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UR suspends head baseball coach and assistant

If McQueen knocked a player out with an uppercut, that's one thing. If they were arguing about the player's failure to adhere to team rules and he put his hands on him to stop him from turning away from the discussion, that's something different entirely to me. Obviously it doesn't sound as if the former happened, so I'll be interested to hear how close to accurate the latter might be.

To me, it sounds like this is more on the player than on McQueen, who apparently was just trying to keep the rules in place.
 
There are a lot of people throwing around things as to how the AD over reacted and this was the players fault. I just wanted to try and let everyone know what happened so there aren't so many false rumors. It started when Montague gave a player permission to have a beer. Next day he wasn't in the lineup because word got to McQueen that he had been drinking. This caused a very heated argument between the player and McQueen. McQueen swung and hit the player. The player then pushed McQueen to the ground and the altercation was broken up. I had to post something simply because people were criticizing how the AD is handling the situation and also giving the majority of the blame to the parent.

Look for the announcement regarding McQueen and Montague's resignation/firing coming within a couple days after the season is over for the Diamond Spiders.

It's very sad that this has taken place and hopefully they are able to hire a good fit.
 
The players lack of discipline did start the whole situation. If he does not drink or confront his coach after he is disciplined then we have no problem. I was not there to see the other part so I will not comment on that.
 
I am not condoning what the player did by any means. However, when an assistant coach gives a 21 year old permission to have one beer because someone wanted to buy him one, what do you expect? Shouldn't we put more blame on Montague for telling the player he could have a beer? As for McQueen hitting a player, I don't think it is ever okay in any circumstance for a coach to swing at a player. Maybe I'm just crazy.
 
Must admit that I found the baseball team to be among the most self-absorbed, arrogant pricks on campus when I was in school (late 90's) and sadly, it sounds like little has changed. At least they won alot in the late 90s.

I mean who the hell needs to drink beer during a critical weekend series at the end of your Senior season?

It will be interesting to hear if the rest of the squad takes up for McQueen.

This post was edited on 5/23 12:53 PM by MolivaManiac
 
again, NotSoGreat, you seem to know a story, probably did not need to name names and guess we have to trust you although you could be a parent, the parent, the player, the athletic director's wife, who knows. if correct, started when a vcu assistant coach, had to get that in there, ha, gave permission, assuming, again, that this account is accurate, to have a beer. that should then have been worked out between Mac and the assistant although suspending him for a game has its merits as well. both Mac and the player should have left it at that but we all know that is difficult. if Mac did indeed strike the player then no matter the reason, other than defending himself, a no no and he has to go. most athletes and coaches are ultra competitive so this type of thing is not uncommon, usually handled internally and never sees the light of day. if all was OK and then the parent gets ticked off and inserts himself or herself into the mix, then you have a completely different dynamic and thus what we are seeing and by saying that am not indicting the parent for their actions, just stating a fact. a different time but know that my bro was punched in the nose by his head coach while playing at UR and they later, as adults, became extremely close, lifelong friends. just a sad deal and feel bad for the baseball family on all levels.
 
this goes along with what I heard as well with the exception of the physical aspect. I didn't hear anything that specific. I also heard that the beer thing was with the kids parents after recently turning 21 and there may have been another player that joined them. Tag did know about it, and when Mac found out he benched the players. The players didn't like that and let Mac know but chose to do so in the dugout. Not a great situation and plenty of blame to go around. I have also heard we will have a new coach next year. Coach Mac is a universally liked guy which makes this especially unpleasant.
 
Originally posted by NotSoGreatSpider:
It started when Montague gave a player permission to have a beer. Next day he wasn't in the lineup because word got to McQueen that he had been drinking. ....
When does a student at UR have just one beer?
 
Originally posted by NotSoGreatSpider:
an assistant coach gives a 21 year old permission to have one beer because someone wanted to buy him one, what do you expect? ...


Did anyone say free beer?
 
Here is my interpretation





Originally posted by NotSoGreatSpider:
"It started when Montague gave a player permission to have a beer."

Translation- the player asked Montague if he could have dinner (or meet) with someone... Montague said he could .

"Next day he wasn't in the lineup because word got to McQueen that he had been drinking...."

