As Dad of a former high school, AAU and college player, I agree with your post. By the way, my son played against Garner Road teams often.
Burton declaring for NBA draft, maintaining eligibility
- Thread starter SFspidur
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Nice…met a lot of good people through the years from AAU, parents and players. Seen and been involved with high level ball and will always believe it still depends on players mostly. Others can disagree and that’s ok. As long as we pull for our young guys I think that’s the most important.
It will long be debated whether our magical run last month saved Mooney's job. What is not up for debate though is Mooney's job was in serious jeopardy. A coach with a 17 year run as the head coach at a place like UR, job doesn't get in jeopardy, if there are not some serious red flags regarding his performance.
Those red flags and questions will continue. As I always have maintained, Mooney controls much of the outcome. He needs to use this reprieve well, go out and get some high quality transfers from the portal and prove once and for all that he is able to raise our program to be a consistent winner and NCAA participant that most of us believe it can and should be.
UR should be right in the mix with the likes of our other A-10 brethren, Davidson, Dayton, SLU, and VCU as the undisputed leaders of our conference. We absolutely can not slide back to be a mid-pack team next year. I think next year is probably the most important year for our program if we want to evolve from a once in a decade NCAA participant to something greater. I hope for all of our sakes, Mooney is up for the task, otherwise, I fear we will look back on this magical run with fondness but also some regret if he cannot take this step.
This might be the most positive post I’ve read from you. Ever. Love it — lets keep it up!
I will say, as much as we can debate Mooney's abilities as a coach, number one is you have to have players. And as much as we have had a lot of good players as Not a Homer points out, my biggest gripe is when some of those all time players were juniors and seniors - we had huge, gaping holes on the roster. 1 or 2 starters that could not score - and did not have enough other valuable skills to make up for lack of that one. And those years we had 1 or 2 avg to below avg starters, we had no bench behind them. We were running out guys like Kwesi, Solly, JMA - those were Mooney's stop gap transfers because he was slow to the game, or did not play it well.
Everyone from spiderdad to 4700 agrees that we need proven shooters for next season. And a big man or two. Mooney does seem more interested in bringing in some transfers this year, and we are mentioned with some good ones, so that seems positive so far. So we can debate moon's coaching ability all we want, but I think roster building and recruiting has been the weak point that has caused him to miss NCAA's much mores o than pure coaching ability. And it is a component obviously. So yes, I agree this is a critical year.
Go land McCorkle, Stephens, and one other impact transfer and I will say Mooney killed the offseason and we will be in good shape for landing near or at the top of the A10 next season. Or Wright and Quinn, or similar players.
Everyone from spiderdad to 4700 agrees that we need proven shooters for next season. And a big man or two. Mooney does seem more interested in bringing in some transfers this year, and we are mentioned with some good ones, so that seems positive so far. So we can debate moon's coaching ability all we want, but I think roster building and recruiting has been the weak point that has caused him to miss NCAA's much mores o than pure coaching ability. And it is a component obviously. So yes, I agree this is a critical year.
Go land McCorkle, Stephens, and one other impact transfer and I will say Mooney killed the offseason and we will be in good shape for landing near or at the top of the A10 next season. Or Wright and Quinn, or similar players.
I think this year's transfer focus is mostly due to having to wait on our own guys. when Isaiah and Sal left, we had no choice. we did have one spot already but that was due to such a big roster last season.
I assume we'll usually fill all our spots with freshmen as we mostly have done each year. the only time we'll look for transfers is if we lose someone to transfer.
I assume we'll usually fill all our spots with freshmen as we mostly have done each year. the only time we'll look for transfers is if we lose someone to transfer.
If we usually fill all our spots with freshmen from this point on, you can forget about regular trips to the NCAAs. The game has changed. Change with it or be left behind.
Totally agree - I am hoping we are a school that players still aim to stay at for 4 years but each year I think we are going to need to "win" the portal versus "lose" it
the teams hitting the portal now are ones replacing guys they lost to the portal. and this year they had to wait to see if super seniors were coming back.
the game hasn't changed as much as you think. nobody's holding off on recruiting HS kids to get a spring transfer.
the game hasn't changed as much as you think. nobody's holding off on recruiting HS kids to get a spring transfer.
