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Dayton game observations

97spiderfan

97spiderfan

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Feb 2, 2005
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Tons of good observations and reflections in the game thread but here are a few of mine.

1. Our defense makes other teams play our game. Dayton is a Top 20 team and their offense was completely disrupted for 40 mintues by our defense. Our guys (every single one) works so hard on defense to work off of screens and cuts and stay in front of their man. Simply outstanding and it has to be so frustrating for the other team to not be able to establish any rhythm.
2. Holmes: We reduced the a 6'10 national player of the year candidate to shooting 3's from 30 feet. Again, our defense--elite. Was he scared of Quinn or something?
3. Two front-runners for A-10 POY head to head: Holmes is probably still in the lead but King certainly got the best of him yesterday. And if you are looking for a statement play POY its King hitting the game sealing bucket over Holmes.
4. Player of the game: Entire starting 5. They all made big plays at key times and I think every player had a nice counterpunch on offense every time Dayton made a bucket. But if I had to name one player it is Dji Bailey. His defense is elite and he made big play after big play all game long. He picked up big fouls with his drives on Santos and Holmes and the dunks were emphatic statements. Such a swiss army knife of good plays on both ends.
5. D-Lo: I think it has been underappreciated how good he is and such an unselfish compliment to King. He made some huge plays, the step back 3, the drive to the hole and 1 in the second half. Have to wonder what our record is, if he doesn't get hurt.
6. Bigs 15 rebounds. Are you serious?

Electric atmosphere, students were awesome. When full the Robins Center is an intimidating place to play our home court. This team is really good but what makes them special to me is they work their ass*s off the entire game and they carry themselves with a confidence level that I think is intimidating to play against. Every time, it seems a team makes a big play on us, we answer immediately.
 
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97spiderfan said:
Tons of good observations and reflections in the game thread but here are a few of mine.

1. Our defense makes other teams play our game. Dayton is a Top 20 team and their offense was completely disrupted for 40 mintues by our defense. Our guys (every single one) works so hard on defense to work off of screens and cuts and stay in front of their man. Simply outstanding and it has to be so frustrating for the other team to not be able to establish any rhythm.
2. Holmes: We reduced the a 6'10 national player of the year candidate to shooting 3's from 30 feet. Again, our defense--elite. Was he scared of Quinn or something?
3. Two front-runners for A-10 POY head to head: Holmes is probably still in the lead but King certainly got the best of him yesterday. And if you are looking for a statement play POY its King hitting the game sealing bucket over Holmes.
4. Player of the game: Entire starting 5. They all made big plays at key times and I think every player had a nice counterpunch on offense every time Dayton made a bucket. But if I had to name one player it is Dji Bailey. His defense is elite and he made big play after big play all game long. He picked up big fouls with his drives on Santos and Holmes and the dunks were emphatic statements. Such a swiss army knife of good plays on both ends.
5. D-Lo: I think it has been underappreciated how good he is and such an unselfish compliment to King. He made some huge plays, the step back 3, the drive to the hole and 1 in the second half. Have to wonder what our record is, if he doesn't get hurt.
6. Bigs 15 rebounds. Are you serious?

Electric atmosphere, students were awesome. When full the Robins Center is an intimidating place to play our home court. This team is really good but what makes them special to me is they work their ass*s off the entire game and they carry themselves with a confidence level that I think is intimidating to play against. Every time, it seems a team makes a big play on us, we answer immediately.
Click to expand...
Gritty.
 
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From the time we were down 9-0 to the 2:52 mark of the 2nd half, when they scored 6 quick points, we out scored them by 18 points and completely dominated a majority of the game.

We are going to have to probably beat them again in the A10 tournament and be prepared for a lot of adjustments. I would expect much more driving to the basket from them.
 
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I think we got a little lucky - especially early. But when you are looking at playing a top 20 team on your home floor and the current winning streak - you need some luck. I think Dayton had good looks in the first half, where they really could have built a nice lead - but they didn't make any. They shot 19 overall and 18% from deep in the first half. We were not much better, but their poor shooting allowed us to stay close and make a run later in the half to take a 5 point lead into halftime. If Dayton hits their shots, its likely they enter halftime up 10. Other big factor - getting Holmes in foul trouble. Not sure how many other games that has happened to him - but it was a big factor.

Again - I still think UR won the game, not Dayton losing it. We tried to give it back to them at the end with missed free throws, bad rebounding, and fouling late on drives - but they hung on and won the game . In any win streak - your going to need some luck, and we just happened to get it at the right time.

