CORONAVIRUS - What are the consequences?
- Thread starter invinoveritasinaquasanitas
- Start date
You are failing to understand the way science works. No one in the scientific or medical community GUARANTEED that anything would or wouldn't happen. What they said and wrote at the onset of this thing and have continued to update essentially is this: "Given what we know right now about this virus – which we admit is far from all there is to know – leads us to believe that the possible outcomes are [XYZ] if a majority of people do [A] or [123] if a majority of people do [C]."Yes, because the same people whose models have been laughably wrong regarding what has actually happened must be totally accurate about predicting theoretical stuff that never even happened at all.
That's it. No one said this was DEFINITELY going to kill millions of people. What they said at the time was, "If we do nothing to slow it, here is what we believe the worst-case scenario could be." We did take a number of precautions, which inherently prevented the worst-case scenario from happening, thankfully, even though what has happened is still bad. You can't now come back and say "See, millions didn't die – they were wrong! I'll never listen to them again!"
This is a new virus. Scientists didn't have all the answers initially and they don't now, either. The flu has been around forever, and we still don't have a way to eradicate it or even predict its impacts year over year. This thing has been around for 6 months, and we act like scientists should have it all figured out already or that they are for some reason making stuff up or lying to us? That's not how it works.
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I actually have a degree in science from the U of R, so I understand science perfectly fine thank you. You don't seem to understand how modeling works. If you can't design a model that accurately predicts the real world future then you certainly aren't going to be able to design a model that accurately predicts a completely hypothetical past. Garbage in, garbage out. Actual death rate is the most solid data point we have right now and the one we need to be monitoring the closest. So far, so good. All the rioting and protests could cause a short term blip in the near future, but curve seems to be effectively flattened. ICU beds and hospitalizations are equally flat.
So far so good??? And, you don't think the cases going up, which will result in more hospitalizations and more deaths, is what should be monitored the closest? Everything this clown continues to do is wrong! Everything!. He waited too long to close things, and reopened things up way too soon. Close just a week earlier, and we save over 35,000 lives. Wait just a little longer before pretending this virus is behind us, and we are likely still trending downward with the cases instead of going back up. Dumb ass is killing people every freaking day.
Guessing that graph is going to look a little different soon, since Florida just reported the most cases in a single day so far, and now they and Texas are closing up restaurants again after having just opened them. I hope I'm wrong, but we have a decent grasp at this point as to how many cases = how many hospitalizations = how many deaths.I actually have a degree in science from the U of R, so I understand science perfectly fine thank you. You don't seem to understand how modeling works. If you can't design a model that accurately predicts the real world future then you certainly aren't going to be able to design a model that accurately predicts a completely hypothetical past. Garbage in, garbage out. Actual death rate is the most solid data point we have right now and the one we need to be monitoring the closest. So far, so good. All the rioting and protests could cause a short term blip in the near future, but curve seems to be effectively flattened. ICU beds and hospitalizations are equally flat.
Light weight yes man hosts Presser today.Protecting Confederate statutes is much more important to King Dolt and his merrymen than protecting US citizens from a pandemic.Not sure what 1st Amendment rights has to do with wearing a mask in order to prevent the spread of coronavirus at one of King Dolt’s rallies.
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King Dolt’s laizze faire approach of a complete abdication of pandemic responsibility has turned us into a 2nd rate power.EU sticking it to us.
US travelers 'unlikely' to be allowed into EU as bloc reopens, diplomats say
https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/26/europe/eu-coronavirus-travel-ban-us-intl/index.html
US travelers 'unlikely' to be allowed into EU as bloc reopens, diplomats say
https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/26/europe/eu-coronavirus-travel-ban-us-intl/index.html
Palm Beach and St Lucie counties are home to well educated individuals that majored in all aspects of the sciences.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...lm-beach-coronavirus-mask-viral-a9586366.html
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...lm-beach-coronavirus-mask-viral-a9586366.html
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Pass it onto all the hillbillies and rednecks that you know that use their exquisite understanding of the 1st amendment as a crutch for not wearing one.
Agent Orange’s campaign in Tulsa orders removal of Social Distance signage only hours before rally.
Prudent and responsible Action by disciples of Dr Dolt.
Prudent and responsible Action by disciples of Dr Dolt.