Translation:, the player had more than one beer. The player may have had one too many. The player may even have been hung over at the game. Everyone on the team knew.

McQueen decided he was going to bench the player. The player found out about it when the coach excluded him from the starting line-up.

"This caused a very heated argument between the player and McQueen..."

Translation: The player approached the coach and wanted to know why. The player was very angry. He was probably yelling at the coach.

"McQueen swung and hit the player. "

Translation: There was contact.

"The player then pushed McQueen to the ground and the altercation was broken up... "

Translation: Yep.
Admittedly, the translations are my speculation.

Now what?

This post was edited on 5/23 11:34 AM by Stonewall D
 
The thing that I have a question about is when it happened. The lineup comparisons between Fordham game #2 is no different between Fordham game #3. The two players that either quit or got suspended were both in the lineup in game #3. Anyone offer any insight??

I didn't hear anything about players being drunk or hungover. I heard the player was with his parents. There are so many rumors I don't know if that is true.
 
The player that I heard this was about was in the lineup until game #3 of the VCU series. If this was such a big deal- McQueen throws a punch and is knocked down- how is the player in the lineup for 3 games after the incident?
 
Originally posted by NotSoGreatSpider:
It started when Montague gave a player permission to have a beer....
I see no mention of the player's parents or family. I only see the assertion that the coach said the player could have a beer.
 
Originally posted by Stonewall D:
Here is my interpretation





Originally posted by NotSoGreatSpider:
"It started when Montague gave a player permission to have a beer."

Translation- the player asked Montague if he could have dinner (or meet) with someone... Montague said he could .

"Next day he wasn't in the lineup because word got to McQueen that he had been drinking...."

Translation:, the player had more than one beer. The player may have had one too many. The player may even have been hung over at the game. Everyone on the team knew.

McQueen decided he was going to bench the player. The player found out about it when the coach excluded him from the starting line-up.

"This caused a very heated argument between the player and McQueen..."

Translation: The player approached the coach and wanted to know why. The player was very angry. He was probably yelling at the coach.

"McQueen swung and hit the player. "

Translation: There was contact.

"The player then pushed McQueen to the ground and the altercation was broken up... "

Translation: Yep.
Admittedly, the translations are my speculation.

Now what?

This post was edited on 5/23 11:34 AM by Stonewall D
Now I think you need to give a big testimonial for Rosetta Stone???
 
This version of what transpired is very similar to what was told to me by someone who said they knew what really happened.
 
the only people who know what really happened were in the dugout and all else is secondhand at this point.
 
Mine too. I wouldn't report anything if I didn't have a reliable source even though some have continued to question what I wrote earlier.
 
Not So Great, a ton of us have been on here for years, know each other and trust each other. only feeling uncomfortable since you are new here but certainly welcome and appreciate your contributions. just that so many rumors have been flying around and now you, someone we don't know, comes on, so, we kind of are wary since anyone can post and say anything they wish without considering honesty, accuracy or anything. please do not take it personally. stay here and give us any tidbits you pick up, no probs at all.
 
MolivaManiac, you probably have never met any of the current players, so I suggest you keep your opinion as to their character to yourself. For all we know, you were a gourd-necked geek who got his girlfriend snatched by a ballplayer at a frat beer party.

I will not comment on any of this stuff, only to say that there a lot of people involved who wish they hadn't done what they did. I would like to think that there will be a new chapter in UR baseball where we get a dynamic coach, current or future, who will build the program to unprecedented heights, with an upgraded facility and great recruits.

Unfortunately, many of you on here expect a winning program without having to invest in it. You might as well look under your pillow tomorrow morning for a dollar bill. A coach is not a magician. He needs something to sell and a talented kid is not going to consider UR over a Duke, Wake Forest or even High Point out of the gate, it is not a household name in baseball. UR has a great rep in the mid-Atlantic states, that's about it. Many of you want to go to the game for free, complain when UR doesn't win or the players don't play hard, the coach doesn't make the right moves, etc., etc. Do yourselves a favor and go out and see other schools and venues in the area, see how far behind we are. WE DON'T EVEN HAVE RUNNING WATER AT PITT FIELD, FOR CRYING OUT LOUD. Until you, through UR, step up YOUR game and demand better, you get what you get. So when the program isn't up to your demanding standards, have a look in the mirror.

