If we are playing Georgetown in conference games in both football & basketball, then I will have mixed feelings.
Rocco mentioned in connection with UD job
- Thread starter MolivaManiac
- Start date
Agreed! And I would imagine recruits and commits are questioning if they want to be in a program that lacks vision.
I have tried not to post on this thread but you guys lured me in. First I respect everything Coach has done for the football program. I am not as vested as most of you are so you may want to give me a pass here. If Coach leave and it is best for him I will respectfully say good luck. If he stays and want to make the program better and he has proved that he is capable, I will say good luck. We have been here before and some of the rumors and feeling are just as they were then.
I want this team to be focused on the game Saturday. We all know what happens when we get side tracked on the coming and going of the Coach. UR is a good sell now. If Coach leave I pray we land another good one. The reality of it all he is going to leave one day anyway. That is a fact of life. Tonight, this weekend I just want him, the team and hell even me to think about making to Dec 10 game.
Here is my favorite poem for Coach R and the new coach if this is the case:
Some time when you're feeling important
Some time when your ego's in bloom;
Some time when you take it for granted,
You're the best qualified in the room;
Some time when you think that your going,
would leave an unfillable hole;
Just follow this simple instruction
And see how it humbles your soul.
Take a bucket and fill it with water;
Put your hands in it up to your wrists;
Pull them out - and the hole that remains;
Is the measure of how much you'll be missed.
You may splash as you please when you enter;
You may stir up the water galore;
But stop - and you'll find in a second ,
That it looks just the same as before.
The moral of this is quite simple;
Do just the best that you can,
and be proud of yourself - but remember;
There is no indispensable man
I want this team to be focused on the game Saturday. We all know what happens when we get side tracked on the coming and going of the Coach. UR is a good sell now. If Coach leave I pray we land another good one. The reality of it all he is going to leave one day anyway. That is a fact of life. Tonight, this weekend I just want him, the team and hell even me to think about making to Dec 10 game.
Here is my favorite poem for Coach R and the new coach if this is the case:
Some time when you're feeling important
Some time when your ego's in bloom;
Some time when you take it for granted,
You're the best qualified in the room;
Some time when you think that your going,
would leave an unfillable hole;
Just follow this simple instruction
And see how it humbles your soul.
Take a bucket and fill it with water;
Put your hands in it up to your wrists;
Pull them out - and the hole that remains;
Is the measure of how much you'll be missed.
You may splash as you please when you enter;
You may stir up the water galore;
But stop - and you'll find in a second ,
That it looks just the same as before.
The moral of this is quite simple;
Do just the best that you can,
and be proud of yourself - but remember;
There is no indispensable man
I think we'll find a way to find student athletes interested in getting a free education to play football here, no matter what happens with DR. Just a hunch.
Up to a third of our guys are not getting free educations -- some of them are significant contributors. That said, it is much more difficult to land top guys for one of 63 FCS scholarships than it is to land recruits for one of 85 FBS scholarships (some of which include full cost of attendance). Division I is not necessary an even playing field which makes our victory over Virginia even more special.
You seem to think I just arrived from Mars.
Do we have some things to be concerned about? Yes.
Is the bottom falling out, even if Rocco does leave? No.
I mean I was told the season was over once we lost to Madison so maybe everyone is just confused as to why we are still playing.
Correct , but 2 idiots in administration- Gill and Crutcher- could do a lot of harm.