If you had been paying attention to the actual data rather than the mindless media propaganda, you'd realize, no, we don't have the slightest grasp at all of how many cases = how many hospitalizations = how many deaths. Florida's cases doubled in the beginning of June. Doubled again from that ten days later. And yet the death and hospitalizations have barely moved at all.
The antibody test Wake Forrest just conducted showed 12-14% of NC population have antibodies for Covid-19, which would suggest a dramatically lower death rate than previously thought and would help explain why the dramatic uptick in "total cases" is producing so little change in ICU rates or total deaths.
https://www.wfae.org/post/wake-fore...everity-symptoms-lower-first-thought#stream/0
How about this data? Or, do you think this is just "mindless media propaganda"?
https://www.newsweek.com/arizona-ad...rus-cases-eu-reports-icus-are-89-full-1515007
Do you really not think a dramatic increase in cases will lead to an increase in hospitalizations and deaths? Wow, speaking of mindless.
https://www.newsweek.com/arizona-ad...rus-cases-eu-reports-icus-are-89-full-1515007
Do you really not think a dramatic increase in cases will lead to an increase in hospitalizations and deaths? Wow, speaking of mindless.
That you can not even conceive of a scenario where dramatic increase in cases doesn't lead to increase in hospitalizations and deaths shows just out of your depth you are in this discussion. Leave science to the scientists.
The age group with the most confirmed cases is people in their 30s. For the most part, they aren't the ones dying from it. So while the case counts skyrocket, it's mostly younger people getting the virus right now because they are the ones going out to eat and drink. Give it a couple weeks until they've checked in with grandma or mom and dad and let's see what happens then. I hope they are smart enough to stay away from their older relatives, but we know that people in general aren't that smart.
Shafer,
You are too worried about percentages. Percentages don't save lives. It's a given that the more cases we get, the more hospitalizations and deaths we will get. It is also a given that states like Arizona will have more deaths than they should if they run out of room in their ICUs. Celebrate a lower death rate all you want, but the focus should be on the number of cases, and it is an absolute disaster that the cases have gone up like they have. Had we controlled the amount of cases better, we could have lowered the death rate much more. But, we have a clueless dumbass in charge who continues downplay the virus and botch everything he does along with a clueless VP and administration who continues to follow along with the dunbass like puppets. We closed too late and reopened too soon. Anyone with any common sense could have done better.
You are too worried about percentages. Percentages don't save lives. It's a given that the more cases we get, the more hospitalizations and deaths we will get. It is also a given that states like Arizona will have more deaths than they should if they run out of room in their ICUs. Celebrate a lower death rate all you want, but the focus should be on the number of cases, and it is an absolute disaster that the cases have gone up like they have. Had we controlled the amount of cases better, we could have lowered the death rate much more. But, we have a clueless dumbass in charge who continues downplay the virus and botch everything he does along with a clueless VP and administration who continues to follow along with the dunbass like puppets. We closed too late and reopened too soon. Anyone with any common sense could have done better.
Shafer,
I am talking about an increase in hospitalizations and deaths vs. what we would have seen had we controlled the cases better. The hospitalizations and death totals would be much lower had we continued to go down instead of back up in cases. That is why I used Arizona as my example. The cases have gone up, and now their ICUs are getting maxed out. This will lead to more deaths. Who cares what the death rate and percentages say. The biggest issue is this will result in more deaths.
The governors/senators of the hillbillie/redneck and undereducated constituents appear to be jumping on the Mask bandwagon.If they don’t,we ain’t having NBA,MLB and more importantly,we ain’t haven’t College Football.How are we sending our kids back to school in the Fall given the catastrophic incompetence of Agent Orange and his merrymen?
Jumping on the bandwagon after months of resistance claiming individual freedoms outweigh being smart and listening to real experts,NOT Dr Dolt(Agent Orange).Even Mr Mumbles from Kentucky jumps onboard.Running for re-election,Mr Mumbles?
Jumping on the bandwagon after months of resistance claiming individual freedoms outweigh being smart and listening to real experts,NOT Dr Dolt(Agent Orange).Even Mr Mumbles from Kentucky jumps onboard.Running for re-election,Mr Mumbles?
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Now here is a dope if ever there was one.
Herman Cain Hospitalized for COVID-19 Hours After Tweeting ‘People Are Fed Up’ With Masks
Ross A. Lincoln
July 2, 2020, 8:10 PM EDT
Former Republican presidential candidate Herman Cain announced Thursday that he has been hospitalized due to symptoms of COVID-19. But in an unusually on-the-nose development, the announcement came only hours after he denounced measures to stem the spread of the illness on Twitter in a show of political support for Donald Trump.
