Time to enter the portal

[brooklyn brownstone]

Can we retitle this the Mental Health thread?

Not joking at all.

Mr. Spider, I suggest as others have before, that you talk these feelings through with a professional. There is more here than basketball. I hope you can understand I’m suggesting this from a position of compassion and empathy and support. You should talk with someone and not use a message board as your sole emotional outlet for this.

Thank you for being a good alum. Understand that everyone is different and have opinions that are different than yours. I hope you can work through this. You can support the school and be a good alum. Others can make different choices and also be a good alum. Don’t take it personally. People are going to live their own lives. Times will change. Change does not equate bad.

 

[mr.spider]

Thanks, but this is the only way I know to be a fan. All in with 100% passion or out. There is no in-between, nor should there be. It's clear I'm alone. but once player loyalty is gone and money drives everything, there's really nothing left for me. I've come close to this decision many times because of how deeply it hurts when we fail to win. But now, when lack of loyalty & pride enters the equation, I probably need to hang it up. There's no special interest or hobby I could even imagine replacing it, though. It's probably time to break away from this horrible addiction anyway and just hope there's another unknown passion out there for me. If there is, I know it won't even come close to this passion, though.

 

[Wood Hall]

I feel your pain.

There are 8 Oregon State men's players in the portal. Only three of them are any good, but still ...

The women's team, which just reached the Elite 8 and has every play eligible to return, draws twice as many fans as the men's team and has an incredible connection with the community, lost one of its top players yesterday. Several more are expected to bail.

Hard to get invested in the hometown team when the players clearly aren't.

 

[GKiller]

the current NIL doesn't cost schools anything.

Also fyi this is changing. The Gov of VA is about to sign a new law allowing va schools to pay “NIL” directly. Superseding ncaa rules. Other states have done the same.

Next time Moon man is asked about the Collective he won’t even have plausible deniability about how they’re operating.

 

[mr.spider]

Also fyi this is changing. The Gov of VA is about to sign a new law allowing va schools to pay “NIL” directly. Superseding ncaa rules. Other states have done the same.

Next time Moon man is asked about the Collective he won’t even have plausible deniability about how they’re operating.

Will we aggressively participate in that option? Or will we do just enough to field a team?

 

[mr.spider]

How soon do you think Div 1 will split up like in football?

 

[spiderman]

Great respect for you Spiderman, but couldn't disagree more on this.

Do you want amateur sports where you are rewarded with a free education or an auction for 18-22 year old athletes?

Old restrictions sucked. New rules suck equally. There is a middle ground, restore STUDENT-athletes,

money is a factor in everyting. you're ok if we go after the same player as Brown, and we land him because we offer a $75k scholarship and they don't, right?

in theory, schools giving only scholarships should level the playing field. yet there are still P6 conferences landing every top 100 kid. it's never been a level playing field.

I don't understand the thought process that players shouldn't get paid because it's better that way for the fans of teams that can't afford to pay players. if boosters want to pay athletes, then let them.

and yes, if schools eventually choose to pay kids, it's a financial decision they're making. they're deciding it's worth it because these athletes make money for the school.

 

[mr.spider]

money is a factor in everyting. you're ok if we go after the same player as Brown, and we land him because we offer a $75k scholarship and they don't, right?

in theory, schools giving only scholarships should level the playing field. yet there are still P6 conferences landing every top 100 kid. it's never been a level playing field.

I don't understand the thought process that players shouldn't get paid because it's better that way for the fans of teams that can't afford to pay players. if boosters want to pay athletes, then let them.

and yes, if schools eventually choose to pay kids, it's a financial decision they're making. they're deciding it's worth it because these athletes make money for the school.

I want the kids to come here because they WANT to be here. I want them to love our school because of what it offers, definitely not because of the money we offer. I don't want to lose kids because another school offers more money, but I also don't want to gain kids because we offered more money.

When it comes to that and already has in this landscape, we will inevitably lose to bigger schools who can out-bid us with more money. Effectively, our rank in basketball will stay the same. We will be able to offer more money than many many schools, but we will not be able to compete with bigger schools. However, our upside potential is now extremely limited. We had a chance to make an Elite 8 or Final 4 run like half the teams in our conference have done at some point before money factored into it. Now our players are much more likely to be poached. We could stand our ground against bigger schools based on the merits of our school, but now money is too big of a factor to overcome.