Now - if the Spiders can finish in the top 4 and King keeps playing like he had - look out - Mooney will be A10 coach of the year and King A10 POY. Let the lifetime contract begin.
 
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SpiderTrap said:
I think we got a little lucky - especially early. But when you are looking at playing a top 20 team on your home floor and the current winning streak - you need some luck. I think Dayton had good looks in the first half, where they really could have built a nice lead - but they didn't make any. They shot 19 overall and 18% from deep in the first half. We were not much better, but their poor shooting allowed us to stay close and make a run later in the half to take a 5 point lead into halftime. If Dayton hits their shots, its likely they enter halftime up 10. Other big factor - getting Holmes in foul trouble. Not sure how many other games that has happened to him - but it was a big factor.

Again - I still think UR won the game, not Dayton losing it. We tried to give it back to them at the end with missed free throws, bad rebounding, and fouling late on drives - but they hung on and won the game . In any win streak - your going to need some luck, and we just happened to get it at the right time.

Now - if the Spiders can finish in the top 4 and King keeps playing like he had - look out - Mooney will be A10 coach of the year and King A10 POY. Let the lifetime contract begin.
Click to expand...
Luck - When preparedness meets opportunity.
If Mooney continues to put teams like this on the court, he will be justifying his stay. Maybe the changing landscape of college athletics better suits his skills or forces him to change.
 
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SpiderTrap said:
I think we got a little lucky - especially early. But when you are looking at playing a top 20 team on your home floor and the current winning streak - you need some luck. I think Dayton had good looks in the first half, where they really could have built a nice lead - but they didn't make any. They shot 19 overall and 18% from deep in the first half. We were not much better, but their poor shooting allowed us to stay close and make a run later in the half to take a 5 point lead into halftime. If Dayton hits their shots, its likely they enter halftime up 10. Other big factor - getting Holmes in foul trouble. Not sure how many other games that has happened to him - but it was a big factor.

Again - I still think UR won the game, not Dayton losing it. We tried to give it back to them at the end with missed free throws, bad rebounding, and fouling late on drives - but they hung on and won the game . In any win streak - your going to need some luck, and we just happened to get it at the right time.

Now - if the Spiders can finish in the top 4 and King keeps playing like he had - look out - Mooney will be A10 coach of the year and King A10 POY. Let the lifetime contract begin.
Click to expand...

In the treasure trove of stupid, ridiculous dumb SpiderTrap "takes", this one takes the cake.
 
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I watched the game again. There were several calls by the refs that really could have affected the game. With 1:07 left, Bailey's layup was blocked. It was clearly goal tending by Holmes. The two fouls on Quinn in the last fifty seconds were incorrect. Bailey was srambling for the ball, the ball went straight up, Bailey was knocked on the floor. The Dayton guy fell on top of Bailey and he traveled. Instead they called Bailey for a foul. Those were 8 points that went against us.
 
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Gallipoli said:
I watched the game again. There were several calls by the refs that really could have affected the game. With 1:07 left, Bailey's layup was blocked. It was clearly goal tending by Holmes. The two fouls on Quinn in the last fifty seconds were incorrect. Bailey was srambling for the ball, the ball went straight up, Bailey was knocked on the floor. The Dayton guy fell on top of Bailey and he traveled. Instead they called Bailey for a foul. Those were 8 points that went against us.
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I still don’t think the ball was going down on the Bailey block that they called a goaltending on. Tie goes to the blocker, right?

10 points.

I thought it was terrible officiating. Let the boys play.
 
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Long Island Spiders said:
I still don’t think the ball was going down on the Bailey block that they called a goaltending on. Tie goes to the blocker, right?

10 points.

I thought it was terrible officiating. Let the boys play.
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I had a whole paragraph on the officiating calls and how horrible that second half was and completely differently called than the first half.

Also, we were not "lucky". If anything, we had a lot of good shots not fall for us in the first half (Dayton is a really good defensive team as well). Dayton had to work for every single bucket because our defense was so suffocating.
 
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Dayton did not have our scouting report.

This was how Dayton saw how the Spiders played their star DaRon Holmes...

The quickness was all on the other side of the ball except maybe Bennett. Many times yesterday DH would get the ball out by the 3 pt line - and it appeared to me there was a path to the rim in an iso and he did not even attempt it. Not sure why.might have been the game plan called for something else. If that was the case…where was anyone else cutting off an off-the-ball screen for an easy bucket?

