NIL will change college basketball forever

[spiderman]

I wonder if tax deductibility issues are holding up the public side of this.

once you get goods and services (like in the VCU model) for your donations, then they're no longer tax deductible. but maybe if structured as true donations they are?

just guessing. I'm not a tax consultant.

 

[SpiderTrap]

That sounds correct SpiderMan - but why would that hold this up? I don't think any donor giving to an NIL is doing so for Tax reasons.

Now - more likely, is this NIL was announced, and it was not really created, but more just in the discussion stage of PQ and administration and response to VCU announcement.

 

[spiderman]

nobody's giving $100 for a tax credit, but someone giving a lot (PQ) might appreciate it.

 

[VT4700]

The point of my post was not to attach PQ. I am very appreciative of his support of the program, but my question was simple - UR announces an NIL collective has begun (that is step 1), then they say they have the support of big donors (PQ) - this is step 2 as you need big donors to get it started - but after that, it has been crickets?

Where is the information? Where is the update? Where is the - if you like to donate or get more information, please contact XYZ? We obviously have a passionate fan base on this board alone, and I am sure I am not alone in saying I would like to get involved - even if it is just a few hundred dollars. But every dollar counts in this collective and why nothing? Why again are we being left behind?

Why do you need all of this done for you before you give? If you want to give, it's not that difficult. Make a donation and designate Men's basketball, if that is where you want your money to go. Might even try adding NIL, and that will likely get it to the right place.

 

[SpiderTrap]

Why do you need all of this done for you before you give? If you want to give, it's not that difficult. Make a donation and designate Men's basketball, if that is where you want your money to go. Might even try adding NIL, and that will likely get it to the right place.

I don't think that is correct - don't think money can funnel through the school to the NIL.

The school would like need to return your money to you and then you need to give yourself to the NIL. I think the whole point of the NIL collective is that they must be separate, especially when it comes to money. BUT - they could work together I am sure. Like the Spider Club and NIL can market together or instruct people on the differences and how and where to donate. They might even be able to hold events together.

 

[spider23]

Correct Trap, found a couple articles on Dayton's NIL, seems like there is a primary one, named 6th, the Dayton AD talks about it and points people towards it.

So yes, sending a contribution to Jabba earmarked for NIL will probably not end up where you want it.

NIL Update From Flyer AD Neil Sullivan - University of Dayton Athletics

This Communication Was Sent To UD Season Ticketholders Friday

daytonflyers.com

Dayton 6th, a NIL collective, has ‘advanced significantly’ since launch in October

A year ago, the Dayton Flyers men’s basketball team added one transfer in the spring. The coaches didn’t need to reshape the roster. They returned their entire starting lineup and most of their top contributors.

www.daytondailynews.com

 

[spider23]

But I guess every other school is allowed to talk about it, except for us????????

 

[8legs1dream]

But I guess every other school is allowed to talk about it, except for us????????

don't question it or you will upset the Mooneyites

--EDIT--

exhibit A:

 

[VT4700]

Whatever. If you want to give money to an NIL, you can do it. But, I'm sure when it comes out that we have that set up for everyone, the board will just find the next thing to complain about.

 

[VT4700]

But I guess every other school is allowed to talk about it, except for us????????

LOL....talk about it? Or, whine all day about it?????

 

[SFspidur]

Havoc Unlimited accepts Apple Pay. Couldn't be easier, if I were inclined to give to them of course.

Donating to UR's effort involves knowing the secret PQ handshake and I can only assume some sort of hazing ritual for initiation into the club.

 

[97spiderfan]

Whatever. If you want to give money to an NIL, you can do it. But, I'm sure when it comes out that we have that set up for everyone, the board will just find the next thing to complain about.

That is true. If I want to give to Dayton's NIL or VCU's. Dayton's AD put out a statement describing their NIL with a link to the NIL, where I can make a contribution online today. It was really easy, I found it like a 30 second google search.

Now, please direct me to how I can make a contribution to our NIL?

 

[97spiderfan]

My guess, they want to keep it a like minded group they can control.