I don’t think we have seen enough years to have any certainty of a trend, especially with Covid exceptions.
However if 1/4 of D1 players transfer each season, that is going to have some sort of noticeable effect.
1150 out of 4600? Does that sound close?
And I do think having transfers in be better performers than transfers out is a good idea.
I do think it is re-prioritizing. Teams are definitely using this as a first means to supplement roster. UNC did this -Brady Manek great example. SDSU been doing it. It HAS to be used now, or as EL states you will fall behind. These good programs that are using it do value the h.s. players and four year guys, but quickly pivot to fill spots when needed. For example SDSU is bringing in two top 100-200 type players, but actively trying to supplement the weaknesses they have. Carolina did it this year and look at results. Gonzaga is active in portal each year, in addition to bringing in top h.s. talent. Heck, a kid I know that went D2 - his dad told me he had 3 lower level D1's very interested, but he committed to D2 school b/c the coaches would not offer until portal played out. They were mining D1 dropdowns. Probably the guys that jump in there and then don't have a good landing space.
Well we were, right? After we didn’t land brunbaugh, hunger, Buchanan, or Avila, I think the staff pretty much folded the towel and planned to look at transfers.
Yes 23 does appear to be a necessity for most teams. McKillop hit a HR with Loyer since a quality PG was a needed priority and Grady helped UK but wasn't that. John was a nice backup for Duke that only rebounded and blocked shots. And like you mentioned other big name programs that got somebody. I think it is harder for Mooney to get a quality player but he has to find a way and the success of this year should help.
Would be great if Mooney could get a 10-15 minute player to do only what John did for Duke. Possibly open up playing a zone at times running people off the 3PT line into having to drive the lane. Talk about the achilles heel of UR b-ball. Had to look up stats and last time UR was average at defending the lane was with ANO. Just off hand average rank #275 in blocked shot category.
I know plenty of Rock Chalk Jayhawk despisers here but this was my fav transfer this season. Was a late addition but when finally healthy by Big12 tourney and into March Madness was the mixing piece for a title. Self made him a better assist player along with having to defend. The last play on the video showed that.
... and his not-so-quick release, and his straight vertical which isnt that quick jump that defines what an NBA athlete is to me. When he gathers himself and has time to take a step he is very good. And I just don't believe he's a good enough shooter and he can't guard a 2 or a 3 in the NBA as has already been noted.
I can’t imagine how many coaches this transfer auction is going to take down. This under the table NIL bidding war for recruits and transfers is going to be a disaster. Clean coaches will be wiped out. We will end up with 350 Calipari - Wade type coaches.
Yeah it could get ugly. And since they added that May 1 deadline, man...it's like fast-paced musical chairs for your job.
8legs1dream
Team Manager
Tyler is one of 283 early entry candidates for the draft. He has until June 1 to pull out and retain NCAA eligibility.
Other A-10 guys...
Bona: Adaway, Lofton, Osunniyi, Welch
GW: Bishop
Davidson: Brajkovic, Lee
Dayton: Camara
Fordham: Daye (left midseason and said he was transferring to Coastal Carolina)
St. Joe's: Hall
Mason: Oduro
VCU: Williams
Other A-10 guys...
Bona: Adaway, Lofton, Osunniyi, Welch
GW: Bishop
Davidson: Brajkovic, Lee
Dayton: Camara
Fordham: Daye (left midseason and said he was transferring to Coastal Carolina)
St. Joe's: Hall
Mason: Oduro
VCU: Williams
NBA announces early entry candidates for NBA Draft 2022 presented by State Farm - NBA.com: NBA Communications
The National Basketball Association announced today that 283 players -- 247 players from colleges and 36 international players -- have filed as early entry candidates for NBA Draft 2022 presented by State Farm.
pr.nba.com
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In todays game if you are jumping off of 1 foot..you are setting yourself up to get injured. Jumping off two feet is the best for safety and for as you say "being a high flyer" and you can control you body a lot easier. This is something I have and Dji's trainers stress to him all the time, as do most trainers that know bball.