DH wasn’t hitting for 3 yesterday. That happens to every great player now and then. In the NBA you have to take advantage of iso opportunities. Keep working on the 3, but time to really work on beating your guy to the rim one-on-one. He needs to go when the opportunity presents itself. Let’s see that quickness in both decision and execution. He needs to look at Obi’s highlight clip from the last Suns game. It’s something Obi needed to learn and execute too.

The team wakes up in 2nd place this morning. We will drop in the rankings, but there were several ranked teams that got beat this week. I’m interested to see how this team bounces back and competes for a championship playing from behind.

Richmond Game Thoughts - UDPride Discussion Forums

Richmond Game Thoughts Mens Basketball
www.udpride.com
 
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I think you can have it both ways. You can still play really good defense and have the opponent have an even worse than usual shooting night when they are faced with good defense (I feel like we have been on the receiving end of that in the past).

So yes, early on, I commented to the people I was watching with that we were "lucky" their shots were not falling. Since that continued throughout the game, it became clear that the "luck" was at least partially attributable to our stellar defense.
 
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Long Island Spiders said:
I still don’t think the ball was going down on the Bailey block that they called a goaltending on. Tie goes to the blocker, right?

10 points.

I thought it was terrible officiating. Let the boys play.
Click to expand...
Agree with you and G…some terrible calls. I would say Dayton got some bad ones too but that isn’t why they lost the game. Our defense is elite and we could make a case that our 5 starters should be on all conf teams and all def teams. This team doesn’t panic and doesn’t/hasn’t let up on defense. Myself and a couple of parents were talking when we were in Florida this could be a special team in terms of the A10. Still a ways to go but let’s take it one game at a time. Let’s start with Fordham and then let’s make some ram stew😂! 🕷️🏀 Oh and a shameless dad plug, I’ll put Dji up defensively against any guard/wing in the A10 😀
 
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Sdad, sorry to hear it and my condolences to your whole family.

On bball, there was one block by UD where it appeared clean bc ball was still going up, except that the ball had already hit the backboard. Needless to say the shot had no chance of going in but it still is a goaltend if it has hit the backboard.

Disagree with Trap on how/why the game went as it did. UR defense took Dayton out of its offensive gameplan. We didn't dig on Holmes in the post and let Neal play him straight up, in order to challenge all 3 point shots, and our defenders did just that. Contested 3s are way harder than open 3s, quite obviously. Then Holmes was the one open at the 3 point line and he just kept bricking. It's not his game. His % may have been good coming in, but it was on low volume.

Good defending makes the opponent think it was them just missing shots, but great contests on shots and forcing them into non-optimal shots to begin with are hallmarks of great defenses (along with strong defensive rebounding.). UR got UD to shoot much tougher shots. Unsurprisingly, they missed most of them. UD didn't just miss shots on which they normally shoot 50%. It was the UR defense.

The one time I thought UD may have figured something out was when they were using Neal's man to pick the PG and we were still switching Neal on him, and they got 2 or 3 in a row in that mismatch. But UR adjusted back.

FT rebounding was rough in 2nd half especially.
 
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Neal's defense has gotten so much better in his time here. credit to the coaches ... and obviously to Neal himself. his feet are much better. a 7 footer is one thing, but a 7 footer with good feet is a real problem.
and we put 4 guys around him who are quick, instinctive, and busting their butts.
 
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I don’t think we got lucky either. We outplayed Dayton. Now I do admit we’ve had some lucky breaks during the a10 streak but I didn’t see it Sat night. In fact I think we got unlucky at a key spot. We were up 9 got the rebound but we accidentally fumbled ball to Holmes. He was fouled made 1st missed 2nd got board then drilled a 3. 4 pt swing. Then we had the 5 second turnover. It went from up 9 w ball & game likely over & potentially a double digit win helping the metrics to a mini disaster and UD right back in the game.
 
