#ExtendMooney

[ChoppinBroccoli]

I stand by my comments. How would knowing his salary change anything? Would you cheer less, cheer more,
complain less, complain more ? Not knowing is not going to change anything.

Again, I don't care about his specific salary as others do. (Although I do believe a seven-figure coach should be expected to make a conference championship and NCAA tournament at least once in a while). I hope he was one of the coaches Hardt referred to that did the right thing and took a pay cut. If Russ, Dan, and the AD took pay cuts but CM didn't, I think that's notable.
It would only bother me if UR started cutting other programs a la W&M. There are about a dozen "suits" in and around our basketball program - cut some of them before you screw non-revenue student-athletes.

 

[SpiderTrap]

I actually don't like the idea of coaches taking pay cuts or making donations back to the school. I think its an easy way for them to build up goodwill and it makes it that much harder to get rid of them when a tough decision about on the field or court results needs to be made. You will be caught saying - well, he is only winning at .500 - but he/she has donated $2 million back to the school - lets keep this coach another year and see what happens. I think it creates a conflict of interest.

 

[GKiller]

I actually don't like the idea of coaches taking pay cuts or making donations back to the school. I think its an easy way for them to build up goodwill and it makes it that much harder to get rid of them when a tough decision about on the field or court results needs to be made. You will be caught saying - well, he is only winning at .500 - but he/she has donated $2 million back to the school - lets keep this coach another year and see what happens. I think it creates a conflict of interest.

In the real world ppl have taken cuts or been furloughed etc & then let go or will be getting let go far too often. But I can still buy that argument.

No way w charitable contributions. First the 2 mil hypothetical from coach at UR isn’t close to reality it’s such a far out there hypothetical it’s not a consideration. I’d like to think all coaches r members of the Spider Club. Mooney has literally asked people to donate as part of UR giving Here or other Spider club initiatives. If u r going to ask ppl to donate $ to a cause then u have to be doing it yourself too. That is personal integrity 101.

 

[spiderman]

In the real world ppl have taken cuts or been furloughed etc & then let go or will be getting let go far too often.

in my real world, I've only seen people taking pay cuts when they're told they're taking a pay cut. I've never seen one taken voluntarily.

I get it that coaches make a lot of money, but I don't expect anyone to offer to take a pay cut. and I don't want to hear a school with a $2B+ endowment crying poverty. UR will be just fine economically.

 

[ur2K]

in my real world, I've only seen people taking pay cuts when they're told they're taking a pay cut. I've never seen one taken voluntarily.

I get it that coaches make a lot of money, but I don't expect anyone to offer to take a pay cut. and I don't want to hear a school with a $2B+ endowment crying poverty. UR will be just fine economically.

That's exactly how I've felt when I got that letter from our Pres a few weeks ago asking for more money.

 

[GKiller]

in my real world, I've only seen people taking pay cuts when they're told they're taking a pay cut. I've never seen one taken voluntarily.

Fair point tho I never said anything about voluntary or involuntary. Just saying orgs make business decisions regardless. And let's be honest yes hardt and some of the highest paid coaches, incl obv Mooney, are doing so "voluntarily" but certainly they were asked to do it which isn't exactly voluntary either. But again I agree on the pay cut side of things, the charitable contributions is another matter altogether.

 

[I-M-UR]

IMO, the 2019-2020 season would have ended with an appearance in the NCAA tournament. It seems to me the school is giving Coach Mooney a chance to finish what he started.

That is at best a guess, there was no certainty we get in. So if you talking about a chance to finish what he started you must be talking 10 years ago.

 

[97spiderfan]

Fair point tho I never said anything about voluntary or involuntary. Just saying orgs make business decisions regardless. And let's be honest yes hardt and some of the highest paid coaches, incl obv Mooney, are doing so "voluntarily" but certainly they were asked to do it which isn't exactly voluntary either. But again I agree on the pay cut side of things, the charitable contributions is another matter altogether.

There had to be some type of agreement about the degree of the voluntary reduction, otherwise, you have the football coach giving up 10% of his salary where the basketball coach maybe only gives up 5% of his. The other more cynical view of this is that this is just a big PR stunt to not make highly compensated sports coaches not look like complete selfish a-holes when other athletic programs are being slashed and Mooney gave back like 5K.

