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RPI basketball rankings

FWIW, our next two opponents are #29 Florida and #51 Northern Iowa; victories over either one would be really helpful to improve UR's rank, currently #71. OSC
 
Not enough data for the RPI model to mean anything at all at this point.

For instance, check out RPI rank #38 -- "Incarnate Word". (I guess that's a school.) They are 0-2, with losses by 33 and 35, yet somehow rank 33 spots ahead of UR. So, let's just win games and not worry too much about the model.
 
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Point is, in the final analysis, this is the model used by the NCAA. If a team starts out low, then it must have big time wins to make up for their initial losses, e. g. rpi. OSC
 
Once these "incarnate word" teams enter conference play, their RPIs will sink with each game. Glad we are in the A10 where we have a chance to improve it as the season goes on. Would love to get the W's against Florida and N Iowa, we would be in good shape if that happens
 
There's no doubt that winning games helps the RPI. Just pointing out that the rankings at this point (as highlighted in the original post) are pretty much meaningless right now.
 
University of The Incarnate Word was walloped by Purdue and Oklahoma which were the only two Division1 schools they have played to date. Shows the value of scheduling highly ranked teams.
 
Spiderbymarriage, your alma mater Vcu is at the bottom of the A10 at #151. Thanks for responding as predicted. OSC
 
JMU hasn't been stellar either, losses to Oral Roberts and TN Martin?
 
Ulla1 said:
Spiderbymarriage, your alma mater Vcu is at the bottom of the A10 at #151. Thanks for responding as predicted. OSC
Click to expand...

Hey, thanks for the personal attack -- very helpful and pleasant! (By the way, I didn't go to VCU.) Since you're not addressing the substance of my point (see Incarnate Word example above), should I assume that you are conceding the point that the RPI scores are not valuable at this point in the season?

Exhibit 2: Long Beach State: RPI #22. Long Beach State is 2-3, with one victory against a top 200 team (RPI #62 Seton Hall), and 0-3 vs teams ranked 100-200. Somehow the model decided they belong at # 22.
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/rpi/_/teamId/299
 
50% of your RPI comes from your opponents' records. Long Beach State's opponents have a combined record of 23-5...BYU 3-1, Seton Hall 5-1, UVA 5-1, and Oklahoma State 5-1 x 2.
 
Good point, SF, yet those opponents have mediocre RPI's despite their great records. I think this furthers the point that the model is not valuably until there's more data in it.
 
Spiderbymarriage said:
Good point, SF, yet those opponents have mediocre RPI's despite their great records. I think this furthers the point that the model is not valuably until there's more data in it.
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The model is never really that valuable if you are using it to try to predict who will win basketball games. Its only value is that for some reason the selection committee uses it as a large part of their process in giving out at large bids.
 
RPI is not a perfect system by any means, but it is valuable as a tool for determining the relative strength of teams. But as noted here, it's not fully effective until later in the season. If you have played 5 crappy teams, and they've all played 5 crappier teams and all of them have gone 5-0, their RPI (and yours) will be artificially inflated by that. Once crappy teams start playing and losing to better teams, it will start to even itself out.

Cal is ranked 170 in the ESPN RPI today. I have a feeling they are a BIT better than that.
 
Spiders up to #32 RPI and #19 SOS. Granted, this is the same system that has Valparaiso at #2 RPI and Incarnate Wood as #1 SOS, but it is still good to be in the top 50.

Its also nice to see that every A10 team except St. Louis and La Salle are in the top 200. It'll minimize the chances of getting a bad loss if we happen to lose to one of them
 
WarrenNolan.com has us at 41RPI/23 SOS, so things are starting to fall into place. It'll still take until the start of conference season for RPI to make a ton of sense, though.
 
Spiders now at #31; 6 A10 teams in top 100, rpi checks in at #107. OSC
 
Pomeroy still has us at 66, and SCUM at 39 (even after the loss to FSU). How many games does SCUM have to lose in order to drop out of the top 50?