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y
GKiller said:
I don’t think we got lucky either. We outplayed Dayton. Now I do admit we’ve had some lucky breaks during the a10 streak but I didn’t see it Sat night. In fact I think we got unlucky at a key spot. We were up 9 got the rebound but we accidentally fumbled ball to Holmes. He was fouled made 1st missed 2nd got board then drilled a 3. 4 pt swing. Then we had the 5 second turnover. It went from up 9 w ball & game likely over & potentially a double digit win helping the metrics to a mini disaster and UD right back in the game.
Click to expand...
yep - other than the 9-0 start this quick stretch was the scariest part of the night in some ways
 
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brooklyn brownstone said:
On bball, there was one block by UD where it appeared clean bc ball was still going up, except that the ball had already hit the backboard. Needless to say the shot had no chance of going in but it still is a goaltend if it has hit the backboard.
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That one jumped out at me as well. The block definitely came after it hit the backboard, so the question comes down to whether the ball still had a possibility of entering the basket. I don't think there was a zero chance, so you have to call the goaltend there.

The exact NCAA rule:

"When the ball contacts the backboard and any part of the ball is above the rim during a field goal attempt, it is considered to be on its downward flight. In such a case, it is goaltending when the ball is touched by a player as long as it has a possibility of entering the basket."
 
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SpiderDad75 said:
Agree with you and G…some terrible calls. I would say Dayton got some bad ones too but that isn’t why they lost the game. Our defense is elite and we could make a case that our 5 starters should be on all conf teams and all def teams. This team doesn’t panic and doesn’t/hasn’t let up on defense. Myself and a couple of parents were talking when we were in Florida this could be a special team in terms of the A10. Still a ways to go but let’s take it one game at a time. Let’s start with Fordham and then let’s make some ram stew😂! 🕷️🏀 Oh and a shameless dad plug, I’ll put Dji up defensively against any guard/wing in the A10 😀
Click to expand...
They didn’t show me much against Florida but you’re proving to be right.
 
SpiderDad75 said:
Also, keep our family in your prayers please…my wife lost her dad Wed morning as it’s been a tough week but these two games helped us take our minds off for a little while. 🙏🏼🕷️🏀
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I'm really sorry to hear of your loss. You are Spider family now, and I definitely send my prayers and love your way. 💗 I lost my Dad almost exactly 2 years ago. We were so incredibly close, both Spider alums, and attended many many games together!
 
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SFspidur said:
That one jumped out at me as well. The block definitely came after it had the backboard, so the question comes down to whether the ball still had a possibility of entering the basket. I don't think there was a zero chance, so you have to call the goaltend there.

The exact NCAA rule:

"When the ball contacts the backboard and any part of the ball is above the rim during a field goal attempt, it is considered to be on its downward flight. In such a case, it is goaltending when the ball is touched by a player as long as it has a possibility of entering the basket."
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is this reviewable? Can a coach request review of a goaltend in real time if it is not called? Or only if it is actually called a goaltend?
 
brooklyn brownstone said:
is this reviewable? Can a coach request review of a goaltend in real time if it is not called? Or only if it is actually called a goaltend?
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I believe it is only reviewable if the goaltending call is made on the court. All the more reason to go ahead and call it if it's close so you can then check it.
 
SFspidur said:
They couldn't review it because they didn't call the goaltending on the floor.
Click to expand...

Sorry I know there have been 2 goaltending or potential goaltending calls talked about. I meant the one where Dji was called for goaltending. Did they review that one? I expect they did but I don’t remember.
 
GKiller said:
Sorry I know there have been 2 goaltending or potential goaltending calls talked about. I meant the one where Dji was called for goaltending. Did they review that one? I expect they did but I don’t remember.
Click to expand...
They said during the broadcast that they reviewed it during their break and confirmed the call
 
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Yeah, I recall them saying the Dji one was confirmed. The Spider in me really wants to say it wasn't coming down yet, but really tough to tell. Super close but it might have just started its way down.
 
SpiderDad75 said:
Also, keep our family in your prayers please…my wife lost her dad Wed morning as it’s been a tough week but these two games helped us take our minds off for a little while. 🙏🏼🕷️🏀
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Very sorry to hear about your loss, hope your wife and entire family are doing as well as possible. Sports can be a great escape for a couple hours here and there.
 
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spider23 said:
Very sorry to hear about your loss, hope your wife and entire family are doing as well as possible. Sports can be a great escape for a couple hours here and there.
Click to expand...
🙏🏼🙏🏼 appreciate it and yes it was a good break for us.
 
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SpiderDad75 said:
Also, keep our family in your prayers please…my wife lost her dad Wed morning as it’s been a tough week but these two games helped us take our minds off for a little while. 🙏🏼🕷️🏀
Click to expand...
sdad give ms a collective spider fan hug. prayers for she and her family.
 
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