BINGO. Queally (and maybe a small number of other high $$$ donors) knows they have the ability to control everything around our athletic program. It's all about control.

 

[97spiderfan]

In case you are interested in what a real NIL looks like and how it engages the entire community, check out Dayton's. Pretty nice.

Dayton 6th - Investing in Dayton Flyers Student-Athletes! #dayton6th

Dayton 6th operates as sports marketing agency representing athletes, brands, and fans in partnership opportunities under name, image, and likeness (NIL) guidelines. Dayton 6th supports every member of the Flyer Faithful by providing a channel fans to compensate their favorite Dayton Flyers men's ba

dayton6th.com

 

[Eight Legger]

The guy running that one is a former Dayton athletic department staffer, which probably means the AD there was quite involved with setting things up to ensure that it was done right. Essentially, we should take someone like Jasmonn Coleman or another ex-Spider Club person and "help" that person lead our NIL. I'm sure Dayton has figured out a way for its guy to make the same money he was making previously in its athletic department. If something goes south with the NIL, he'll just return to his old job there, probably.

The best NILs essentially are just replacing the Spider Clubs of the past. The sooner we figure out that transition, the better.

 

[urmite]

I should mention I plan on starting my own NIL for Spider Sports with my own $50 million donation.

I should also mention that I never plan on giving any more information about it to any fans, alumni, athletes, or administration…
ever…

That should work out fine…

 

[VT4700]

Havoc Unlimited accepts Apple Pay. Couldn't be easier, if I were inclined to give to them of course.

Donating to UR's effort involves knowing the secret PQ handshake and I can only assume some sort of hazing ritual for initiation into the club.

Can you maybe give it some time? Or, is that asking too much? And, will the Queally cheap shots ever end? Do you guys ever get tired of complaining and being miserable every day?

 

[97spiderfan]

Can you maybe give it some time? Or, is that asking too much? And, will the Queally cheap shots ever end? Do you guys ever get tired of complaining and being miserable every day?

Give it time. How long? Dayton, VCU and others already are out on the track running the race, meanwhile we haven't even got in our horse out of the barn yet.

It doesn't inspire great confidence when your competitors NIL's have fully functioning websites, are working in harmony with their athletic departments, nice comms package designed to engage the entire community.

Meanwhile our NIL was "announced" in a hasty response to a question on a fan based social media account, while our head coach publicly says he doesn't really know anything about our NIL. To me, it looks like we were caught flat footed and are now trying to react and throw something together that may or may not engage the larger fan base. And you want us to praise this approach?

 

[97spiderfan]

Can you maybe give it some time? Or, is that asking too much? And, will the Queally cheap shots ever end? Do you guys ever get tired of complaining and being miserable every day?

I bet you loved "New Coke".

 

[Eight Legger]

Can you maybe give it some time? Or, is that asking too much? And, will the Queally cheap shots ever end? Do you guys ever get tired of complaining and being miserable every day?

In the grand scheme of life, yes, our ability or inability to set up an NIL, win basketball games consistently, or spell things correctly in press releases all rank very, very low. However... on a basketball message board and in the grand scheme of our basketball program, they are much more important.

It appears that either there was no real interest in setting an NIL program up until very recently, and/or there was no interest from anyone other than PQ and a couple of his buddies in doing so, OR we as an athletic department either didn't take the time to try to figure out a smart plan or tried and have struggled to do so. Most of those options inspire very little confidence in our ability to get things right.

But hopefully soon we will learn more about things and we can start buying the kind of players that we need to win the A-10.

 

[KE Spider]

Whatever. If you want to give money to an NIL, you can do it. But, I'm sure when it comes out that we have that set up for everyone, the board will just find the next thing to complain about.

Seems the only NIL you can contribute to is that of a competitor. Believe the point is other schools have NILs up and running openly soliciting donations from the Faithful while ours is operating in a black box.

Once again Spider brass is behind the competition.

 

[SpiderGuy]

BINGO. Queally (and maybe a small number of other high $$$ donors) knows they have the ability to control everything around our athletic program. It's all about control.

And including coaching retention.

