What are we doing with this program?

[MolivaManiac]

I waited to think about this comment until this morning. MM I hope you meant the squirel comparision as an insult....I mean a slap in the face insult. If we are a double AA baseball team why do we bother. If we have to be a carnaval side show because our main product is so bad.......how pathetic is that.

While the comparison is a bit harsh, my position is that our attendance really is not impacted by wins and losses. I think we've got some good data that backs this up. Simply put, people like inexpensive, safe entertainment.

The people that should be the most frustrated are those in the athletics department that have to work so hard to keep the butts in the seats. Their job shouldn't be as difficult as it is.

 

[urmite]

While the comparison is a bit harsh, my position is that our attendance really is not impacted by wins and losses. I think we've got some good data that backs this up. Simply put, people like inexpensive, safe entertainment.

The people that should be the most frustrated are those in the athletics department that have to work so hard to keep the butts in the seats. Their job shouldn't be as difficult as it is.

I have been wondering why we don’t play an exhibition game and at least attempt to get this type of game out of the way at that time instead of opening night.

Your observation may be part of the reason...

 

[spiderstudent17]

Here are my thoughts on the game last night:

It's not that we lost that stunk but how we stunk. I understand that there are growing pains of being such a young team, but the talent level difference between us and Delaware should be enough to keep the game close...especially not losing to them by 30 at half time. Shots are missed and made, that's the name of the game, but the defense was absolutely atrocious.

This game hurts not only because it puts a dent in our NCAA hopes, but also the fact we might have 31 more games of this. This season will be rough to watch at times, but I still remain optimistic. We had JG, Cayo, and SS playing in their first college game last night. We also had JMA play in his first game where fans actually watch the game (unlike Chicago State) so he was nervous. PF and GG have had some experience but this is the first time they have more of a primary role, which too must be nerve wracking. So we had 6 players in last night that have never played a college game or have had some time in more of a secondary role -- so being put in the spotlight affected them. Also, our highest returning scorer from last year - Khwan - did not play.

One thing that I love about this team that I haven't seen in previous years, is the kids want it and want it bad. You can see it in GG's face when he stood up to confront that Delaware guy, you can see it in Buck's desire to take charges, you can see it in JG and Nick too. I refuse to accept that with the talent GG, SS, DMB, KF, NS, and JG have and their desire to win that we won't be successful on the court.

I don't want to make any excuses last night. Even with the inexperience we have, there is no reason to get blown out by Delaware. It's going to take some adjustment playing people who have never really been an integral part of this team before, as well as adjusting without TJ and SDJ. This means going through bad losses. I don't think Mooney is that good of a coach overall, and he has to have some accountability but that should have been 2-3 years ago (or in 1-2 years if we don't make the tournament with this team's talent). In the present moment, you can say the coach should have gotten them ready but you can't really prepare someone to play their first meaningful college game. Mooney isn't on the court. At the end of the day, it's embarrassing to lose to Delaware the way we did, but I don't think it is a plateau of who we can be as a team. This is a growing pain (and it might take time) but we will get better

 

[keefusb]

I don't ever remember a Dick Tarrant team playing like we did last night. I can't even imagine what he must have been thinking as he watched that debacle.

 

[URWilk110]

I don't understand why so many of you are so surprised, just like I dont understand how year after year you are so optimistic about the upcoming season. Look at the roster, we have no experience. We honestly have no idea how good any of the new guys are, including Grant. We lost one of the best players in the history of the program and another top 10 scorer. You don't replace that in the first game with two freshmen and a guy who has never played a minute of college basketball. Yes, it was a complete embarrassment but it shouldn't be surprising with the coach we have and how this team has been constructed. Get your head out of the sand, it's going to be a long year.

 

[sdspider]

That first half was one of the worst I have ever seen since watching Spider hoops.

Why do we have to make the defense so complicated?

Our guys have talent let em use it with what they know not with a whole new system theyve never seen before. Just silly

 

[SpiderFan]

The ironic thing is that Delaware had just as much youth as we did... So what does that tell you?

 

[ur2K]

We were down by over 30 in the first half in our home opener to Delaware - that has got to open some eyeballs if the last 6 years haven’t.