Firstly ,I appreciate reading all of your comments. It's been helpful to get some persective on this really disappointing situation
My comments are as follows :
I have met Danny Rocco several times and his staff. I'm really taken back that this guy in a time of Me only would be willing to leave a situation that personally is appealing for himself and his family because of his deep level of caring for his athletes, his coaches and spider football fans. It easy to pay off the coach with a big raise and get off easy on the upgrades and the other Coach's and leave the kids with the minimum . I think he has proven to be a man of character and its looking like the admin , not so much
From first hand knowledge I can tell you that these young men on the team are second class citizens at this college. morale is low on the Team and usually it's because the kids don't like the coaches and they are losing here it is the opposite they really respect all the coaching staff and we see they are winning The problem is that they are treated with contempt by other students, the admin and a great percentage of the proffessors. They have become the whipping boys for PC and tittle nine advocates at the school in relality The kids on the team are exceptional kids from great families! That's Danny's strategy He is big on the kids family background and it's paid off big time
A good HS program gets more gear than these kids and their equipment is only passable. Not to mention the poor quality of the locker room and weight facilities. This is important for acouple of reasons, one is for the morale with kids and secondly for recruiting. Before all of this went down I was looking into seeing if we could rally team parents, donors and local businesses to create a fund specifically for the football team
Get these kids some gear, latest football helmets and shoulder pads and show them we understand what they have accomplished and it is appreciated
What has been accomplished at this school is amazing and it is positioned to reach even new levels, a championship or several. we all know how difficult it is to win and even more so to do it consistently There is something special here and I think it's architect may be leaving. Life will go on but we will see the effects and more importantly word gets out and you'll see less talent walking through our doors.
Finally, its about the kids and with Danny leaving it will get a lot tougher on our boys...and that's a fact
My comments are as follows :
I have met Danny Rocco several times and his staff. I'm really taken back that this guy in a time of Me only would be willing to leave a situation that personally is appealing for himself and his family because of his deep level of caring for his athletes, his coaches and spider football fans. It easy to pay off the coach with a big raise and get off easy on the upgrades and the other Coach's and leave the kids with the minimum . I think he has proven to be a man of character and its looking like the admin , not so much
From first hand knowledge I can tell you that these young men on the team are second class citizens at this college. morale is low on the Team and usually it's because the kids don't like the coaches and they are losing here it is the opposite they really respect all the coaching staff and we see they are winning The problem is that they are treated with contempt by other students, the admin and a great percentage of the proffessors. They have become the whipping boys for PC and tittle nine advocates at the school in relality The kids on the team are exceptional kids from great families! That's Danny's strategy He is big on the kids family background and it's paid off big time
A good HS program gets more gear than these kids and their equipment is only passable. Not to mention the poor quality of the locker room and weight facilities. This is important for acouple of reasons, one is for the morale with kids and secondly for recruiting. Before all of this went down I was looking into seeing if we could rally team parents, donors and local businesses to create a fund specifically for the football team
Get these kids some gear, latest football helmets and shoulder pads and show them we understand what they have accomplished and it is appreciated
What has been accomplished at this school is amazing and it is positioned to reach even new levels, a championship or several. we all know how difficult it is to win and even more so to do it consistently There is something special here and I think it's architect may be leaving. Life will go on but we will see the effects and more importantly word gets out and you'll see less talent walking through our doors.
Finally, its about the kids and with Danny leaving it will get a lot tougher on our boys...and that's a fact
Floridaspiderfan, a championship would not be a new level. we won it in 08 and reeled off what 15 or 17 straight wins btw Clawson & London which was tied for longest winning streak in the nation at the time. I'm not sure if you just wrote it that way or if you really didn't know that recent enough history. Also I'm not disputing your post otherwise and I have concern too. If you have a son here playing I have great respect for that. There have been many similar posts over the years predicting UR football could never reach the heights it has, well before Rocco. We got Rocco here b/c of that history & I very much want to keep him. Or posts predicting football's downfall, more often those are from opposing fans hoping. Sometimes they are from parents, and we've had many contribute here over the years that bring valuable insight that a non-parent could never have. They do tend to have tunnel vision to their one period of time when son is at UR. I get teh mentality, I'm a parent too. While there are exceptions, when their son's time is done they're done too. The board history is just 1 example of that. It falls on the alumni, we have small alumni base so that is constant challenge. I have heard the football alumni giving is weak. I don't know if that is a rumor I've just heard it a few times over the years. Certainly there are strong benefactors but the % is low. They could make a difference, just as a louder collective voice. Then if we could have some of the extended UR family such as parents continue to have an active role long after those core 4-5 years it would make a huge difference, esp as a small selective private school. Just my 2 cents.