 

[VT4700]

I would rather have Queally be the main one doing NIL than a bunch of message board whiners, many of whom have already said they won't give another cent to the program as long as Mooney is the coach. I wouldn't blame the NIL group at all if they could not care less what 10 whiners on a message board wanted.

 

[VT4700]

Seems the only NIL you can contribute to is that of a competitor. Believe the point is other schools have NILs up and running openly soliciting donations from the Faithful while ours is operating in a black box.

Once again Spider brass is behind the competition.

And, if we end up with more money for our NIL than them, does it matter what the other schools NILs look like?

 

[VT4700]

Give it time. How long? Dayton, VCU and others already are out on the track running the race, meanwhile we haven't even got in our horse out of the barn yet.

It doesn't inspire great confidence when your competitors NIL's have fully functioning websites, are working in harmony with their athletic departments, nice comms package designed to engage the entire community.

Meanwhile our NIL was "announced" in a hasty response to a question on a fan based social media account, while our head coach publicly says he doesn't really know anything about our NIL. To me, it looks like we were caught flat footed and are now trying to react and throw something together that may or may not engage the larger fan base. And you want us to praise this approach?

Yes. Give it time. You act like the group involved is not going to put any money in it, and our only hope is a few message board guys, many of whom have already bragged about not giving anything, save the day.

 

[KE Spider]

And, if we end up with more money for our NIL than them, does it matter what the other schools NILs look like?

Hypothetical that does not address the point raised.

If you want to die on a hill defending 55%, go for it. It is not a passing grade for any serious fan. ( Get ready - que up 2020 and 2022 seasons justification while ignoring the full body of work.)

 

[8legs1dream]

I would rather have Queally be the main one doing NIL than a bunch of message board whiners, many of whom have already said they won't give another cent to the program as long as Mooney is the coach. I wouldn't blame the NIL group at all if they could not care less what 10 whiners on a message board wanted.

ALL IS WELL!

 

[SpiderTrap]

The first rule of the Spider NIL is to not talk about the Spider NIL.

 

[97spiderfan]

I would rather have Queally be the main one doing NIL than a bunch of message board whiners, many of whom have already said they won't give another cent to the program as long as Mooney is the coach. I wouldn't blame the NIL group at all if they could not care less what 10 whiners on a message board wanted.

I think the point is schools like Dayton and VCU have a professionally run NIL, that is transparent, easy to access, and open to all. Not one set up by their sugar daddy benefactor that is secret, hidden and only open to select few, which appears to be how we are going.

I think our fear is given the lack of donors to Men's Basketball on giving day, message board, social media fan sites dissatisfaction, that if we set up an open NIL, it will not be as widely supported it in at other schools because of the dissatisfaction with how our athletic department operates. I also think Queally and his rich buds just want this to be their own little club so they can have control over how it operates. That is not a long term strategy for success in my opinion.

I know 4700 and UR80 like to say this is just a couple disgruntled fans of the message board; y'all are not reading the room very well at all.

 

[VT4700]

I think the point is schools like Dayton and VCU have a professionally run NIL, that is transparent, easy to access, and open to all. Not one set up by their sugar daddy benefactor that is secret, hidden and only open to select few, which appears to be how we are going.

I think our fear is given the lack of donors to Men's Basketball on giving day, message board, social media fan sites dissatisfaction, that if we set up an open NIL, it will not be as widely supported it in at other schools because of the dissatisfaction with how our athletic department operates. I also think Queally and his rich buds just want this to be their own little club so they can have control over how it operates. That is not a long term strategy for success in my opinion.

I know 4700 and UR80 like to say this is just a couple disgruntled fans of the message board; y'all are not reading the room very well at all.

Fair for you to think that, but maybe Queally can read the room and knows what he is doing. If a bunch of rich guys, as you call them, want to take care of our NIL, why not let them, and you and others who act like you want to give so badly can just give your money to the basketball program. As a program, we don't want all of our money going toward the NIL anyway, right? So, it just seems like a lot of unnecessary complaining aimed at a guy most people on here don't like just because he supports Mooney. Funny, that sounds awfully familiar.