 

[Eight Legger]

I'm always amazed at how easy it seems to be at times for our opponents to get one uncontested look after another, and meanwhile when we are on offense, every guy seems to be double-teamed. How is that even possible? Never was it more evident than last night.

Look, I'm still optimistic about the players we have on this team. We shouldn't have lost to Delaware, but we did. So be it. Gilyard is a stud, Buck and Sherod are too. Grant is a talent but based on last night will need a decent amount more time than I expected to get into the flow of things. He was totally lost on defense and took way too many threes. The lack of urgency starts and ends with the coach, IMO.

 

[SpiderK]

Grant didn't get into foul trouble. That's a positive.

 

[Spiders10]

Anyone remember the game where we scored 8pts in the 1st half, maybe 12 pts i dont remember. At Dayton? Maybe Mooney's 1st or 2nd season?

I thought back to that game when we went down 45-12 in the 1st half.

 

[MrTbone]

Anyone remember the game where we scored 8pts in the 1st half, maybe 12 pts i dont remember. At Dayton? Maybe Mooney's 1st or 2nd season?

I thought back to that game when we went down 45-12 in the 1st half.

I recall a game against either temple or st joes where we scored something like 8 points in the first half at their place and only ended up with about 36? This wasn’t quite as bad offensively but the poor defense in this game made it feel more egregious.

 

[MrTbone]

Did anybody notice if we switched up defenses during the game? It didn’t look like it but I also was largely averting my eyes...

 

[Eight Legger]

Seemed like we went to more of a traditional zone for a bit in the first half at one point. I don't recall much about the second half.

 

[keefusb]

We had a home game against Davidson a few years back when Derrick Williams seriously injured his ankle. We maybe scored 12 or 14 points in the first half of that game. We had a furious comeback in the second half but came up short (sound familiar?). I think that might have been the second worst first half I had ever witnessed behind last night.

 

[keefusb]

Really, the big disappointment for me is that we have invested so much in the program (in aggregate and individually) over the last 6-8 years between Mooney's contract, the RC renovation, the chartered flights, the trips overseas, season tickets, donations, etc. and what do we have to show for it? I suppose we have decent attendance in spite of the mediocre return on investment, and a reasonably decent fan experience at the RC if you don't really care about the product on the floor.

 

[ur2K]

Seemed like we went to more of a traditional zone for a bit in the first half at one point. I don't recall much about the second half.

First possession looked like man, everything in the first half was unidentifiable - no one knew what to do, who to guard or where to switch.

Game reminded me of many moons ago when Jameer Nelson and the (possibly at that time) #1 st joes blew the doors off of us at home. But this was Delaware killing us in our own building

 

[I-M-UR]

Anyone remember the game where we scored 8pts in the 1st half, maybe 12 pts i dont remember. At Dayton? Maybe Mooney's 1st or 2nd season?

I thought back to that game when we went down 45-12 in the 1st half.

We scored 9 in the first half at William and Mary a few decades ago. I thought that was the record.

 

[WebSpinner]

was not there but what you guys describe reminds me of a home opener against the fighting camels of campbell and how they schooled us and how they looked like a Tarrant team playing against us, a complete embarrassment. not under our current coach but one who was shown the door. feel for you guys who have invested and have passion yet no satisfaction. can not resist, little i, you really want to know what people think of you now? really?

 

[TBSpyder]

It's not like Delaware was a senior laden major foe. We were whipped by a weak mid major on our home court. I'm tired of hearing how great this team is. I cancelled my SpderTv subscription. I don't even need to ask did our players stand for the national anthem, or did they hide in the tunnel?

 

[urmite]

Seemed like we went to more of a traditional zone for a bit in the first half at one point. I don't recall much about the second half.

I believe it was the 4th quarter when we put Solly at center in a trapping defense. That seemed to ignite Gilyard offensively.

 

[UR Fan 2]

It is just one game. One game without our floor leader Kwan Fore. We will be ok by the end of this year. I agree with the sentiments that it was one of the worst halves of basketball I can remember. And I do not want to excuse lapses of coaching that have led to us being that unprepared, but let us not pull the emergency cord just yet.

Positives:
Free throw shooting
Gilyard
Big Paul looked comfortable and gives us a back up. Thought Mooney was too quick to pull him especially after the breakout hustle that led to a layup.