Early Thursday afternoon, Cain’s representatives said in a statement, posted on Cain’s Twitter account, that he was informed June 29 that he tested positive for the coronavirus that causes COVID-19, and that by Wednesday his symptoms were severe enough that he “required hospitalization.” According to the statement, Cain was taken to an Atlanta-area facility Wednesday night, and while his symptoms are “serious,” he “did not require a respirator.”
Left out of Cain’s statement is a notable event that took place between his diagnosis on Monday and his hospitalization Wednesday night. On Wednesday afternoon, Cain tweeted a link to a Western Journal article about South Dakota Gov. Kristi Noem, who bragged that social distancing will not be required at a July 4th Trump rally at Mt. Rushmore. In his tweet, Cain added: “Masks will not be mandatory for the event, which will be attended by President Trump. PEOPLE ARE FED UP!”
Let us know about the ventilator,Herman.Looks like the Tulsa rally was something special...How your lungs...
Herman Cain Hospitalized for COVID-19 Hours After Tweeting ‘People Are Fed Up’ With Masks
Ross A. Lincoln
July 2, 2020, 8:10 PM EDTFormer Republican presidential candidate Herman Cain announced Thursday that he has been hospitalized due to symptoms of COVID-19. But in an unusually on-the-nose development, the announcement came only hours after he denounced measures to stem the spread of the illness on Twitter in a show of political support for Donald Trump.
Early Thursday afternoon, Cain’s representatives said in a statement, posted on Cain’s Twitter account, that he was informed June 29 that he tested positive for the coronavirus that causes COVID-19, and that by Wednesday his symptoms were severe enough that he “required hospitalization.” According to the statement, Cain was taken to an Atlanta-area facility Wednesday night, and while his symptoms are “serious,” he “did not require a respirator.”
Left out of Cain’s statement is a notable event that took place between his diagnosis on Monday and his hospitalization Wednesday night. On Wednesday afternoon, Cain tweeted a link to a Western Journal article about South Dakota Gov. Kristi Noem, who bragged that social distancing will not be required at a July 4th Trump rally at Mt. Rushmore. In his tweet, Cain added: “Masks will not be mandatory for the event, which will be attended by President Trump. PEOPLE ARE FED UP!”
Let us know about the ventilator,Herman.Looks like the Tulsa rally was something special...How your lungs...
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In Florida, 6X increase in cases from March has resulted in half as many deaths total. So you are completely off base. Dramatic increase in cases has indeed resulted in lower hospitalizations and lower deaths. Countries in Europe such as Spain, UK, and France who had stricter lock downs than your Orange Man had far more deaths per captia than we did.
I don't think you understand what I am saying, so we can just move on. But, I really have no idea what point you are trying to make? Are you saying everything is fine? Are you saying we should not be concerned with the dramatic increase in cases the past week or two?
I think he is saying because we have fewer hospitalizations and deaths than others on a per capita basis we should not worry about the virus. If I am right, how would you handle the situation like two local businesses (that I know) are faced with now, in each case one employee went on vacation, came back to work, then got sick, tested positive, and now the entire business and their families have to be quarantined for 14 days?
For all the hillbillies and rednecks out there who want their god-given freedoms rather than taking precautionary steps,see this:
In Florida, 6X increase in cases from March has resulted in half as many deaths total. So you are completely off base. Dramatic increase in cases has indeed resulted in lower hospitalizations and lower deaths. Countries in Europe such as Spain, UK, and France who had stricter lock downs than your Orange Man had far more deaths per captia than we did.
deSanitis has been cooking the books since he fired the expert record keeper.Everyone in the know should know this.
Rebekah Jones, Florida’s fired coronavirus data scientist, publishes her own dashboard
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/06/12/rebekah-jones-florida-coronavirus/
Not only have they played around with the books to make things look better, and not only has DeSantis treated this as horribly as his buddy Trump has, but the chart Shafer showed is incredibly misleading. By showing this chart the day after June ends, they can show all the cases from June, but of course nearly all of the cases from most of June, especially the 2nd half, would not result in deaths yet. The last week in June, they were having over 8000 and 9000 cases a day, but of course very very few people have died from these cases yet, with the key word being yet.