I actually think the less information the better when it comes to NIL. Do we really want all of our players to know the figures and then wonder why they might not be getting more. So, if Queally wants to do his thing, and do it quietly, I am all for that.

 

[SpiderTrap]

Fair for you to think that, but maybe Queally can read the room and knows what he is doing. If a bunch of rich guys, as you call them, want to take care of our NIL, why not let them, and you and others who act like you want to give so badly can just give your money to the basketball program. As a program, we don't want all of our money going toward the NIL anyway, right? So, it just seems like a lot of unnecessary complaining aimed at a guy most people on here don't like just because he supports Mooney. Funny, that sounds awfully familiar.

The other thing with NIL is really recruiting - I mean we would need to start recruiting both HS and transfers who WANT NIL money or who are not picking us because of NIL. Look at our last crop of recruits through the portal - Roche, Quinn, Bigelow - all 3 we thought were very good pickups from the portal - but obviously NIL money was not a factor in their decision. So while it is great we have an NIL - the next step is using it, which might mean going after guys we normally did not go after.

 

[spiderman]

... which might mean going after guys we normally did not go after.

unless we put together ridiculous money, I assume we're still going to be in the same recruiting range as always. once real P5s offer, we're pretty much out. we'll compete on the next level, sometimes getting outbid by a comparable or lesser school.

 

[spider23]

My thought is basically the NIL money is going to need to be equal to or greater than a kids 2nd or 3rd choice. I don' t really see an opportunity to go crazy and outbid a p6 guy. But we have to be competitive when competing against equal schools, or lesser schools.

 

[spiderman]

I wonder how teams will spread it out.
say a collective raises $500k for next year. are you better off landing one superstar or 3 mid-level recruits?
we could actually see HM schools use everything on one star (Villanova?), leaving MM schools with better offers to the really good next level guys who normaly would fill HM rosters.

 

[SpiderTrap]

Remember too - this money will need to be replenished quickly each year. SO if we raise 500K and next year give out 300K to 6 players, safe to assume if those 6 players are returning - they will want the same next year in addition to any other players/recruits you add. So this is a fund that needs deep pockets and constant replenishment.

 

[spiderman]

So this is a fund that needs deep pockets and constant replenishment.

which is why the big schools will have a monsterous advantage.

excluding whales, I could see the big 40,000 student schools attracting 10,000 fans to donate $100 or more per year. that's a cool million to play with each year as a low estimate.

the little guys with 3,000 student don't have the fan depth to compete.

 

[97spiderfan]

which is why the big schools will have a monsterous advantage.

excluding whales, I could see the big 40,000 student schools attracting 10,000 fans to donate $100 or more per year. that's a cool million to play with each year as a low estimate.

the little guys with 3,000 student don't have the fan depth to compete.

Especially if your fanbase isn't even given the option to compete. And I'm sure every school has its mega funder or funders like we have with Queally. The difference is those other schools are getting both their mega funders to contribute as well as the rank and file. So, that puts us at an even bigger disadvantage.

 

[Spiders4ever]

How does one go about contributing to the Spider Collective?

 

[97spiderfan]

Fair for you to think that, but maybe Queally can read the room and knows what he is doing.

Google Paul Queally-Richmond and see what turns up, a bunch of negative articles.

I think a person can be grateful at the enormous donations Paul has given UR and also at the same time understand all of the strings that came with those donations that have made Paul essentially a king maker over our athletics as well as other aspects of our University and wonder whether that is really in the best interests of both UR and Paul. Again, just hit the little google search button on that and you will see both Paul and UR have taken a bunch of black eyes on this.

Yet, they both seemed tied at the hip. UR is in love with Paul's money and Paul is in love with the control UR gives him in exchange. And again, I think both are struggling to really read the room.

 

[spider23]

And why the heck are we not taking advantage of the international trip? As I yelled from the mountain tops, last year was a perfect year to take it and get extra reps against real competition. BUT NOOOOOOO. Just another in the long list of items in which we operate more in line with William and Mary, than St. Mary's, VCU, Dayton, SDSU and other serious mid major players.