OT: Woj bomb!
- Thread starter Eight Legger
- Start date
Rothstein is easily the cringiest
He's also got the "Cringiest Dude Alive" market locked down, too.Rothstein has that market cornered.
More with Woj
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1. You can buy season tickets because they are so affordable and if you don't show for half of the games, you still feel like you are getting more than your moneys worth.
2. We overstate attendance, tickets sold vs. butts in the seat. Attendance for Saturday's game was listed at 5,500. That corresponds to a 3/4 full arena. The Robins Center was at most half full on Saturday (with a good showing from VMI fans as well).
3. We are very unique that we have a large population to draw from, cheap tickets, and no other competition from competing sporting events in the town. VCU has priced itself out of the casual/family market and they can because they win and demand for their tickets sets those prices. So, literally, you can't get a cheaper Saturday night entertainment than what we have going at the RC.
So, yes our attendance is pretty good if you look at the box scores of what we put out. But I'd like to see a comparison on revenue from ticket sales vs. other programs. Because I believe we simply low ball ticket prices to get people in the seats.
I couldn't care less about the revenue. We're not some poor program accepting every buy game just so we can afford new basketballs. Money isn't our issue. If we win enough, demand will improve. Until then, I don't care if we charge $1 per ticket. I want the best gameday experience possible.
Oh, I could care less about revenue as well. But you are right, if we win enough, demand will improve. Well, 20 years into the 56% experiment in winning says that isn't happening. Our attendance and ticket prices are just 2 more symptoms of the disease.
Also, don't forget we took about over 2,500 seats out of the Robins Center during Mooney's tenure as well, and still can't sell it out like we used to or charge the going rate for major D-1 college basketball.
Me too. Right now we have frequently malfunctioning video boards, misspelled players names, a losing team, and our halftime entertainment nearly every game is a scrimmage between 11 year olds. It's not a very captivating event to be a part of this season.
Also, while we are talking about game time experience. The sound system is terrible, everything sounds garbled/muffled. I used to think it was primarily the young lady who does our timeouts but it is pretty much everything that sounds muffled at this point.
When I called to order some extra tickets for the VMI game last week. I got the out of office message from the ticket office. It was conveying the ticket office was closed over Thanksgiving but it did inform me what I needed to do to order tickets to the football playoff game that took place 3 weeks ago.
But we have charter flights. But we can't spell check or update OOO messages. Wild. I can see some AD staffer read this board, see these criticisms, go up to Hardt to advise, and he looks at them with a glassy eyed look and nods.
Sure seems like working for UR in the athletic department is a quite a gig. No need to do anything other than the bare minimum. UR is ahead of the curve as the entitlement generation hits the workforce.
I do care about Revenue. But not to have more funds but to measure performance.
I'd like to see the A10 teams ranked by the combined revenue of (Ticket Sales + Seat Licenses + Post Season) over a rolling 6 seasons as a measure of success each year...
Woody, I get your point. And agree this should be a positive. But when u look at all the other mickey mouse stuff the program and pr team can't perform, the inability to draw fans at normal prices just becomes another area of underperformance.
I’m for ticket specials freebies etc. because atmosphere matters & u need to be concerned about building fanbase. Get butts in seats. Especially w our student profile.
The too hard excuses for cake eaters make me laugh overall but our small school is the most legit. Winning consistently is only way to overcome that disadvantage.
Which is another reason why the tethering to Moonicrity is odd. After 20 years shouldn’t we be ahead in this dept too? 20 years 1 guy. U would think atmosphere would be high. But again expectations never increase under Moon. 20 years facing vcu. Keep doing shitty. status quo is great. I feel like we have cheaper tix & best deals than anyone. On 1 hand funny to complain about that but the reverse means a much healthier & successful program.
Maybe the admin realizes they will never buy out a contract & it’s a wash. Eat lost revenue but make up for it by never having to tap into rainy day funds. Or maybe $$ really is a non issue except they still ask us for it.
The too hard excuses for cake eaters make me laugh overall but our small school is the most legit. Winning consistently is only way to overcome that disadvantage.
Which is another reason why the tethering to Moonicrity is odd. After 20 years shouldn’t we be ahead in this dept too? 20 years 1 guy. U would think atmosphere would be high. But again expectations never increase under Moon. 20 years facing vcu. Keep doing shitty. status quo is great. I feel like we have cheaper tix & best deals than anyone. On 1 hand funny to complain about that but the reverse means a much healthier & successful program.
Maybe the admin realizes they will never buy out a contract & it’s a wash. Eat lost revenue but make up for it by never having to tap into rainy day funds. Or maybe $$ really is a non issue except they still ask us for it.
Just wondering, what are "normal" prices? VCU's? I read earlier on this thread they were ridiculously expensive.
VCU tickets are more expensive - but their last home game, vs. William and Mary - they got 7367 fans per the box score.
Our attendance at the last home game vs. VMI was 5498 - so roughly 2000 less fans And we all know our number was inflated. I am guessing VCU may or may not need to inflate their number, but def not to the extent we do at UR.
At this point - I would make every single game on the schedule free for kids 12 and under. Draw families to the game, and make general admission 5 or 10 dollars depending on the game.
Our attendance at the last home game vs. VMI was 5498 - so roughly 2000 less fans And we all know our number was inflated. I am guessing VCU may or may not need to inflate their number, but def not to the extent we do at UR.
At this point - I would make every single game on the schedule free for kids 12 and under. Draw families to the game, and make general admission 5 or 10 dollars depending on the game.
We should charge $100 per ticket for kids this season. We don't want any impressionable kids watching this slop. They'll never come back!