Negatives:
Coaching that had us come out that flat in the 1st half
Intensity of everyone in 1st half not named Buckingham
Solly and Golden - for all of the hype in the offseason, they did not play that well. Just check out the lines.
The defense in the 1st half looked completely lost.
Freshman mistakes(thinking about the inbound play to Cayo for a wide open layup as an example)

 

[64Spider]

Seemed like we went to more of a traditional zone for a bit in the first half at one point. I don't recall much about the second half.

Looked like man to man for most of second half. Hard to get lost when you have that. And we held them to 27 points.
I think I was most disappointed with GG in this game. He has had enough time in the program to understand the defense. He will improve.

 

[whampas]

Did anybody notice if we switched up defenses during the game? It didn’t look like it but I also was largely averting my eyes...

How would you be able to tell? You have to first start with defense to be able to change it.

 

[PASpider]

Mo,

Glass half full:
The key tonight is whether we believe the 43-27 stomping that we delivered in the second half, or the 48-20 thumping that we took in the first half represents the "REAL" Spider team. I believe that the first half was an outlier, or an anomaly, and did not represent what this team is all about.

A second definition of insanity is to base large decisions on small samples of data, and to OVER-REACT, to 18-minutes of play, as this board consistently does. I believe we learned some important lessons in the first half, and one of these may have been that we need to start games by establishing our inside game, which we did not do until the start of the second half. The second lesson is that we need to play intense and smart defense, as a way to establish momentum. We did not do this until the second half either. Finally, we may have learned that Solly's defense is not there yet, and that we need to start our games with JJ at forward, and bring in Solly off the bench. Our small line-up is, at this point, our strongest.

I believe that the second half showed us what this team is capable of, and it showed us about some of the skills or our newcomers. Grant Golden showed some of his skill-set, and took a nice charge that was called a block. Jacob Gilliard had a terrific second half, and may simply need to take more of those open 3s than he did tonight, when he made the extra pass to open guys who did not make the shots. Both Grant and Jacob will someday go down as great Spider players.

I believe that the second half is what I have been seeing so far in the pre-season, and that we will see a lot more second half performances than 1st half performances as the season progresses. If we have even one more half like the first one this season, then I will eat my words. I do not believe we will. Focus on our second half and keep the faith for at least another couple of weeks, until we have a basis for a reasonable evaluation... And, by the time KF is back, we will be even better.

Small samples of data? We have years of data producing the same results. The limited data is our Sweet Sixteen year which seems to be the only year people on this board remember.

 

[SpiderK]

It's not like Delaware was a senior laden major foe. We were whipped by a weak mid major on our home court. I'm tired of hearing how great this team is. I cancelled my SpderTv subscription. I don't even need to ask did our players stand for the national anthem, or did they hide in the tunnel?

We all stood

 

[SpiderFan]

What's going to happen against J'ville St on Monday?

 

[whampas]

What's going to happen against J'ville St on Monday?

Lose by 15. I'll be getting up leaves. I've already seem one game too much. Mooney needs to go.

 

[spiderman]

so a few thoughts. guess I'll re-watch some tomorrow because I'm a glutton.

worst half ever played. I know most stop right there and write off the season based on that, but we played well in the 2nd half despite still not shooting well. thank goodness. otherwise I'd have nothing good to say.

Gilyard - trying so hard to stay-in-his-lane as a freshman. I know he feels he's a true PG and is looking to get others involved, but he's a stud true PG in today's terms. I think the sooner he realizes that the right play is pretty much always taking the shot if it's there, the better we'll be. it'll open things up for everyone. he's got to have the same attitude that he had in HS. that he's the best player on the floor. because he's certainly one of them.

Sherod - I'm not going to argue that he's not a great player. I like his game a lot. but I'm no longer going to give him credit for being a great shooter just because it looks so pretty. he didn't shoot well at all last year. I'll give him shooting credit when he proves it.

Golden - I want to watch again, but at first watch I thought his interior defense was a huge problem. could be a scheme issue, but he was out of position a ton. no scheme tells you to get caught on the wrong side of the man you're covering.

JJ - clearly not 100%. couldn't defend and he's always so tough. couldn't get up on his man. gave effort, but needs to get healthy.

Solly will help, but this is Buck and Jacob's show. Nick will do his part. and Khwan will be a monster addition.