Lots of great points here.
I'd also like to add the devil's advocate view (which i don't necessarily believe, but i do understand). It goes something like this...
"We made the National Semifinals last year and might have gotten farther if not for Lauletta's shoulder. We might go on a deep run this year. If we don't, it's going to be because of Lauletta's knee. We are one of the premiere programs in the CAA, which is one of the best leagues in the FCS, no matter what Rocco says about our vision or lack thereof. We pay one of the top salaries for a head coach in all of FCS but don't have a huge following. How much more money do i need to pump into this thing to demonstrate vision?"
Again, i want to win the National Championship every year and i believe the University does too. But we all need to be realistic about some things.
GK - just a note - there are efforts to better engage the football alumni and with better engagement should come more widespread support. I don't have any specific numbers but my sense agrees with what you have heard that football support, both monetarily and as a voice could be a benefit.
Just wanted to let the board know efforts are underway and have been for a while.
Just wanted to let the board know efforts are underway and have been for a while.
First of all, thank you for your comments. Secondly, welcome to this board. It looks like you have some inside knowledge and the type of information you have provided is always welcome by everyone on this board. I hope you will continue to post your opinions and knowledge about the program.
That said, I have to disagree with you on a few issues. One, I do not think that the most of the football players feel as though they are second-class citizens. I know a few who consider themselves very fortunate to have their way paid to attend a fairly prestigious private university and who appreciate that in their lives after football they will have in hand a degree which will open many doors for them. Several student-athletes that I know, or know of, especially through Twitter and other social media, also consider themselves fortunate to continue to compete in a sport which they love. Most that I talk with also feel that they are regarded in high esteem by their classmates, particularly those of the opposite sex. I know that there are exceptions, particularly among the newer student-athletes, but I view these as temporary and as a necessary part of the transition from high school to a new and different world. It takes time, but most all adjust very well.
Secondly, I have not seen any evidence of low morale, though I have witnessed disappointment when performance does not live up to their expectations or when they have not yet shown that they have advanced to the level where they can have meaningful participation. If you watch the interviews or read what the athletes say on the athletics site, it would seem that the most all of them come to regard their experience at Richmond in this light. This may be an act, but if so, they have certainly fooled me.
Do we need to make some changes in both tangible and intangible assets available to the coaches and athletes? No doubt. I am absolutely on board with you in this regard. However, often things like this are from time to time neglected. They go unnoticed and unappreciated until an incident such as that now before us with Coach Rocco arises. It is just a matter of not paying enough attention or keeping abreast with the constant need to update and add. I am sure it happens at most schools. I would also think that it also often takes an event such as the recent announcement of Coach Rocco indicating his dissatisfaction and the need for an articulated vision in order to bring about such change.
While I cannot argue with much of what you say, I can and do take a totally different view with respect to your conclusion as to what is happening now at Richmond and the state of affairs with respect to our football program. Unlike you and many others on this board, I feel that Coach Rocco's statement and position with respect to the state of the program has brought about or will bring about a necessary and positive change providing the program with many of the things which you point out are needed...and then some. I can not speak with any specificity as to coach's motives, but I believe wholeheartedly that the changes that will inevitably occur because of his position and statement are positive for our football program. From what I know of the man, I suspect he took this into account before he made his statement.
I look at this whole situation as analogous to growing pains which, by definition, result in growth. This is the time for growth at UR and the time to address the problems which exist. I do not for an instant agree with those who feel that we are on the brink of disaster or any such nonsense.
Again, thanks for your comments. I look forward to reading your continuing input.
This just came to me and I have absolutely no basis in fact or rumor to suggest it as true, but is there a chance that DR's unhappiness with the treatment of the Lax program is in any way related to announcement that the Lax team will have its offices in the proposed new addition to the Press Box at Robins Stadium? I was just thinking that the new addition below the Press Box might easily be considered more appropriate for use as offices by the Football program.
Anyone have any insight into this as a possibility for DR's dissatisfaction?
