@ Davidson 7 PM 1/14/2020
- Thread starter ChoppinBroccoli
- Start date
Davidson is not very good. AND, they played like trash in this game.
The majority of the games this year can be described much the same as last night. The performance of the opponent in most cases has been awful.
The truth is that the overall quality of college basketball is WAY down this season.
Doesn't mean that it still isn't good to get a win, especially on the road. Doesn't mean that one shouldn't be happy with wins and progress. Doesn't mean that you aren't glad that your team isn't 12-20 ish for the third year in a row.
It is just being real.
My take on last night. The win was never in doubt with about 10 minutes left in the second half. Davidson did cut into the lead to make the score appear closer but I never got nervous that we were going to choke it up.
Been critical of Gilly being way too passive over the past month and he showed up big time with a big time game last night. Sherod was also very good.
I think if there was ever a game to miss Blake, tonight was a good one. Goose was able to effectively defend both Grady (mainly) and JAG and allowed those guys to never feel comfortable.
We did see the impact of no Francis though last night. This team had period of being very passive on both ends of the court. Francis's presence does not allow that and so while he is out, players that are used to "letting the game come to them" are gonna have to step up a little bit more. Last night, Gilly and Sherod did. Grant was still pretty passive, need a little more juice.
I never discount a road W. They are tough to get. Davidson is down but has some great players and I think they were 28-4 over their past 32 at home.
Been critical of Gilly being way too passive over the past month and he showed up big time with a big time game last night. Sherod was also very good.
I think if there was ever a game to miss Blake, tonight was a good one. Goose was able to effectively defend both Grady (mainly) and JAG and allowed those guys to never feel comfortable.
We did see the impact of no Francis though last night. This team had period of being very passive on both ends of the court. Francis's presence does not allow that and so while he is out, players that are used to "letting the game come to them" are gonna have to step up a little bit more. Last night, Gilly and Sherod did. Grant was still pretty passive, need a little more juice.
I never discount a road W. They are tough to get. Davidson is down but has some great players and I think they were 28-4 over their past 32 at home.
Whether you agree with the post or not, I hope people take note of the quality of the post. Good analysis, supported by facts and basketball knowledge.
Great stuff SJSF!
Thank you for some levity 97. Agree with all points, but thought defense was really, really good (particularly keeping JAxel out of the lane, and locking up Grady pretty well). Offense was a bit disjointed at times, but Gilyard kept us running at a high-enough level. He was great tonight, and we needed it.
As a dedicated critic of the coach, I congratulate the team and him for rebounding from last Sat with a much needed road win even playing without BF. Says a lot for the team to step-up.
We have dominated 3 or our 1st 4 A10 games.
The only reason Davidson wasn't a double digit win last night is because they got a couple lucky 3s near the end. This is a team that had 100 NET rating going into the game, was undefeated at home, was expected to win by 6 and we were missing our top scorer. I thought Mooney did a great job coaching this game and the team played very well. Impressive road win!
Even without Blake, this years team will have one of the highest win totals in the history of our basketball program. It is impressive having a man down and still being able to play 9 guys. I am having a great time watching Spider basket this season. All is good with the world. Go Spiders!
The only reason Davidson wasn't a double digit win last night is because they got a couple lucky 3s near the end. This is a team that had 100 NET rating going into the game, was undefeated at home, was expected to win by 6 and we were missing our top scorer. I thought Mooney did a great job coaching this game and the team played very well. Impressive road win!
Even without Blake, this years team will have one of the highest win totals in the history of our basketball program. It is impressive having a man down and still being able to play 9 guys. I am having a great time watching Spider basket this season. All is good with the world. Go Spiders!
They were 8-33 from 3. I doubt they'd consider that lucky.
Our defense played well, preventing a lot of easy buckets. We were giving up a lot of open looks from outside, but they couldn't hit.
Only lucky one I saw was a scramble under the basket and the ball squirted out for an open three...
80-90% free throw shooting has really helped us win several games we would have lost last year for sure. I appreciate Coach Fezz for taking the time to teach these kids to shoot.
No one is getting banned for being positive. But if you are gonna say some ridiculous pollyanna shit like, even without Blake, this years team will have one of the highest win totals in the history of our basketball program. Someone is gonna probably clapback on that. .