Their official attendance was 7,637, which is a sellout. Butts in seats obviously less, but every seat was sold/distributed in some fashion.
you keep saying we inflate our numbers.
we record our attendance the same way I believe every other college basketball team does. we don't do a headcount. we don't walk through a turnstile counter.
I agree - we do it like other schools, but given we get little to zero student attendance, I am wondering how that is handled at UR. There have been times at UR games when the recorded attendance is way off - by over 1,000 at least than what is really there - and you can't say that is just because of season ticket holders or purchased tickets not showing up.
My point was I am sure VCU does the same - like the sell out vs. W&M, but I bet there were not 1000 empty seats, maybe at most (I don't know I was not there) 250. I just wonder if UR pushes the envelope, especially when it comes to students - because our attendance rarely matches at all what is actually there.
My point was I am sure VCU does the same - like the sell out vs. W&M, but I bet there were not 1000 empty seats, maybe at most (I don't know I was not there) 250. I just wonder if UR pushes the envelope, especially when it comes to students - because our attendance rarely matches at all what is actually there.
scanners r the new turnstile. Yep I'm sure we count tix distributed. but not all teams do that. idk but my guess is most. ncaa allows u to do it lots of ways. there really r not a lot of rules there. tix sold (or distributed), the turnstile (scans) even just estimates. if a team is looking to make a coaching change they can be motivated to report actual attendance. If a team is trying to prop up a coach, they def go tix distributed. it happens. generally most for pr reasons like the higher numbers reported, and then have a separate unreported private number for actual ticket revenue. esp at private UR who won't even disclose coaching contracts.
Also u can still inflate numbers. a school like UR over VCU may give out a lot more comped tickets. I'm not 100% certain but I believe u count tix distributed not "sold". That family section at UR home games may have a lot more comps. Or they comp more non profit groups. idk how it compares to other schools, but from being a close observer or Richmond for a long time I think we give out more comps. but guess what happens with comps. u get more no shows. if u buy a ticket u are more likely to use it. even our 5 & 10 buck specials. but even the cheap tix will also lead to higher rate of no shows.
The no show rate is pretty high for college bball at large. VCU will have no shows too. but if we distribute a lot more comps & those comps logically will have an even larger no show rate, our rate will be a lot higher than the average. My feeling is part of the discrepancy Trap mentions is related to that. Then throw in the really cheap tix (again I'm not against that at all) & u have a higher rate too.
student attendance is actually a lot easier to track these days at UR because I believe u scan your student ID. Back when I was in school u used to just flash your ID that's it.
Students have to claim tickets now, though seating remains first come, first served.
www.thecollegianur.com
Understanding UR’s new ticket system for sporting events
“I understand why they do it this way, but I think the old system is so much easier and less of a hassle,” Hurst said.
www.thecollegianur.com
Simply put. VCU is 15 minutes down the road - parking is probably worse, and the arena is probably not as nice as ours (in my opinion). Our tickets are cheaper, and in the A10 slate - we play the same teams. Yet they will get close to a sell out each night for tickets that start around 30-40 a ticket. We will be lucky to get 5000 most nights, and as mentioned - we comp tickets and charge 5-10 a ticket, have a nicer arena, and have an easier parking, etc.
Now I will just wait for someone to chime in that we have a smaller student body and alumni base because everyone leaves Richmond for the Northeast after they graduate. Yet - when we play games up in Philly, NY, etc - we still don't get good representation.
Point being - winning cures all.
I agree winning cures all. Tbf Trap a school 10x our size with 10x more connections not just alums is an undeniable advantage that makes much easier to sustain attendance. That can’t be dismissed.
But vcu didn’t always have that demand. Real success started it. We lose badly on built in customer base but we have/had advantages. Better league for a while, better history for a while. Better arena, more family friendly, cheaper tix. Deeper pockets to throw more $ at the program. So we have other advantages. But we abdicated those bc our admin & culture has been too accepting of not sustained or real success imo. 3 NCAAs in 20 years can’t build. Vcu running Richmond when we r 9-25 under Moon establishes the little brother vibe too. There have been opportunities but opportunities lost. Our ceiling for UR hoops is & has been higher but winning is indeed #1. Not 55% winning with our otherwise poor metrics. 20 years is a generation. It’s not personal with Mooney it’s 20 years tho. We know what we have. We don’t have to reinvent the wheel but u have to be willing to put in a new driver. It’s a concept that is beyond the powers to be at UR for strange reasons, tho many of us have hit on those reasons imo.
But vcu didn’t always have that demand. Real success started it. We lose badly on built in customer base but we have/had advantages. Better league for a while, better history for a while. Better arena, more family friendly, cheaper tix. Deeper pockets to throw more $ at the program. So we have other advantages. But we abdicated those bc our admin & culture has been too accepting of not sustained or real success imo. 3 NCAAs in 20 years can’t build. Vcu running Richmond when we r 9-25 under Moon establishes the little brother vibe too. There have been opportunities but opportunities lost. Our ceiling for UR hoops is & has been higher but winning is indeed #1. Not 55% winning with our otherwise poor metrics. 20 years is a generation. It’s not personal with Mooney it’s 20 years tho. We know what we have. We don’t have to reinvent the wheel but u have to be willing to put in a new driver. It’s a concept that is beyond the powers to be at UR for strange reasons, tho many of us have hit on those reasons imo.
Meaning we count up all the tickets that get scanned on entry? Or those plus the actual stubs from paper tickets if that’s still done?
There are clearly times where the actual attendance is far below what’s publicly stated, I think we can all agree on that. I have no idea if that’s common practice elsewhere but I suspect you’re right.
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