Anyone have any insight into this as a possibility for DR's dissatisfaction?
I would be surprised if this is a big issue because the Football office space was just redone in the Robins Center in the last few years (2013-2014).
I am one of those people that stayed around and love it. I recall when the recruits from 2005 all was in a funk. They all thought they should have been at the bigger schools and programs. When they woke up and realized how fortunate they were, well they made history.
Not one of them today do not speak highly of their school or the experience. If you act first class then being thought of second class does not worry you. There is life after football. Sometimes in life things may not be fair.
Not one of them today do not speak highly of their school or the experience. If you act first class then being thought of second class does not worry you. There is life after football. Sometimes in life things may not be fair.
First off, my bad on implying the program hasn't had success when in fact it hit the pinnacle in 2008 and has a long history prior to that of success
My point was that it is currently positioned for a sustained ride partly because of continuity from its HC, who I thought would have probably not get too many attractive offers from FBS jobs (current trend is for younger guys or bigger schools coordinators)and he would have presumably stayed here for awhile, in theory anyway...so much for that
Secondly, I'm a new guy but I'm with you when you say we need ongoing and growing support for the program. I intend to be a spider football fan and supporter from here on out not just until your favorite player/s leave.
However a point that I do stick to my guns on is the way the kids are treated by their peers at the school . I really think alum and local turnout/support is very good and I really enjoy coming and seeing the stadium with good crowds. But what is telling ,and this is tangible, is the lack of students at the games. The players love that us old guys and families come to the game but it does effect them to see lack of support from their peers and that especially comes to light when a JMU shows up. We don't even get the frats and sororities to come out. Really disappointing!
And yes ALL the players are greatful for the great education at the school , many had choices where to go and some bypassed bigger football schools for a better education which will help them later in life
With that said these guys are low man in the totem and for most of them it wasn't what they expected ... so final point i hope we can all agree on is let's make sure we all support these kids in every way we can whom ever the coach is!
Guys this is a great forum and really enjoy your comments and opinions
Looking forward to the watching a game tomorrow !
My point was that it is currently positioned for a sustained ride partly because of continuity from its HC, who I thought would have probably not get too many attractive offers from FBS jobs (current trend is for younger guys or bigger schools coordinators)and he would have presumably stayed here for awhile, in theory anyway...so much for that
Secondly, I'm a new guy but I'm with you when you say we need ongoing and growing support for the program. I intend to be a spider football fan and supporter from here on out not just until your favorite player/s leave.
However a point that I do stick to my guns on is the way the kids are treated by their peers at the school . I really think alum and local turnout/support is very good and I really enjoy coming and seeing the stadium with good crowds. But what is telling ,and this is tangible, is the lack of students at the games. The players love that us old guys and families come to the game but it does effect them to see lack of support from their peers and that especially comes to light when a JMU shows up. We don't even get the frats and sororities to come out. Really disappointing!
And yes ALL the players are greatful for the great education at the school , many had choices where to go and some bypassed bigger football schools for a better education which will help them later in life
With that said these guys are low man in the totem and for most of them it wasn't what they expected ... so final point i hope we can all agree on is let's make sure we all support these kids in every way we can whom ever the coach is!
Guys this is a great forum and really enjoy your comments and opinions
Looking forward to the watching a game tomorrow !
The program has come a long way and I believe the University wants to remain competitive with other contending FCS schools.
We had to carpool, in full pads, from the Robins Center to the River Road side of campus for practice every day. If you were a freshman and they felt like lightly hazing you they'd make you hoof it across campus.Then it's back into the cars in your sweaty, muddy gear. And by the way, we were practicing in cleats on soft grass fields for home games played in sneakers on the hard carpet of City Stadium (no wonder our timing was always off). Now that is not a program that wants to compete for national championships.
I don't believe the athletes are treated as second class citizens. They may not be deified like they would be at a P5 school, but those aren't the athletes that are drawn to FCS football at UR. There have always been those professors, students and administrators who take a dim view of athletes, and always will be. Let the short-sighted or closed-minded live in their bubble; there are plenty of well-rounded folks on and off campus, and alumni that are more than willing to hire those who wore the Spider uniform. I guarantee you that KL is a BMOC, just as the QB is wont to be at most schools.