I'm not saying this is the case but again in the era of transparency it would be nice to hear that all head coaches gave up x% of their salary this year.

 

[spiderman]

I'm not saying this is the case but again in the era of transparency it would be nice to hear that all head coaches gave up x% of their salary this year.

I'm not sure we're in the era of transparency, nor should we be.

 

[97spiderfan]

I'm not sure we're in the era of transparency, nor should we be.

Ok, agreed. But the risk your run by not being transparent is that you hope the truth never comes to light, espicially if that truth is not all that flattering. Again, which is why you just say we've directed all our head coaches to take a x% pay reduction due to COVID. It is cut and dry.

If you make a big deal of these "voluntary pay reductions" and then say the disgruntled track and field program finds out that the million dollar basketball coach only volunteered a $1000 pay reduction and releases that information, well then you got yourself a PR problem.

 

[97spiderfan]

Ok, agreed. But the risk your run by not being transparent is that you hope the truth never comes to light, espicially if that truth is not all that flattering. Again, which is why you just say we've directed all our head coaches to take a x% pay reduction due to COVID. It is cut and dry.

If you make a big deal of these "voluntary pay reductions" and then say the disgruntled track and field program finds out that the million dollar basketball coach only volunteered a $1000 pay reduction and releases that information, well then you got yourself a PR problem.

Not saying that is not what happened here but google Oklahoma State football coaches to see the peril of a non-uniform and "voluntary" request to reduce pay.

 

[SpiderRick]

"Wait til next year"

 

[I-M-UR]

"Wait til next year"

It’s amazing how absolutely sick I am hearing that

 

[97spiderfan]

It’s amazing how absolutely sick I am hearing that

Yeah, but literally, I can't wait for next year, for pretty much everything, except Spider hoops.

 

[SFspidur]

Goodman podcast with Mooney.

 

[spider23]

Good interview, I skipped around a little but good interview. Hypes Burton again, sounds kind of like he will be a part of the starting 6 as far as minutes go and his impact.

 

[GKiller]

Good interview, I skipped around a little but good interview. Hypes Burton again, sounds kind of like he will be a part of the starting 6 as far as minutes go and his impact.

Yes good listen from Mooney. A few interesting nuggets to me...

1. goodman now has us 15 but were high as 13 - what's up Goodman
2. agree with Mooney that a Nov 10 start date was much better - gives u more dates on possible postponements. I really don't know why they didn't stick with the 10th.
3. trying to work out date on UNI, maybe Vandy game too but that was unclear, Cincy issue was AAC playing league games on the scheduled date now
4. more eagles talk, I think Moon Man is a closet eagles face painter & requires his interviewers to bring up. It's the new wedding planner talk. & still lol how Mooney was previously quick to badmouth Eagles not living up to expectations, hello pot kettle.
5. Not surprisingly Mooney admits our grad transfers were actively recruited and that it was a worry
6. Was there a fire chris mooney website? Him and Goodman discuss but I don't recall it. Billboard and Twitter...check.

 

[SFspidur]

I think the "website" being referred to is the one we're writing on right now.

 

[spiderman]

I thought it was a little strange that he didn't have conversations about the grad transfer possibility with our grad guys. it worked out. he was right. they wanted to stay. but I'd think that's a conversation I'd want to have with them.

 

[RichmondNative]

CM was definitely more relaxed and happy on this particular interview. I don’t understand the need to hype Burton so much. He doesn’t seem like a player that needs his ego stroked and although I like his skill set I think I am going to wait until his career is over to pronounce him the greatest in UR history.

 

[Eight Legger]

When Burton finally graduates, they will rename our league The Burton 10. Then he will be the first pick in the NBA draft and win 10 consecutive titles en route to the Hall of Fame. I think that much is evident.

 

[spider23]

I hope the hype does turn out to be true. Newman was before my time, but my understanding is that he was a guy you had to kick out of the gym. That is the difference between being a A10 2nd teamer and a 15 year NBA vet. Kenny Atkinson had that same gym rat factor, but not quite the size and ability as Newman. Hopefully Burton has it. If he does this year can be really special, if covid let's it.

