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My sources...

I can see schools reducing aid as you suggest. I just have no idea why they'd lower the sticker price for those who can afford it. really good schools have so many kids and their parents begging to pay whatever it takes to get in. the market allows them to charge $75k.
 
Agreed - no reason to drop sticker price if you can reduce aid and still get people to pay. The only way sticker prices start to fall is if the government gets out of the college loan game or reduces the loans it gives out and/or enrollments take a drastic hit over the next 2-3 years. Right now these are big unknowns, especially enrollments as schools really don't know how hard they will be hit with upcoming enrollments in the fall and beyond.
The reason college tuitions has risen so fast over the years is because the government has been giving out loans left and right to whoever wants them. So the schools caught on and said - why not charge more? IF the government will just fund the loans, its an unlimited supply from Uncle Sam. And this massive bubble has been created. Not sure if the bubble pops from COVID, but some air is being let out. And that trickle down effect with hit sports as well - mainly the expenses associated with these sports.
And schools like UR that provide their own aid - they will now have to decide how much aid going forward do they wish to give out. Schools will now need to plan for the next COVID like event and in order to be prepared for that- they need a pretty big rainy day fund. Only way to get that - get a lot of wealthy kids to pay close to sticker price for the next few years and build up that savings just in case.
 
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Here's an interesting one. Brown had one of the largest varsity athletic programs in the country with 38 sports, but they're demoting 11 of them to club status: M/W fencing, M/W golf, W skiing, M/W squash, W equestrian, and M track, field and cross country.

Coed sailing and women's sailing will be upgraded from club to varsity, however.

And interestingly, they say they're not going to reduce the number of recruited varsity athletes overall, so they're going to "right-size" rosters across the remaining sports. They say this isn't a budget-cutting move.

https://brownbears.com/news/2020/5/...ness-in-brown-varsity-and-club-athletics.aspx
 
seems like nothing to do with Covid at Brown. no budget changes. strange they see a need to raise Sailing to varsity level. maybe someone made a big donation with contingencies.
 
spiderman said:
seems like nothing to do with Covid at Brown. no budget changes. strange they see a need to raise Sailing to varsity level. maybe someone made a big donation with contingencies.
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Could be a donor initiative, or perhaps they just recognize that it's an opportunity to be extremely competitive (though they already are as a club sport) given their location.

Here's their rationale:
Brown’s sailing program is one of the oldest and most successful collegiate sailing programs in the country. The current team is consistently ranked within the Top 10 in the country, racing in the highly competitive New England District of College Sailing. In 2019, the Bears won the College Sailing Women's National Championship, was ranked No. 1 nationally and finished fifth at the Coed Dinghy National Championship.

Since coming to Brown in 1999, head coach John Mollicone has coached 74 All-Americans, 85 Academic All-Americans, 109 All-New England Sailors and has led the Bears to 67 National Championship appearances. During this time, the team has finished Top Five at 30 National Championships and has won 16 New England Championships and eight Atlantic Coast Championships and Fall Showcases. The Sailing program operates out of the newly built Ted Turner ’60 Sailing Pavilion, which is part of the Edgewood Yacht Club.
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https://athletics-excellence.brown.edu/faqs
 
learn something new every day. didn't know college sailing was a thing. I see 15 D1 schools have it as a varsity sport, most with scholarships. another 15 D3 schools have it.
 
SFspidur said:
Here's an interesting one. Brown had one of the largest varsity athletic programs in the country with 38 sports, but they're demoting 11 of them to club status: M/W fencing, M/W golf, W skiing, M/W squash, W equestrian, and M track, field and cross country.

Coed sailing and women's sailing will be upgraded from club to varsity, however.

And interestingly, they say they're not going to reduce the number of recruited varsity athletes overall, so they're going to "right-size" rosters across the remaining sports. They say this isn't a budget-cutting move.

https://brownbears.com/news/2020/5/...ness-in-brown-varsity-and-club-athletics.aspx
Click to expand...
I'm down for some coed sailing.
 
spiderman said:
learn something new every day. didn't know college sailing was a thing. I see 15 D1 schools have it as a varsity sport, most with scholarships. another 15 D3 schools have it.
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I would have to imagine a sailing team is a very attractive sport if you are trolling for big time donors.
 
SFspidur said:
Here's an interesting one. Brown had one of the largest varsity athletic programs in the country with 38 sports, but they're demoting 11 of them to club status: M/W fencing, M/W golf, W skiing, M/W squash, W equestrian, and M track, field and cross country.

Coed sailing and women's sailing will be upgraded from club to varsity, however.

And interestingly, they say they're not going to reduce the number of recruited varsity athletes overall, so they're going to "right-size" rosters across the remaining sports. They say this isn't a budget-cutting move.

https://brownbears.com/news/2020/5/...ness-in-brown-varsity-and-club-athletics.aspx
Click to expand...
Not sure if you read this in detail, but how is the school going to survive without the following varsity level sports?

1. men’s and women’s fencing,
2. women’s skiing,
3. men’s and women’s squash,
4. women’s equestrian.
 