Also, Shafer cherry picked a few countries who have worse death rates per capita then ours to try to make a point, but he is ignoring the fact that we have one of the worst death rates per capita in the whole world. Johns Hopkins showed research from about a month ago, about the same time dumb ass Trump was saying we and Germany are doing the best, and it showed that we had the 11th highest death rate per capita out of over 140 countries researched.
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I hardly cherry picked. UK, Belgium, Sweden, France, Spain, and Italy are peer nations of ours and like us, also located in the temperate zone. Covid-19 has been a non-factor in much of the world, especially the tropics, so "cooking the books" would in fact be what you are doing by citing the entire world. Compared to Western Europe, the US is doing AVERAGE. We are neither near the top of the fatalities chart like the countries previously mentioned, but some countries like Germany and Switzerland are doing better.
But when you factor in the obscenely higher obesity and diabetes rates in the American population, and our much higher minority population, our performance becomes even more impressive. We are essentially performing at the European average despite having a much less healthy starting population. Trump is a salesman and if you haven't learned to take his use of the word "best" or "greatest" with a grain of salt by now you probably beyond hope. But once you control for the overall health of the respective populations, a strong argument could be made that we actually are doing as well as Germany. What is the death rate in the US for people of Germanic heritage with average German weight and average Germanic health profile? Would be a very interesting question. I'm sure CNN's team of crack reporters will get right on that, lol.
And lo and behold, turns out Orange Man knew exactly what he was talking about when it came to Hydroxychloroquine. CNN's headline admitting Hydroxychloroquine works claims the revelation is "surprising". Surprising to them, maybe. But not surprising to anyone who follows real news rather than Fake News and especially not surprising to those of us who live in Asia and were aware of the treatment protocols over here.
Our performance becomes more impressive? What part of losing over 130,000 lives when handling this virus in numerous other ways would have resulted in less deaths is impressive to you? Not to mention we have now known about this virus for nearly 6 months and instead of being pretty much done with it like many other places, we can't even get students back to colleges and everyone back to work. We are so far behind with this it is beyond pathetic.
And, so what if hydroxychloroquine works sometimes. No one ever said it might not work. The problem is it was not approved, would not work on everyone, and could be very harmful to people, which in many cases it was. Taking 10 ibuprofen might work on a headache, but that doesn't mean it is safe and we all should do that. Fake news? Nearly every doctor warned of taking this drug. Just like Trump can find his doctors to lie for him at will, it is not hard to find some researchers out there saying this drug works. The news is surprising because so many experts have said otherwise. It would be like finding a study saying climate change is a hoax and saying "see, I told you so". Those studies are out there, too, and they would also be surprising when 97% of experts say climate change is real.
And, so what if hydroxychloroquine works sometimes. No one ever said it might not work. The problem is it was not approved, would not work on everyone, and could be very harmful to people, which in many cases it was. Taking 10 ibuprofen might work on a headache, but that doesn't mean it is safe and we all should do that. Fake news? Nearly every doctor warned of taking this drug. Just like Trump can find his doctors to lie for him at will, it is not hard to find some researchers out there saying this drug works. The news is surprising because so many experts have said otherwise. It would be like finding a study saying climate change is a hoax and saying "see, I told you so". Those studies are out there, too, and they would also be surprising when 97% of experts say climate change is real.
Hydroxychloroquine is regularly proscribed in half the world as a malaria treatment and is on the WHO's list of "essential drugs". The idea that is "dangerous" was always ridiculous Fake News meant to alarm low information voters. Practically all drugs are dangerous for certain people with certain conditions. That is why we have this thing called "doctors" who check for contraindications before prescribing. Trump didn't come up with the HCQ+Azithromycin+Zinc treatment himself. He only knew about it because it was successfully being used by doctors in South Korea and China to improve survival rates.
And lol at "so what". You just went on about 130,000 deaths (an average result for a Western 1st world country) and now you are scoffing at a treatment that reduced the death rate in a study by 50%? Can you make up your mind please? Is saving lives important or not? Because it seems the only thing you care about it is trying to make "Orange Man look bad" no matter the human cost.
And lol at "so what". You just went on about 130,000 deaths (an average result for a Western 1st world country) and now you are scoffing at a treatment that reduced the death rate in a study by 50%? Can you make up your mind please? Is saving lives important or not? Because it seems the only thing you care about it is trying to make "Orange Man look bad" no matter the human cost.