 

[spiderman]

different ways to get the most out of a kid. some kids you have to tell them they can't do it for them to do it. others you make it known how much you believe in them so they believe too. I feel that's how CM is approaching Burton. it's there. he has the tools to be great. CM believes he will be.

he won't be the best statistically at UR. he has 137 points with 3 years left and he's not expected to start this year. but anything more than a cup of coffee in the NBA makes him our 2nd best. topping Newman is a long shot for anyone though.

 

[AnnapSpider]

I hope the hype does turn out to be true. Newman was before my time, but my understanding is that he was a guy you had to kick out of the gym. That is the difference between being a A10 2nd teamer and a 15 year NBA vet. Kenny Atkinson had that same gym rat factor, but not quite the size and ability as Newman. Hopefully Burton has it. If he does this year can be really special, if covid let's it.

I did see Johnny play. In fact it was against Wake Forest who was ranked in the top 10. We won, at Robins.
When he was on the court, you knew it. He had that special “it”!
Burton is a very good player, and everyone thinks he can be one of “those players” But he needs to push
to make sure he’s moved up one notch from being the 6th man. Unfortunately, now days, he maybe be gone to
another school before we know it.

 

[spiderman]

Unfortunately, now days, he maybe be gone to
another school before we know it.

guess it's possible but I don't see it. even if he's coming off the bench this season he'll have a pretty big role. and with 5 graduating he should be a main man next year.

have we ever lost a really good player to transfer? Khwan as a grad transfer is all that comes to mind. Buck but there were circumstances. ANO as a grad too.

 

[Eight Legger]

Unfortunately, now days, he maybe be gone to another school before we know it.

Wouldn't shock me at all if this is part of the reason Mooney is talking him up so much – to let him know how much he wants him here and to prevent him from leaving. In reality, I would think if he's still here now, that's sort of a moot point though. He'll be the focal point of the team next year and the year after, and we might be coming off a nice NCAA run, so those should be attractive to him.

If he wanted more immediate PT elsewhere, he would have transferred after last year and tried to get immediate eligibility, which the NCAA is handing out left and right.

 

[AnnapSpider]

Wouldn't shock me at all if this is part of the reason Mooney is talking him up so much – to let him know how much he wants him here and to prevent him from leaving. In reality, I would think if he's still here now, that's sort of a moot point though. He'll be the focal point of the team next year and the year after, and we might be coming off a nice NCAA run, so those should be attractive to him.

If he wanted more immediate PT elsewhere, he would have transferred after last year and tried to get immediate eligibility, which the NCAA is handing out left and right.

I’m hoping you and Spiderman are right. These are the things where I love being wrong.

 

[spider23]

Congratulations! According to this review (not sure their methodology), we have the 132 ranked coach in all of D1. Other of note on this list 57. Grant, 56. Mckillop, 93. Travis Ford, 114. Mark Schmidt. Don't have time to scroll through all the pages.

NCAA Basketball: Ranking all 357 D-I head coaches for 2020-21 season

A complete ranking of all 357 NCAA Basketball head coach from top to bottom, with analysis and explanations related to their coaching histories.

bustingbrackets.com

 

[spider23]

He will get to test his mettle vs the no. 11 (huggy bear) and no. 4 (our pal Cal) this season, so that will be interesting.

 

[SFspidur]

Hey, at least he's up 21 spots from last year...more bang for our bucks!

 

[97spiderfan]

There is always one underclassman that Mooney hypes. Some live up to the hype (Gilly/Grant), some don't (Duinker). This is par for the course for Mooney.

I like Burton, freaky athlete and max energy guy. He still has much to show me that he can be a centerpiece, right now I see a better Kevin Smith type player. K. Smith was one of my all time favorite Spiders for his highlight real dunks and big time plays, but he was at the end of the day, a really good 6th man.

Think Burton has more upside but that is what I saw from him as a freshman. Room to grow, but not ready to crown Burton as a first team all A-10 guy his Junior and Senior year quite yet. Biggest thing I need to see from him is a much more consistent jump shot, hitting open and outside shots is essential in our system. He doesn't have an ugly stroke but also needs work. Potential is there, lets just not get ahead of our selves

 

[SpiderVol]

I think comparing him to Kevin Smith, who was a solid player, might be selling Burton a little bit short. Burton's upside over Smith is his size/length, his shooting, and his defense.