 

[VT4700]

How is our upside limited? We lose Dji, but we will likely land someone who is higher ranked (maybe much higher ranked) in the portal. We lost Tyler after winning 15 games, and won 23 games and the A-10 regular season title the very next season without him. I'm not sure I get why you are so disappointed and frustrated with losing 2 guys who each played 4 years here the past 2 years, while so many other programs are losing multiple starters, even 1st and 2nd year ones. If us being way in the minority of losing players gets you like this, it would be scary how you would act if you followed all these other programs.

 

[mr.spider]

How is our upside limited? We might lose Dji, but we will likely land someone who is higher ranked (maybe much higher ranked) in the portal. We lost Tyler after winning 15 games, and won 23 games and the A-10 regular season title the very next season without him. I'm not sure I get why you are so disappointed and frustrated with losing 2 guys who each played 4 years here the past 2 years, while so many other programs are losing multiple starters, even 1st and 2nd year ones. If us being way in the minority of losing players gets you like this, it would be scary how you would act if you followed all these other programs.

Our upside is limited because if a player has ONE outstanding year, he will likely be snagged because some school offers a shit ton of money.

I would like to know statistics on how we are doing compared to other schools. I would like to think Mooney's one major asset of family culture helps us in this day and age.

 

[VT4700]

Our upside is limited because if a player has ONE outstanding year, he will likely be snagged because some school offers a shit ton of money.

I would like to know statistics on how we are doing compared to other schools. I would like to think Mooney's one major asset of family culture helps us in this day and age.

It depends on the player and what he wants. Not all players would want to go from big minutes here to a questionable, lesser role at a power conference. Some might still get good minutes up a level (Tyler got 25 a game last year) and if so, good for them, but with so many players in the portal, just go replace them if they leave.

 

[mr.spider]

It depends on the player and what he wants. Not all players would want to go from big minutes here to a questionable, lesser role at a power conference. Some might still get good minutes up a level (Tyler got 25 a game last year) and if so, good for them, but with so many players in the portal, just go replace them if they leave.

The problem is the outstanding ones will leave right away after one good year for money. Yeah, we'll poach from the smaller schools to fill the gaps, but the chance to really build something into a team capable of a deep tournament run is now greatly diminished.

 

[mr.spider]

Everything aligned almost perfectly this year, which I expect to be rare and kind of a crapshoot these days, and yet we still failed to take advantage.

 

[VT4700]

The problem is the outstanding ones will leave right away after one good year for money. Yeah, we'll poach from the smaller schools to fill the gaps, but the chance to really build something into a team capable of a deep tournament run is now greatly diminished.

Or greatly enhanced. We lost Nelson and got King, remember? Seems like you are ignoring facts that have already happened while basing your opinion on future hypotheticals.

 

[spiderman]

yeah, I think you're worried more about what might happen in the future than what has happend at UR, mr.spider.
all of our transfers have been either guys who stayed and graduated in 4 years (Burton, Bailey) or guys who weren't in the role they wanted (Nelson, Dread, Wilson, Randolph, etc.).

mid major teams ARE losing some undergrads who have big years to high majors with big NILs. but it hasn't happened at UR yet.

 

[VT4700]

Mr spider, you have posted on this thread 16 times since entering the portal. Are you in the portal or not.

 

[mr.spider]

Or greatly enhanced. We lost Nelson and got King, remember? Seems like you are ignoring facts that have already happened while basing your opinion on future hypotheticals.

Yeah, I'm evaluating with the future in mind given the changes to the landscape that are happening now. If the stars align perfectly like they did this year (replacing Nelson with King and Dji stepping up and bringing in the other right pieces like DLo) then we get a one time shot either because they came in with a year left or they re-enter the portal for more money. Even so, we failed to capitalize. It's hard to believe those stars will align often, and when they do, you'd like to have a couple shots before the team dissolves.