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what exactly would the difference be in varsity women's equestrian and club level women's equestrian?
do you have to supply your own horse at the club level?
 
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I mean, it's going to be similar to other sports, right? Varsity gets potential scholarships, university-funded equipment and travel, dedicated coaching, etc., administered by the athletic department. Club sports typically fall under a university recreation department, require student fees, might have a volunteer coach or might not, etc.

I believe horses are generally provided at both levels.
 
so it's a huge deal going down to club level for those sports. cost-wise ... especially for equestrian.
 
Bowling Green alumni and boosters raised $1.5 million in commitments to save the baseball program.

 
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But do they need a women’s sport to balance it out for title IX?

I know when soccer was cut UR that a bunch of alumni pooled together money and were basically told no amount would save the program. Not sure how much they were able to raise as I think everything has a price - even at UR - but this is good to see at BGSU. I like more sports not less.
 
Soccer was cut to make room for lacrosse, so that's where the Title IX issue was...having both without another women's sport would have pushed things out of balance.

Baseball at BGSU was cut for budget reasons, so bringing it back just restores the gender balance to what it has been. I don't know how close to parity they have been.
 
SFspidur said:
Soccer was cut to make room for lacrosse, so that's where the Title IX issue was...having both without another women's sport would have pushed things out of balance.

Baseball at BGSU was cut for budget reasons, so bringing it back just restores the gender balance to what it has been. I don't know how close to parity they have been.
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Would Bowling Green have to cut a women's sport if baseball was cut.? Just curious how that would have worked.
 
97spiderfan said:
Would Bowling Green have to cut a women's sport if baseball was cut.? Just curious how that would have worked.
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Not necessarily, but they might need to reduce scholarships in the women's programs, in order to provide equal opportunities. They could spread it among the sports. At least that is my understanding; there are others here more versed in Title IX.
 
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BGSU's full-time undergrad student body is split 56.5%/43.5% female to male.

On a participation basis, females have 50.5% of slots with baseball intact. Dropping baseball would have increased that to 54.8%.

Financial aid dollars with baseball intact are split 60/40 in favor of males at BGSU, but parity would be 55/45 in favor of males. (Financial aid calculations are based on unduplicated athletes, not participation slots, so things come out differently...a female athlete who runs XC, indoor track, and outdoor track counts as three participation slots but only one athlete for financial aid calculations. BG only offers women's XC/T&F, and that's where the vast majority of double or triple counting occurs.)

So cutting just baseball and leaving everything else the same would actually have helped bring them more in compliance. I don't know if restoring baseball after it's been cut could have any impact.
 
The thing with Title IX is that you don't need to be compliant day 1 when you make changes or cuts. I heard this from a VCU athletic administrator years ago when they were considering adding football and asked what women's sports would you add - and he stated those would be added slowly. Basically - as long as you make progress, even just a little, year to year - you don't have to be fully up to speed with Title IX right away.
I guess you could also alter your student population in that time as well. Maybe shift towards a slight majority of male students over female to sway the balance in that direction for sports.
 
SFspidur said:
Yep, all 16 VCU players are international as well.

For reference, 6 of UR's 10 women are international, while none of the 10 men are.
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When I went to UR I don’t remember ever meeting any international male tennis players but I remember meeting multiple female tennis players
 
I don't know what the scholarship situation is for our tennis programs these days, but I suspect our women have more resources than the men. Women's tennis is a headcount sport (all scholarships must be full rides) with a maximum of 8, while men's tennis is an equivalency sport (schollies can be divided) with a maximum of 4.5.

I don't know if those differences affect our ability to recruit internationally, or maybe it's just a philosophical difference for the head coaches.
 
SFspidur said:
I don't know what the scholarship situation is for our tennis programs these days, but I suspect our women have more resources than the men. Women's tennis is a headcount sport (all scholarships must be full rides) with a maximum of 8, while men's tennis is an equivalency sport (schollies can be divided) with a maximum of 4.5.

I don't know if those differences affect our ability to recruit internationally, or maybe it's just a philosophical difference for the head coaches.
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We essentially don’t recruit internationally for men’s tennis. IIRC Ben Johnson told me when he was coach he only had one scholarship to work with. On top of that I believe every other men’s school in the A10 does offer the full 4.5 scholarships. Essentially he has none when the tuition is 60k and divided up. Don’t quote me but I think the transition away from fully funding MT happened when we switched from the CAA.

Women’s tennis has their full allotment and have a tradition of a mix of international and domestic players. Men’s tennis is almost always domestic at UR or a predominantly domestic roster.

Absent a indoor facility and scholarships, it’s amazing the mileage we have gotten out of men’s tennis program.
 
My understanding was that men’s golf and tennis lost all of their scholarships back in ‘99 when swimming and water polo got cut, but they only had like 2 each to begin with.

Just didn’t know if they’d been able to get any back since then.

I’d be surprised if women’s tennis gets all 8 allowed by the NCAA. Most of our smaller sports are not at the max.
 
Article says there were 47 participants in women's rowing.

There were 29 in men's swimming, probably around 10 in tennis, and maybe around the same for XC? XC is harder to tell since it overlaps with T&F.
 
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