Burton was a FR on a very good team last year which cut back on his mins. But when he was on the floor he made the most of it. He still put up better numbers than Smith did as a FR in far less mins (14 vs 22 MPG).

His per 40 minutes stats are some of the top #'s on the team and they get even better when you look at just conference play. He was 7th on the team in scoring per 40 mins overall but moved up to 4th in conference.

More impressive is some of the advanced metrics. He was statistically our best rebounder and possibly our best defensive player. Per 40 mins he led the team in rebounding overall and those numbers improved even more in conference play, where he was well above anyone with 12.9 per 40 mins vs 9.4 from Cayo and 9.3 from Grant. In conference play he got ~29% of all defense rebounds when he was on the floor (Grant was 22%).

His defense rating per 100 possessions was the best on the team (excluding Arizin who only played 4 mins). That stat is an estimate of points allowed per 100 possessions. His rating was only 87.0 for in conference play compared to the rest of the 8 core players who ranged from 92.6 to 99.1.

Once he got adjusted to the college game he really started to put up some impressive numbers. His one issue in his last 14-15 games was he got into foul trouble a couple of times which limited his mins.

He does need to improve his shooting and become more consistent from outside and I'm not sure how good of a passer he is going to be. But he has shown a ton of potential. We are just fortunate to have some good front court players right now.

 

[I-M-UR]

I hope the hype does turn out to be true. Newman was before my time, but my understanding is that he was a guy you had to kick out of the gym. That is the difference between being a A10 2nd teamer and a 15 year NBA vet. Kenny Atkinson had that same gym rat factor, but not quite the size and ability as Newman. Hopefully Burton has it. If he does this year can be really special, if covid let's it.

Another one was McCurdy. I never snuck in that he was in there shooting ( back in the days when the door wouldn’t lock

 

[SFspidur]

 

[urmite]

View embedded media

Cue, Eightlegger...

 

[spider23]

Ha Mite, I think you mean 97. Wondering if this a Gregg Marshal type situation as I recall an accusation last year? He seemed to have some really good teams the last couple years, and right on the cusp.

 

[9Legs]

I hope the hype does turn out to be true. Newman was before my time, but my understanding is that he was a guy you had to kick out of the gym. That is the difference between being a A10 2nd teamer and a 15 year NBA vet. Kenny Atkinson had that same gym rat factor, but not quite the size and ability as Newman. Hopefully Burton has it. If he does this year can be really special, if covid let's it.

I recall from Dick Tarrant's last radio show with Bob Black who asked

"Of all the guys you coached here at UR, who would you choose as the guy you would want with the game on the line to have the ball in his hands"- Without a second's hesitation Tarrant responded
'Atkinson' -he would just beat you"

 

[spider23]

I recall from Dick Tarrant's last radio show with Bob Black who asked

"Of all the guys you coached here at UR, who would you choose as the guy you would want with the game on the line to have the ball in his hands"- Without a second's hesitation Tarrant responded
'Atkinson' -he would just beat you"

Yes, he would run iso with Kenny at the end of the half every game. KA would deliver most often. Highly confident.

 

[urmite]

Ha Mite, I think you mean 97. Wondering if this a Gregg Marshal type situation as I recall an accusation last year? He seemed to have some really good teams the last couple years, and right on the cusp.

Penn State wins NIT Championship

Congratulations to the Nittany Lions and Pat Chambers. Our dyad of infamy now has one less thing in common.

richmond.forums.rivals.com

Mooney's contract

Not sure what to deduce from this, but in 2011, Mooney's contract paid him a base of $701,000, a bonus of $125,000 for the Sweet 16 and deferred compensation of $292,000, with a few other small amounts that brought his total pay to $1.14M. In 2012, his base pay was listed at $447,000, with...

richmond.forums.rivals.com

 

[FRS1976]

I recall from Dick Tarrant's last radio show with Bob Black who asked

"Of all the guys you coached here at UR, who would you choose as the guy you would want with the game on the line to have the ball in his hands"- Without a second's hesitation Tarrant responded
'Atkinson' -he would just beat you"

That shot Atkinson made from mid court (the horn went off as the ball was in the air!) to beat VCU in the T-D Tournament