I just wish some of your with an obvious need to check some of the anti-Mooney sentiment on here, could do some without resorting to hyperbole.
Thank you for your kind words. U of R has only won 20 or more regular season games since 1970 6 times and 22 or more 3 times. We have had one of the best starts to a season in program history at 13-4 and I stand by my statement above that we will finish the year with "one of" the highest win totals in program history. Mooney is doing a terrific job coaching this year. This is a great time to be a Spider basketball fan.
I do see a lot of good possibilities with this team.
But I also think winning percentage on Selection Sunday is a better measure of each season.
I am curious. Since joining the ECAC South, how many seasons is that? And how many were we .633 or better going into NCAA selection?
Or if you want to be negative...Since 1980 how many times have we had 12 or fewer losses on May 1?
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The biggest issue w the blown big lead is these ratings sites factor in scoring win margin. NET caps at 10 but if we win by 10+ that helps. Maybe just barely in the margins but we r dealing w slim margins for a bid.
I never felt the game was in any jeopardy late just would have been nice to win by more. Wouldn’t care if it didn’t matter but it does. Gotta keep foot on the gas.
I never felt the game was in any jeopardy late just would have been nice to win by more. Wouldn’t care if it didn’t matter but it does. Gotta keep foot on the gas.
I agree, I never thought we were going to lose. But the last 5 minutes were a crash course in how not to close out a game. Hopefully the team (and coaches) watch that film and learn from it.
I went back and looked at the play by play for the last 5:39 of the game to see if it was as bad as I'm remembering. Spoiler alert, it was.
Here were our possessions in order:
-turnover, Golden
-turnover, shot clock violation
-missed 3 pointer, Sherod
-turnover, shot clock violation
-2 free throws, Gustavson
-turnover, Golden
-2 free throws, Gustavson
-missed 3 pointer, Sherod
Now with 0:27 left in the game the 60-44 lead has dwindled to 64-58. What was close to a blowout became a 2 possession game.
This stretch of play gave me flashbacks to the last few seasons where we gave many games like this away. Thankfully Andre hit his free throws, and then Gilyard and Wojcik did down the stretch as well to seal it.
All in all it was great to get a road win in conference so I'm not trying to harp on the negative. Just hoping the guys learn from this game and can closeout a little better in the future.
Here were our possessions in order:
-turnover, Golden
-turnover, shot clock violation
-missed 3 pointer, Sherod
-turnover, shot clock violation
-2 free throws, Gustavson
-turnover, Golden
-2 free throws, Gustavson
-missed 3 pointer, Sherod
Now with 0:27 left in the game the 60-44 lead has dwindled to 64-58. What was close to a blowout became a 2 possession game.
This stretch of play gave me flashbacks to the last few seasons where we gave many games like this away. Thankfully Andre hit his free throws, and then Gilyard and Wojcik did down the stretch as well to seal it.
All in all it was great to get a road win in conference so I'm not trying to harp on the negative. Just hoping the guys learn from this game and can closeout a little better in the future.
The "guys" were doing what they were instructed to do, let the air out of the ball. How many shot clock violations did we have before the last 6 minutes? And the missed shots were hurried shots primarily because they were up against the shot clock. I'm admittedly not a great fan of Mooney but this philosophy is one of his worst. In today's game of 3 pointers, 16 is not a big enough lead with 6 minutes to go to quit scoring. We were a couple of missed free throws away from being embarrassed. I hope Mooney learns from this though I have my doubts. We didn't get a 16 point lead sitting on the ball. We seem to most always start much too early with that strategy.
It wasn't pretty, but I don't think it was quite as bad as it might have seemed.
Up 17: The 1st Grant turnover came with about 20 on the shot clock.
Up 15: Shot clock violation is bad. Should not happen.
Up 15: Missed 3 by Nick was a good shot with about 10 on the shot clock.
Up 12: Missed shot by Jacob which I think turned into a shot clock violation. Bad possession here.
Up 10: 2 Made FTs.
Up 10: Grant's next turnover was with more than 20 on the shot clock.
Up 10: 2 Made FTs to go up 12 with 1:15 left.
Up 9: Nick missed a 3 at the end of the shot clock, but they chose not to foul down 9, so this time I like using the whole shot clock and taking the game clock down to 35 seconds left since we were up 9.