The football alumni engagement efforts are certainly going to help, but it won't move the needle much - it's not as though we have a s-ton of NFL alumni pumping support towards the program. The apathetic student body doesn't care that the alumni wish they'd better support the team. The attendance bothers the players - that's a fact. We get far more students at basketball games on weeknights.
We had to carpool, in full pads, from the Robins Center to the River Road side of campus for practice every day. If you were a freshman and they felt like lightly hazing you they'd make you hoof it across campus.Then it's back into the cars in your sweaty, muddy gear. And by the way, we were practicing in cleats on soft grass fields for home games played in sneakers on the hard carpet of City Stadium (no wonder our timing was always off). Now that is not a program that wants to compete for national championships.
I don't believe the athletes are treated as second class citizens. They may not be deified like they would be at a P5 school, but those aren't the athletes that are drawn to FCS football at UR. There have always been those professors, students and administrators who take a dim view of athletes, and always will be. Let the short-sighted or closed-minded live in their bubble; there are plenty of well-rounded folks on and off campus, and alumni that are more than willing to hire those who wore the Spider uniform. I guarantee you that KL is a BMOC, just as the QB is wont to be at most schools.
The football alumni engagement efforts are certainly going to help, but it won't move the needle much - it's not as though we have a s-ton of NFL alumni pumping support towards the program. The apathetic student body doesn't care that the alumni wish they'd better support the team. The attendance bothers the players - that's a fact. We get far more students at basketball games on weeknights.
I think it's mostly to do with the current trend in PC culture and the recent issues coming form title ix at the school
Football players are low hanging fruit in that culture
But to answer your question , if I were to guess, its think some overt gestures from the Presidents office might be helpful to start.
Always Starts at the top
Football players are low hanging fruit in that culture
But to answer your question , if I were to guess, its think some overt gestures from the Presidents office might be helpful to start.
Always Starts at the top
Let's face facts here. We have never gotten a lot of support of the sports programs from the student body. Our school is small, we don't really have a sports culture here, and many of the students would just as soon spend their time studying than watching a game (football, basketball, LAX, etc.). Most of the fans are alums. I believe it has been that way for a long time.
My general feeling is that the Spider athletes get good treatment from the student body and the faculty. I see faculty at many of the sports events I go to.
I think the problem is in the Robins Center offices and the general administration of the University not really getting behind the programs like they should. I feel like many in the administration would like to see us in the PL, and that's exactly what will happen if we continue on the current path.
My general feeling is that the Spider athletes get good treatment from the student body and the faculty. I see faculty at many of the sports events I go to.
I think the problem is in the Robins Center offices and the general administration of the University not really getting behind the programs like they should. I feel like many in the administration would like to see us in the PL, and that's exactly what will happen if we continue on the current path.
Have enjoyed Philly's and Florida's comments in this thread and believe both are generally correct in what they hear. I've heard the same, plus the Broaddus situation has been an aggravating factor. I have also heard that big, traditional donors are stepping up to try to salvage what has turned into a bad and embarrassing situation. It may be too late, but I believe the effort is being made.
Who??
Way too early for this discussion...might not even occur at all if both parties can come to an agreement. But my way too early top 5:
Russ Huesman
Russ Huesman
Russ Huesman
Russ Huesman
Russ Huesman
Henderson is my old high school coach and he played fullback for UR in the 90's
Russ was here under a different administration, so he would be coming back to a different president, AD, etc. Also, UTC is his alma mater. I just don't see it happening.
gohens.net
The buzz has really quieted down over there - has not been a comment on DR since Tuesday.
They have a snazzy new AD - Lady from Michigan which is cool but they have a dumpster fire going over there with their program - low attendance, cutting donation requirements for premium seats, nothing really much to offer and NO VISION. Info based on some of the threads over there.
The buzz has really quieted down over there - has not been a comment on DR since Tuesday.