These kids work HARD. They are motivated. They have a desire to win. They need the tools and opportunity that every competing baseball player should have at peer institutions. Any reasons for not upgrading are just excuses for not caring about it.

This post was edited on 5/24 10:10 AM by Tarantula'sDad
 
Originally posted by Tarantula'sDad:
WE DON'T EVEN HAVE RUNNING WATER AT PITT FIELD, FOR CRYING OUT LOUD....
Any reasons for not upgrading are just excuses for not caring about it.
I understand your rant, but beyond that you make a few good points. Baseball development takes time. It took Ron Atkins 17 years to build the baseball team to achieve 50+ wins and a top ten ranking. For all of the arguments about Lacrosse vs. Soccer, the three biggest sports at Richmond are football, men's basketball and baseball. UR should invest more in its baseball program. Maybe cancel LAX.
 
first, we have to define peer programs, certainly not acc schools but certainly A-10 schools. have not been to their parks so cannot comment on that aspect and quite frankly do not know how many scholarships they give out for baseball so cannot comment on that. do know that i prefer our park, as is, as a collge venue, over vcu having to play where they play. until someone can come on here and compare what we spend, our park and our scholarship allocation, to the other A-10 programs, cannot really comment because i know nothing. one thing you do have wrong, Moliva stole the third baseman's girl and that caused all the probs when he was a student. now his wife, a real cutie, he got very lucky and hope he knows it and lets her know everyday. the third baseman could not go to his right while MO can and did.
 
Originally posted by WebSpinner:
one thing you do have wrong, Moliva stole the third baseman's girl and that caused all the probs when he was a student. now his wife, a real cutie, he got very lucky and hope he knows it and lets her know everyday. the third baseman could not go to his right while MO can and did.




You cannot be serious.



This post was edited on 5/24 2:23 PM by Stonewall D
 
Originally posted by Tarantula'sDad:
For all we know, you were a gourd-necked geek who got his girlfriend snatched by a ballplayer at a frat beer party.
Yep. You've got it.

After the events of the last few weeks and the overall mediocre performance of the baseball program, I'd actually be in favor of decreasing the funding of the baseball program and putting the money in other non-revenue sports.

Get rid of the port a potties behind home plate and have people request a key card for Marsh Hall if they need to use the potty. Charge visitors a dollar for entry into March hall.

Close down the snack bar and simply have a vending machine with trail mix and snickers bars.

Print the lineup papers that go in the mailbox in right field on a even lighter stock of paper.

Golf just sent a kid to the NCAA. I hadn't noticed if we had built a golf course on campus so he can train at such a high level. Have we? Maybe we should with the cost savings from the baseball snack bar and port a potty reductions and paper savings.
 
MM haha you synical SOB. Seriously Wake Forest has a great golf practice facility that needless to say Arnold, Lanny, Jay, and others have probably funded nicely to attract the best golfers available. Very impressive. We don't have the history but maybe Tim Finchum can throw some funding our way.
 
Originally posted by MolivaManiac:

I hadn't noticed if we had built a golf course on campus so he can train at such a high level. Have we?
CCV is adjacent to campus...I've always thought UR should make them an offer they can't refuse for it.
smile.r191677.gif
 
SF's idea has a lot of merit. We get a course for our NCAA golfer and new pools for our NCAA swimmers. They seem to consistently succeed despite horrible facilities and fewer scholarships than others.
 
Great points. I'll only add that I heard CCV has a bar...

The move might benefit baseball too. Just sayin'.

dead.r191677.gif


This post was edited on 5/24 1:44 PM by MolivaManiac
 
I understand we were close to a deal with CCV and they changed their minds. CR was working on that. I understood Fincham has already provided a great practice facility for our golf teams.
 
Originally posted by Tarantula'sDad:

you were a gourd-necked geek...


This post was edited on 5/24 10:10 AM by Tarantula'sDad
I would say it is more of a pencil-neck, than a gourd-neck. There is a difference. IMHO, it is better to be gourd-necked than the alternative. MO is definitely more of the pencil-neck version.
 
things may have changed but think we got the facility that Bill Goodwin, a neighbor who provided our super alum house, used for his golf company which he sold. not sure if that was another donation by him or we purchased it or what.
 