Of course, that JMU loss is hanging like an anchor on us.
 
wr70beh said:
Pomeroy still has us at 66, and SCUM at 39 (even after the loss to FSU). How many games does SCUM have to lose in order to drop out of the top 50?

Of course, that JMU loss is hanging like an anchor on us.
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RPI is the only ranking that matters! Ain't it great. OSC
 
RPI indicates what you have accomplished so far. Therefore it means more and more later in the year.

KenPom indicates what your average play has been, each play this season. Therefore it indicates that if that average play continues how likely you are or are not to beat future opponents who continue their average play.

However everyone doesn't play the same future opponents and there is no guarantee that past performance and future performance will be the same.
 
wr70beh said:
Pomeroy still has us at 66, and SCUM at 39 (even after the loss to FSU). How many games does SCUM have to lose in order to drop out of the top 50?

Of course, that JMU loss is hanging like an anchor on us.
Click to expand...

I was wondering why URI hadn't fallen much without Mathews, but the Providence game did indicate they can still perform even if they lost.

Do you know if KenPom's first rating prior to the season still has any weight in current ratings?
 
Remember The RPI OBAMA rankings only care who you play, winning or losing doesn't matter much. Everyone gets a trophy!!
 
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SpiderK said:
Remember The RPI OBAMA rankings only care who you play, winning or losing doesn't matter much. Everyone gets a trophy!!
Click to expand...

Your wins and losses count for 25% of the RPI, opponent wins and losses count for 50% and opponent's opponents wins and losses count for 25%.
 
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There are so many variables (including personal and team development) that any predictability is suspect. However KenPom is better at predicting if you will win your next game. RPI is better at predicting if you will play a next game. So becomes more and more important as the season goes on...
 
It is early, but good to see UR listed among the top-5 in the A-10, and to have five A-10 teams listed among the top-15 on this list. FYI,
#1: GW,
#3 Dayton,
#5: Davidson,
#11: RPI,
#12: UR
#15 St. Joe's

Based on the above, it looks like our victory over Northern Iowa knocked them out of the top 15 (definitely a "good win"). Three other A-10 squads are mentioned among the top 34, in the "others receiving votes" (Fordham, URI, Duquesne) and,FYI, JMU made it in the top 34, probably due to a "good win" vs. UR. I believe we can finish above RPI, and if we finish in the top-4 in the A-10, I like our chances to dance. One game at a time...
 
Any ranking system that has Vcu ranked higher than us is completely ignorant of on court performance this year.
 
97spiderfan said:
Any ranking system that has Vcu ranked higher than us is completely ignorant of on court performance this year.
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In the rpi rankings, Richmond is #61; vcu is #134. Sounds about right. Perhaps the Spiders should be a bit higher. OSC
 
RPI doesn't look at the name on the uniform, unlike most of these ranking systems. All about who you played, who you beat, and where you beat them. That is why it is a tool that the selection committee uses. 61 is right where we need to be right now. If we were at 134, I'd be a bit worried.
 
Spideroldie said:
It is early, but good to see UR listed among the top-5 in the A-10, and to have five A-10 teams listed among the top-15 on this list. FYI,
#1: GW,
#3 Dayton,
#5: Davidson,
#11: RPI,
#12: UR
#15 St. Joe's

Based on the above, it looks like our victory over Northern Iowa knocked them out of the top 15 (definitely a "good win"). Three other A-10 squads are mentioned among the top 34, in the "others receiving votes" (Fordham, URI, Duquesne) and,FYI, JMU made it in the top 34, probably due to a "good win" vs. UR. I believe we can finish above RPI, and if we finish in the top-4 in the A-10, I like our chances to dance. One game at a time...
Click to expand...
No doubt Northern Iowa will be back strong on the next poll with their victory over Iowa State.
 
Spiders #53 in RPI; JMU breakes into top 100 at #99. This should help as a "bad loss" may become a "top 100" victory. OSC
 
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