I know that half was digusting, but this is going to be a fun team. Gilyard will be such a pleasure to watch. love how he's constantly anticipating on defense. always reading the pass, and trying to get a hand in there. great quickness. can't wait to see Khwan next to him. no way does Jacob backup anyone. they'll play side by side 30 mpg, so we're going small a lot.

 

[MrTbone]

so a few thoughts. guess I'll re-watch some tomorrow because I'm a glutton.

worst half ever played. I know most stop right there and write off the season based on that, but we played well in the 2nd half despite still not shooting well. thank goodness. otherwise I'd have nothing good to say.

Gilyard - trying so hard to stay-in-his-lane as a freshman. I know he feels he's a true PG and is looking to get others involved, but he's a stud true PG in today's terms. I think the sooner he realizes that the right play is pretty much always taking the shot if it's there, the better we'll be. it'll open things up for everyone. he's got to have the same attitude that he had in HS. that he's the best player on the floor. because he's certainly one of them.

Sherod - I'm not going to argue that he's not a great player. I like his game a lot. but I'm no longer going to give him credit for being a great shooter just because it looks so pretty. he didn't shoot well at all last year. I'll give him shooting credit when he proves it.

Golden - I want to watch again, but at first watch I thought his interior defense was a huge problem. could be a scheme issue, but he was out of position a ton. no scheme tells you to get caught on the wrong side of the man you're covering.

JJ - clearly not 100%. couldn't defend and he's always so tough. couldn't get up on his man. gave effort, but needs to get healthy.

Solly will help, but this is Buck and Jacob's show. Nick will do his part. and Khwan will be a monster addition.

I know that half was digusting, but this is going to be a fun team. Gilyard will be such a pleasure to watch. love how he's constantly anticipating on defense. always reading the pass, and trying to get a hand in there. great quickness. can't wait to see Khwan next to him. no way does Jacob backup anyone. they'll play side by side 30 mpg, so we're going small a lot.

Sums up a lot of my thoughts. I don’t think we’re that much smaller if we go Jg/Kf. It mostly depends on if we drop nick or Solly at the forward spot.

There is a defensive scheme problem still. Some of that was player discipline or lack thereof, but I also think if the D isn’t working you have to switch it up.

I don’t think we are athletically at any significant disadvantage, we could have played man D and done no worse.

 

[I-M-UR]

so a few thoughts. guess I'll re-watch some tomorrow because I'm a glutton.

worst half ever played. I know most stop right there and write off the season based on that, but we played well in the 2nd half despite still not shooting well. thank goodness. otherwise I'd have nothing good to say.

Gilyard - trying so hard to stay-in-his-lane as a freshman. I know he feels he's a true PG and is looking to get others involved, but he's a stud true PG in today's terms. I think the sooner he realizes that the right play is pretty much always taking the shot if it's there, the better we'll be. it'll open things up for everyone. he's got to have the same attitude that he had in HS. that he's the best player on the floor. because he's certainly one of them.

Sherod - I'm not going to argue that he's not a great player. I like his game a lot. but I'm no longer going to give him credit for being a great shooter just because it looks so pretty. he didn't shoot well at all last year. I'll give him shooting credit when he proves it.

Golden - I want to watch again, but at first watch I thought his interior defense was a huge problem. could be a scheme issue, but he was out of position a ton. no scheme tells you to get caught on the wrong side of the man you're covering.

JJ - clearly not 100%. couldn't defend and he's always so tough. couldn't get up on his man. gave effort, but needs to get healthy.

Solly will help, but this is Buck and Jacob's show. Nick will do his part. and Khwan will be a monster addition.

I know that half was digusting, but this is going to be a fun team. Gilyard will be such a pleasure to watch. love how he's constantly anticipating on defense. always reading the pass, and trying to get a hand in there. great quickness. can't wait to see Khwan next to him. no way does Jacob backup anyone. they'll play side by side 30 mpg, so we're going small a lot.

I truly don't understand you folks who try and put rose colored glasses on this mess. I really don't want to call individual players out, they are just young men ('solly will help, nick will do his part'), but good grief, this team is a mess. They will improve but if Million dollar Mooney isn't in the NCAA tournament next year he needs to go. Del. started three underclassmen and they abuse us.