 

[mr.spider]

Mr spider, you have posted on this thread 16 times since entering the portal. Are you in the portal or not.

Yeah, the portal sucks. There's nothing good in there. Richmond is the only good landing spot.

 

[mr.spider]

yeah, I think you're worried more about what might happen in the future than what has happend at UR, mr.spider.
all of our transfers have been either guys who stayed and graduated in 4 years (Burton, Bailey) or guys who weren't in the role they wanted (Nelson, Dread, Wilson, Randolph, etc.).

mid major teams ARE losing some undergrads who have big years to high majors with big NILs. but it hasn't happened at UR yet.

I am looking mostly to the future and evaluating based on what I see happening.

Your point about hanging on to guys better than most is valid I think. I'd like to see statistics on that. That's been my only real hope that Mooney's family culture is helping us hang on to guys while also stealing from the lower conference schools (not ideal imo but I guess that's reality now).

 

[VT4700]

Yeah, the portal sucks. There's nothing good in there. Richmond is the only good landing spot.

Exactly. Give it time. We could have another exciting, fun to watch, winning team again this year. Bigs and Quinn stayed both years. Hunt and Roche are coming back. We got King and Harris, who both worked out for us in the roles we had planned for them. We lose a transfer, but could land a much higher ranked one. I guess I just don't see the negatives you do.

 

[mr.spider]

Do you guys think when the Div 1 split into subdivisions inevitably occurs that Richmond has a viable chance to be in or move up to the top tier?

 

[spiderman]

Yeah, I'm evaluating with the future in mind given the changes to the landscape that are happening now. If the stars align perfectly like they did this year (replacing Nelson with King and Dji stepping up and bringing in the other right pieces like DLo) then we get a one time shot either because they came in with a year left or they re-enter the portal for more money. Even so, we failed to capitalize. It's hard to believe those stars will align often, and when they do, you'd like to have a couple shots before the team dissolves.

to be honest, the stars haven't aligned very often for us pre-NIL either.

 

[mr.spider]

Exactly. Give it time. We could have another exciting, fun to watch, winning team again this year. Bigs and Quinn stayed both years. Hunt and Roche are coming back. We got King and Harris, who both worked out for us in the roles we had planned for them. We lose a transfer, but could land a much higher ranked one. I guess I just don't see the negatives you do.

Thanks. I need to hear that because I really don't want to give up something so important to me. It just seems difficult to align perfectly every year from scratch. Mooney has done better than expected grabbing the right pieces and working with them without needing 4 years to do so.

The hardest thing to overcome is the lack of loyalty and pride, though. I want the guys & gals to WANT to be Spiders because they love it here.

 

[97spiderfan]

To this point, we have a huge net positive with the portal. We have lost no one of value to it (credit Mooney) and have brought in some really unbelievable talent that we wouldn't have otherwise. The King for Jaynel switch might be the biggest upgrade ever for us and the fact that VCU took him off our hands to suck up a roster spot down there, is just the cherry on the top.

*I'm not including Dji and Burton in that statement as they both were 4 year players for us who graduated who only had an extra year of eligibility due to Covid.

 

[mr.spider]

To this point, we have a huge net positive with the portal. We have lost no one of value to it (credit Mooney) and have brought in some really unbelievable talent that we wouldn't have otherwise. The King for Jaynel switch might be the biggest upgrade ever for us and the fact that VCU took him off our hands to suck up a roster spot down there, is just the cherry on the top.

*I'm not including Dji and Burton in that statement as they both were 4 year players for us who graduated who only had an extra year of eligibility due to Covid.

Thanks 97. You're right. Maybe things aren't so bleak. I needed to hear that, and I think maybe I'm ready to receive. Just needed time to be pissy. Thanks for putting up with my shit.

 

[plydogg]

Yeah, the portal sucks. There's nothing good in there. Richmond is the only good landing spot.

Sorry Bud. You entered the portal and by your standards means you are disloyal and not welcome back. You made the rules.

 

[mr.spider]

Sorry Bud. You entered the portal and by your standards means you are disloyal and not welcome back. You made the rules.

I was just evaluating the portal as Mooney allows!

 

[SFspidur]

The NIL must have been nil.