They have a snazzy new AD - Lady from Michigan which is cool but they have a dumpster fire going over there with their program - low attendance, cutting donation requirements for premium seats, nothing really much to offer and NO VISION. Info based on some of the threads over there.
They have problems and, like ours now, they started above the football program and festered their way down over time.
But right now, their vision is restored and clear. They firmly believe its their inalienable RIGHT to be a Top 5 FSC program every single year and win a National Championship 2-3 out of every say 10 years. The new Pres. and the AD are fully onboard and more importantly they understand that the previous Admins there failed because football failed and that for their administration to succeed generally, football needs to succeed.
Football's importance at UR has never been what it is/was at UD. But their commitment now can best be described as "whatever it takes - - and give 'em 2 of whatever it takes just to be sure" ! Whoever coaches there will be given more then every chance to succeed. Given Danny's track record, he's a mortal lock to be hugely successful there. And that's why UD wants him so badly. Being committed and providing everything needed doesn't actually guarantee success. You still have to give all that to the right guy. They feel like they KNOW Danny can do what they want while others (Power 5 coordinators, smaller school Head Coach etc.) are all risks. Danny is not a risk and he's 1 of only like 2-3 guys that they can say that about and he surely the only one available. Its hard for me to imagine us winning Danny back at this point because I suspect UD had promised more than he ever dreamed to ask UR for.
Wow, just catching up on all of this. What a wide ranging group of opinions. A few points that I might weigh in on:
Student support sucks, don't know why but maybe these really smart kids from all over the world don't know or care about football, maybe they are studying, playing video games or on Facebook? some of all of this? I do think the administration is trying to get them there as I know my son tells me they will have special dinners at Robins Center for certain basketball games to entice the kids a bit. They also have drawings and contests etc. for both sports so there is some effort, but clearly not working for football.
Facilities are needed despite a good looking stadium, the locker room and weight rooms are lacking when compared to some programs and basketball, LAX and perhaps others are perceived by the athletes to get more gear. This might be a numbers thing? Hopefully DR was asking for more support in these areas? As to summer school, I am not sure about the costs, but they had a large group there all last Summer.
PC, Title nine and the Trump wave of populism are all related in my opinion. No one knows what happens in a room with 2 people in it except the 2 people, so why does this drag on for years and impact many levels of the school? Administration indecision? What is the real administration support of football? Whether this incident is being laid on the "pampered football player" or what, don't know? Surely with our own law school, we can get enough lawyers to resolve this once and for all. My guess is that this very serious issue is being linked to other incidents and issues across the country for whatever reason and no one around UR will stop it. My guess is many faculty members have differing views, so it drags on.
Student support sucks, don't know why but maybe these really smart kids from all over the world don't know or care about football, maybe they are studying, playing video games or on Facebook? some of all of this? I do think the administration is trying to get them there as I know my son tells me they will have special dinners at Robins Center for certain basketball games to entice the kids a bit. They also have drawings and contests etc. for both sports so there is some effort, but clearly not working for football.
Facilities are needed despite a good looking stadium, the locker room and weight rooms are lacking when compared to some programs and basketball, LAX and perhaps others are perceived by the athletes to get more gear. This might be a numbers thing? Hopefully DR was asking for more support in these areas? As to summer school, I am not sure about the costs, but they had a large group there all last Summer.
PC, Title nine and the Trump wave of populism are all related in my opinion. No one knows what happens in a room with 2 people in it except the 2 people, so why does this drag on for years and impact many levels of the school? Administration indecision? What is the real administration support of football? Whether this incident is being laid on the "pampered football player" or what, don't know? Surely with our own law school, we can get enough lawyers to resolve this once and for all. My guess is that this very serious issue is being linked to other incidents and issues across the country for whatever reason and no one around UR will stop it. My guess is many faculty members have differing views, so it drags on.
Amen, brother. Swamps need to be drained, walls need to be built and Gill and that dopey professor that posts the concussion articles here need their asses locked up.
Make Richmond Football Great Again.
