2 guy ending up on a taller wing player?
The game has changed. There are guys 6'7 and taller all over college basketball who can shoot. More often than not, there will be a shorter player on them if the offensive rotation and screens are done correctly. No reason at all for us to be concerned just because our PG is under 6'0.
The game has changed. There are guys 6'7 and taller all over college basketball who can shoot. More often than not, there will be a shorter player on them if the offensive rotation and screens are done correctly. No reason at all for us to be concerned just because our PG is under 6'0.
Mooney apparently can't coach anything else. He's an inexperienced tenured coach. I cringed writing that.
Stork, Mooney's mysterious "match up zone" the he was so secretive about was figured out for a few years without any adjustments. Classic Mooney. Love Gilly's game, and Francis looks like a player next year. But it is always next year. I do worry about the defensive end with a 1-2-3 of Gilyard, Francis, Sherod. All very good offensive players, but will need to see on the defensive end how they mesh and can cover.
As stated from the beginning, it is apparent that Gilyard is a terrific individual player who will join the small guard legends of Mooney's tenure.
Mooney has had "some" terrific players at each position thru the years. Some years not enough good players, but also some years were better coaching should have led his blend of talent to the NCAA tournament.
That leads to the REAL problem. Mooney is a very mediocre coach. If one wants to rehash the justifications to prove this beyond a shadow of a doubt, you are free to re-read previous posts. The proof should be undeniable to anyone with eyes and ears! His career numbers (track record) are not someone's personal opinion, they "are what they are" for a reason.
Mooney has had "some" terrific players at each position thru the years. Some years not enough good players, but also some years were better coaching should have led his blend of talent to the NCAA tournament.
That leads to the REAL problem. Mooney is a very mediocre coach. If one wants to rehash the justifications to prove this beyond a shadow of a doubt, you are free to re-read previous posts. The proof should be undeniable to anyone with eyes and ears! His career numbers (track record) are not someone's personal opinion, they "are what they are" for a reason.
The difference between Jacob and a 6'2 guard is about 5 inches. That is huge. A 6'4 player can just shoot over Jacob, much tougher to do that against a taller player.
With a guard like Ced/Gonzo, these guys could handle the switch not just on the outside but on the inside as well because not only their heigth but their overall build. Jacob is literally the smallest/slightest guy on the court. This problem is amplified even more next year when we have Frances join him as our SG and we will have quite possibly the smallest backcourt in the country.
Again, Jacob is really going to be a great offensive weapon and point guard for us on the offensive end of the court, but we are going to have to live with some pretty glaring defensive issues on the other end of the court. And, this is the same end of the court, where our coach has really struggled the past few years. Maybe, if we get a new coach in next year who runs a different system that can better mask our short guards, but we are going to get lit up on defense just like we did the past couple of years if everything stays the same.
Because if you can't play a 23 and can't play MTM you're pretty much left with the 32...for what little it's worth. Have no players that can D and none of the options is going to turn out well.
I speak from an entire 2017 season of experience on this subject.
Hi. I'm looking for the thread about our latest commit, a 6' 6" wing from New England. Can someone please help me find it?
I wonder if this Burton has an affection for saying "No question about that".
Given that we only have one commit for 2019, and this is the one thread about him, thought I would keep this thread alive.
On page 1, Ulla posted some nice highlights for Burton (see July 28). Am hoping that someone might post a link to his high-school's website or a copy of his upcoming season schedule, so that we might follow him and see him "blow-up" in a positive way.
I think he will be a great guy to fill JJ's role once JJ graduates...
If anyone can post a link to follow Burton's box-scores for this season, or his schedule, or both, please help to keep us up-to-date.
On page 1, Ulla posted some nice highlights for Burton (see July 28). Am hoping that someone might post a link to his high-school's website or a copy of his upcoming season schedule, so that we might follow him and see him "blow-up" in a positive way.
I think he will be a great guy to fill JJ's role once JJ graduates...
If anyone can post a link to follow Burton's box-scores for this season, or his schedule, or both, please help to keep us up-to-date.
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His prep school does not seem to have a schedule up yet. I am going to try to get out to a game of his.
This is the Marianopolis Prep website, no schedule up yet. These prep schools do not seem to be very good updating these schedules. I know they typically start way before the CT high school leagues, so should be starting soon.
https://www.marianapolis.org/athletics/team-details/~athletics-team-id/21
https://www.marianapolis.org/athletics/team-details/~athletics-team-id/21
LongTime, I have just switched from Altavista to Ask Jeeves, seems to work very well. No need for Google yet.
Part of the schedule is up.
Sat, Dec 1 03:00 PM - 04:15 PM vs. Greens Farms Academy (CT)
Sun, Dec 2 05:00 PM - 05:00 PM vs. Canterbury School (CT)
Wed, Dec 5 03:30 PM - 05:00 PM vs. Williston Northampton School (MA)
Fri, Jan 11 06:00 PM - 06:00 PM vs. Hamden Hall (CT)
Wed, Jan 23 03:00 PM - 04:30 PM vs. Brooks School (MA)
Fri, Jan 25 03:00 PM - 03:00 PM @ Gunnery (CT)
Sat, Feb 9 04:30 PM - 04:30 PM @ Pingree School (MA)
Wed, Feb 20 04:00 PM - 05:15 PM @ Holderness School (NH)
Thanks 23 and spiderman. The website is now showing a November 17th game, so the HS season for our one recruit starts sooner than I expected. FYI, The website now lists 5 games between December 1 and 9, a heavy stretch, and over 20 total games. Still no roster listed, so we don't know what height he will be listed at.
P.S. I requested that links be posted here primarily so that ALL posters could easily access the information, on a single thread. If everyone individually googles to find the info, two things will happen: 1) Fewer people will actually do this, since it takes an extra effort, and 2) It will not appear here, where everyone can easily find it, and respond with updates. 23 and spiderman get it.
P.S. I requested that links be posted here primarily so that ALL posters could easily access the information, on a single thread. If everyone individually googles to find the info, two things will happen: 1) Fewer people will actually do this, since it takes an extra effort, and 2) It will not appear here, where everyone can easily find it, and respond with updates. 23 and spiderman get it.
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