I can agree the shot clock violations should not happen. We don't need to be worrying about the clock up 15 with 5 minutes left. Maybe up 20 with 5 minutes left, or up 15 inside of 3 minutes, use at least a little clock. Also, regarding the Grant turnovers, if we do choose to run some clock, we should keep the ball in our guards hands, especially when in the bonus since those guys protect the ball and knock down the FTs.
So, even though we have seen some of this in the past, I actually do think you can learn from it because this is a different team than we have had in the past. So, trust them. Trust Jacob to make the right plays when protecting a lead, and if you do run a little clock, start the final set with about 12 on the shot, not 5 or 6.
I agree with this. There is a time for this strategy, but not with 6 minutes left, unless maybe up 20-some. Even with that situation, I would still want to get a good shot, even if it is with 10 on the shot. Another thing I am not a fan of down the stretch is fouling too early when we are up 3. We did this when we were not a great FT shooting team, so I would imagine we will do it now since we are a great FT shooting team. Up 3, I'm not comfortable fouling with more than 5 seconds left, but we have done it in the past with 7-10 seconds left. Then, they make 2 FTS to get within 1, we get fouled with about 6 seconds left, and all of a sudden, if we miss a FT, we could lose in regulation after being up 3. See, I don't always agree with Mooney.
I know it's frustrating to see a 16 point lead shrink to 8 (plus the layup at the buzzer to make it 6). but we won. that's the goal. not to win by 16. we didn't score well down the stretch but we won because each team only got 8 possessions. tough make up a 16 point deficit on 8 possessions.
you can be more aggressive and keep trying to score early in the shot clock and it may work out great, but if you miss after taking quick shots you're giving the other team more possessions and a better chance at a comeback. slowing down is conservative but the safer way to win in this situation. ideally don't turn the ball over though.
you can be more aggressive and keep trying to score early in the shot clock and it may work out great, but if you miss after taking quick shots you're giving the other team more possessions and a better chance at a comeback. slowing down is conservative but the safer way to win in this situation. ideally don't turn the ball over though.
Given the current state of this year's Davidson team, I'm not sure it is incredible, however...
I believe Davidson is 29-4 at home over the last 3 seasons (an NIT loss, a Dayton loss, and 2 spider losses).
8-5 the year before with one more spider loss.
I never like when a team stops doing what got them the lead in the first place, which is what taking the air out of the ball does. There is a time and place for that, but a 16 point lead with 6 minutes left is not the time. Under 3 minutes would have been a better time to bleed the clock.
It's like when we foul a team at the end of the game with a 3 point lead with 8 seconds left. That does us no good and actually hurts us, by giving them additional chances to score with the time left. You foul a guy in that situation under 3 seconds and that strategy works well, above that and it doesn't
It is this type of in game situational awareness that is so frustrating with Mooney. Right strategy but incorrectly implemented.
It's like when we foul a team at the end of the game with a 3 point lead with 8 seconds left. That does us no good and actually hurts us, by giving them additional chances to score with the time left. You foul a guy in that situation under 3 seconds and that strategy works well, above that and it doesn't
It is this type of in game situational awareness that is so frustrating with Mooney. Right strategy but incorrectly implemented.
you say that despite the evidence in this case to the contrary. if the above recap is accurate, they only had 8 possessions to make up the deficit and they couldn't. they ran out of time. we won. pretty comfortably.
The lead got down to 6 with 0:27 left. Just because we didn't end up losing doesn't mean we closed out the game effectively. Against better teams that could have been a really embarrassing loss.
I guess my thoughts on this whole thing are that both of these 2 things can be true:
1. It was a good road win and bounce back game for us.
2. We need to close out games better.
It doesn't have to be one or the other.
I'd like to close it out better too. by not turning the ball over and making a few shots. but use the clock. if we didn't use the close and still missed shots and turned it over, it could have gone much worse. and that would be criminal with a 16 point lead.
It was really only two possessions where we used the whole clock, three if you count the Nick 3 attempt with 35 seconds left, but that was pretty smart to use the whole 30 then. No question we could have done a little better, especially on those possessions, but it wasn't like the whole final 6 minutes was that way.
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