 

[VT_Spider]

I've always looked at "patterns" in performance (stock market, sports teams, behavior, etc). The patterns in place for UR basketball under Mooney are evident. I don't think he's capable of breaking the patterns. We have enough history of him to see the minor changes he's willing to make, resistance to making wholesale changes, and little movement away from the base system that's made him a slightly > .500 coach through the years. For the most part we are are a predictable team with predictable results. With the exception of a few deviations, what you get in year one is pretty much what you get in year 2, 3, 4, etc.

Why on earth he was given an extension in between AD's is baffling. I've seen the posts of explanations, but his long term results don't justify that. Sorry. A change is needed at the top.

If we revisit this thread 4 years from now, it will still be applicable, relevant, and predictable.

Ya the patterns don't change and they never will so he needs to go.

 

[iSpider]

Still an arrogant ass, if you really want to know. Just sayin' buddy.

Perhaps you are right about my personality profile. But even assuming that is true, at least I am an ACCURATE arrogant ass. We will never get to where we deserve to be under Mooney. Apparently, the powers that be are content with this. Unless our new AD had the gonads to change the situation, enjoy the next ten (10) years.

 

[Spiderstew1962]

I have an idea. Let's fire Mooney and hire Delaware's coach!

 

[iSpider]

John P. Hardt, only you can help.

 

[bongturk]

John P. Hardt, only you can help.

Defense was abysmal. These guys look like they have no idea how to switch, when to switch or how to call picks to help their teammates out.
Golden was very tight in the first half and let that get to him in the second half. Did he even take a short in the second half?? He HAS to take a major role in the offense if we are going to win any games at all. Buck and Nick were terrible on defense throughout the game. This team (and last year's team) look like no one has ever taught them to get into good defensive position and MOVE THEIR FEET !!!!!. Because they gave up so many layups I would put them in a zone until the other team proved they could beat us from outside.
Most of you will laugh but I am a, wait for it, a disciple of Paul. yes, I said it. Let the guy play. Solly and the others were invisible. I will go further to say that I would consider a double low post offense with Paul and Grant playing at the same time. It couldn't possibly be worse than the total lack offense they showed on Friday. Even as a change of pace offense it would be worth a try.
I will reserve judgment on how well or poorly the team plays until Kwan comes back. The little dude played really well but he can't be expected to pick up the slack that our so called stars dropped all over the place on Friday.
My opinion of Mooney hasn't changed. He tries to fit square pegs into round holes all the time. He has done it for the last five years (as long as I have been watching him). Pete Carill must be spinning in his grave (if he's dead). Good coaches know how to make the schemes fit the players, not the other way around.
I'm still hopeful that this young team can win a bunch of games, but it will be in spite of their coach not because of him.

 

[FrontRoyalSpider]

Lose by 15. I'll be getting up leaves. I've already seem one game too much. Mooney needs to go.

Our basketball program is a dumpster fire!

 

[32counter]

Put a hockey rink in the Robins Center main floor area.A little refrigeration and a samboni will do it with detachable side boards.Shut down the basketball program.It’s a joke.A waste of resources.Hockey like lacrosse is in our recruiting- demographic sweetspot.
Let’s play ECAC hockey as well as the Midwest schools and shoot for national recognition.Our basketball program is mired with the lower half of all other D-1 programs.

 

[Spideroldie]

Agree with Spiderman and T-Bone's posts above. When we have an athletic edge over our opponent, like last night, we should be prepared to immediately switch to a "man" defense. As noted, we would have been a stronger defense in the first half in a "man-to-man" scheme. Also agree that a basic zone-D should e in our arsenal, especially when we play teams that are not great from 3-point land. The first half was bad. However, I thought it was bad mostly because of our defense and our shot selection. Would have liked to see us pound it inside or would have liked to see Buck and others driving the lane, which we really did not see until the start of the second half.

We should take some positives away from the second half, where we did fight back and where we did outscore Delaware by 43-27. Were mistakes made to get us behind by 48-20 at the half? Yes. Did we look like a different team in the second half? Yes. What will we see in our next game or two? Stay tuned, and see what this team and coaching staff are made of....

 

[Marley13]

How much did Delaware playing not to lose in the second half contribute to our better play? I'm sure some but I hold out hope that CM lit a fire under their asses at the half. Not a lot of hope though.