“But when you factor in the obscenely higher obesity and diabetes rates in the American population, and our much higher minority population, our performance becomes even more impressive” ... this reminds me of a business unit manager I previously worked with who segregated out all of the areas where he lost money to provide revised financials which he submitted to our boss, essentially saying “except where we are losing money, we’re making money”. I prefer to look at the situation in total and acknowledge our realities.
Ignoring context is the opposite of acknowledging reality. Our absolute reality is that our performance that puts us in the middle of the pack among our Western Peer nations. But if prior to this oubreak, you would have said the USA would be outperforming nations like France and Belgium in a disease that is especially fatal for people with diabetes and weight issues, nobody would have taken that bet.
Now you see why DeSanitis plays with the numbers.Not sure whether this guy is a hillbillie,redneck or both and/or just plain stupid.Maybe all of the above.
This guy is a perfect fit as a FOX news anchor.
This guy is a perfect fit as a FOX news anchor.
So Agent Orange says 99% covid no problem.
Let’s see Dr Dolt’s math.
2.8 million cases in US with 130,000 deaths.
Seems like there has been a 4.7% death rate.T
Agent Orange did not do well in arithmetic even while he attended Silver Spoon Elementary School or Penn Wharton(daddy got him in since he can’t either read or write).
https://news.sky.com/video/trump-99...s-and-china-must-be-held-accountable-12021503
Let’s see Dr Dolt’s math.
2.8 million cases in US with 130,000 deaths.
Seems like there has been a 4.7% death rate.T
Agent Orange did not do well in arithmetic even while he attended Silver Spoon Elementary School or Penn Wharton(daddy got him in since he can’t either read or write).
https://news.sky.com/video/trump-99...s-and-china-must-be-held-accountable-12021503
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Let’s see how this turns out .And they want college football this Fall at UM,MSU,CMU,EMU.How about at Dumbass U ?
That is assuming 100% case detection.
CDC estimates there are 10-to-1 undetected cases. That is conservative; recent study by Nobel Prize winners puts the number north of 40 million cases.
Lonestar State undereducated hillbillies
These Texans say being forced to wear face masks harms their constitutional rights
Despite Texas recording a record high number of coronavirus cases, many citizens are refusing to wear masks. Sky News’ Alex Crawford reports on the resistance to wear masks.
https://apple.news/AUHD2kBxMTbmeCgA36_-wPg
These Texans say being forced to wear face masks harms their constitutional rights
Despite Texas recording a record high number of coronavirus cases, many citizens are refusing to wear masks. Sky News’ Alex Crawford reports on the resistance to wear masks.
https://apple.news/AUHD2kBxMTbmeCgA36_-wPg
Thank goodness, the thread with the racism on the main board got removed, but I wanted to share some info:
No, the media has nothing to do with it, and yes, it is very much racist to call the virus what some on here are calling it. In May of 2015, the WHO issued new guidelines for naming new infectious diseases in humans. Notice the date, 2015, so you can stop pretending this is an attack on dumb ass, and you can stop making excuses for his blatant racism. The guidelines are meant to minimize unnecessary negative effects on trade, travel, tourism or animal welfare, and avoid causing offense to any cultural, social, national, regional, professional or ethnic groups.
So, the diseases are not to include:
1. Geographic locations: Cities, countries, regions, continents.
2. People’s names.
3. Species/class of animal or food.
4. Cultural, population, industry or occupational references.
5. Terms that incite undue fear.
Even if for some reason you still don't think it is racist, hate crimes against Asians went up after dumb ass started using his racism to name this, so that alone should be enough for anyone to stop doing this.
No, the media has nothing to do with it, and yes, it is very much racist to call the virus what some on here are calling it. In May of 2015, the WHO issued new guidelines for naming new infectious diseases in humans. Notice the date, 2015, so you can stop pretending this is an attack on dumb ass, and you can stop making excuses for his blatant racism. The guidelines are meant to minimize unnecessary negative effects on trade, travel, tourism or animal welfare, and avoid causing offense to any cultural, social, national, regional, professional or ethnic groups.
So, the diseases are not to include:
1. Geographic locations: Cities, countries, regions, continents.
2. People’s names.
3. Species/class of animal or food.
4. Cultural, population, industry or occupational references.
5. Terms that incite undue fear.
Even if for some reason you still don't think it is racist, hate crimes against Asians went up after dumb ass started using his racism to name this, so that alone should be enough for anyone to stop doing this.