Originally posted by WebSpinner:
one thing you do have wrong, Moliva stole the third baseman's girl and that caused all the probs when he was a student. now his wife, a real cutie, he got very lucky and hope he knows it and lets her know everyday. the third baseman could not go to his right while MO can and did.


I must disagree with you Spinner. It was not just one girl, it was every girlfriend of every baseball player on the UR team. You should have seen it, the girls were tearing his clothes and crying when he spoke to them. It was quite a scene. The girls were like lemmings, when they chased him into the lake. It almost caused a riot on campus.
 
whenever he makes me take him to lunch and pay, it is the same way, girls all over the place, very difficult to consume my chili dogs. the guy is a magnet and hear he may be coming out in the near future.
 
The first comparison is our funding vs. A10. I think we compare very favorably to rest of league & likely near the top but don't haved those stats. Yet our results don't match. I'm in favor of more funding for baseball program but one could argue well show me performance vs. rest of league first & not unreasonable to expect more there. Goal is to be more regional player we were for a while but first we gotta get back to doing better in league and there should be enough there to do so. We will always have more challenges in many non rev sports b/c of cost of tuition. Take out whether we fully fund all available baseball ships that will be there regardless. Of course we have our advantages too, such as location vs. many in league, the whole package at UR etc. This school funds athletics well, not equal to every sport nor should it be. The whole cutting of track & soccer for lacrosse should not mislead anyone into thinking there is not institutional support & funding for athletics, there is especially when you factor in enrollment. One other reason I think there was support for lacrosse is the recruiting pool for UR is deeper. You can get more players on partials and walk ons because of the geaography of where players come from but quite honestly the affluence of the players who play. They can afford Richmond more. No stats there either but pretty well known. While growing to the public HS's it was always a more traditional private school sport.
 
Sorry GKiller but "funding" is no where near close. First the NCAA does not allow enough scholarships to cover the number of players needed to field an adequate team. The number one alternative then is to split scholarships to get the players. So UR and VCU offer a kid a 1/2 scholarship - the kid can go to VCU and the parents pay $5,000, if the kid goes to UR the parents must pay $25,000. UR further handicaps the sport (non-revenue) by allowing fewer scholarships than the NCAA allows. I don't really fault UR for this. It is a tough financial decision when a sport generates no revenue at all to help support itself. I have always thought our coaches did really well with the limitations they have, and tight budgets they work with.

I think the NCAA limit on scholarships vs the number of players needed is a problem for baseball, soccer and lacrosse at
any private school. Probably true for some other sports as well.

I have always wished we did better in baseball. We have had some really nice players come through. I think if you look at the facilities you see the limitations we have. When the best seat is "bring your own chair to the parking lot", and not in a comfortable seat in the stands you are reminded of the need for greater commitment to the program if you really want to have a nationally/regionally recognized team on the field.

In the pecking order it will be: basketball, football, lacrosse, then baseball. Think of the money it takes. GO SPIDERS!!!!.
 
no where close to what? do you have a comparison on A10 baseball spending? that is what I'm curious about and what I was asking. how much do we spend on baseball vs. other A10 teams. My guess is our spending would rank much higher among A10 teams than comparitively our W-L record within league in the many years since we last won it. I like to look at league comparison first then some regional peer schools. No need for anyone to bring up the High Points. Sure they have a solid baseball program & nice facilities, they also don't have to worry about spending on high level basketball and football. If a kid chooses to play at High Point over us no big deal.

The rest if what you wrote is not really any different from my post. I would like to see more funding personally. However that does not mean we aren't funding to a sufficient level within our league. Maybe we aren't but very skeptical of such an assertion and would need to see evidence. btw I don't think most schools are at the ncaa baseball ship max. I agree seating enhancements are overdue. Facilities is only 1 part of spending although a very visible one.
This post was edited on 5/24 11:38 PM by GKiller
 
A-10 baseball total expenses in 2011:

Fordham: $980,700
GW: $928,744
Dayton: $872,134
Richmond: $860,091
Xavier: $857,170
Rhode Island: $802,707
St. Joe's: $784,871
Saint Louis: $$772,166
Charlotte: $713,986
Temple: $634,047
La Salle: $514,431
St. Bonaventure: $454,281
UMass: $436,044
 
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