Dad, really appreciate your contributions to this board.
good point. Then I was all about safety in hs bc I surely needed to go off 2 feet to get any lift lol. There r times where it’s beneficial to not have to slow down & settle yourself a bit off 2 feet & allow the defense to catch up to u. I feel like I see the 1 leg in nba fairly often & it was in context of nba, but I’m not a big nba viewer so maybe it is less prevalent there than I think. But I agree it comes w more risk.
How many have signed with an agent? Lee has but he may be the only one I know of doing so as of now. Maybe Adaway too.Tyler is one of 283 early entry candidates for the draft. He has until June 1 to pull out and retain NCAA eligibility.
Other A-10 guys...
Bona: Adaway, Lofton, Welch
GW: Bishop
Davidson: Brajkovic, Lee, Osunniyi
Dayton: Camara
Fordham: Daye (left midseason and said he was transferring to Coastal Carolina)
St. Joe's: Hall
Mason: Oduro
VCU: Williams
NBA announces early entry candidates for NBA Draft 2022 presented by State Farm - NBA.com: NBA Communications
The National Basketball Association announced today that 283 players -- 247 players from colleges and 36 international players -- have filed as early entry candidates for NBA Draft 2022 presented by State Farm.pr.nba.com
it's rare that someone can jump higher off two feet. every kid's first dunk is a running start off one foot.
and I agree it's better to take off with 2 feet in traffic and more importantly to land on 2 feet in traffic.
also, I think Tyler's leaping ability is near the bottom of our concerns.
Hall signed with an agent. Brajkovic is done at Davidson no matter what but I think is going pro somewhere rather than grad transferring. Williams has also said he's done.
I believe they changed the rules where you could hire an agent, but just couldn't get paid by agent and had to pay own expenses to these workouts to maintain eligibility. I might be wrong on that - but I thought that was a rule change a few years ago.
Either way - I think Burton is a fringe 2nd rounder. If he thinks that is as good as it will get for him - then he is probably 50/50 to leave. As he will most likely not get drafted, end up on summer league, and be fighting to make a team or get a G-League deal and hope for a call up at some point.
But if thinks returning to A10 and maybe getting near A10 POY honors will help, and with the new additions - he could potentially be the leader on a team trying to return to dance - I think that could boost his stock a little. Maybe not into first round - but maybe solid 2nd round pick.
Either way - I think Burton is a fringe 2nd rounder. If he thinks that is as good as it will get for him - then he is probably 50/50 to leave. As he will most likely not get drafted, end up on summer league, and be fighting to make a team or get a G-League deal and hope for a call up at some point.
But if thinks returning to A10 and maybe getting near A10 POY honors will help, and with the new additions - he could potentially be the leader on a team trying to return to dance - I think that could boost his stock a little. Maybe not into first round - but maybe solid 2nd round pick.
Def disagree with your 1st point and I know many who's 1st dunk was off two...but we will agree to disagree 😁 Could just be age difference and it wasn't a big focus even when I was playing HS ball in the 90's.
Lets be honest - BUrton is athletic and he has good hops, but his athleticism and hops are average by NBA standards. If he makes it to the NBA, it will be his ability to shoot that gets him there and his athleticism with that will be important - but it will be 2nd.
I think teams like him now or have him on their radar because they think he could be a good shooter in the NBA and is athletic enough to survive. There are plenty of shooters who are not athletic enough for the NBA and some of them make it to the league and survive (Kyle Korver?) - but if you can be a good shooter and back it up with just average NBA athleticism - that gives your team something to work with.
I think teams like him now or have him on their radar because they think he could be a good shooter in the NBA and is athletic enough to survive. There are plenty of shooters who are not athletic enough for the NBA and some of them make it to the league and survive (Kyle Korver?) - but if you can be a good shooter and back it up with just average NBA athleticism - that gives your team something to work with.
So Davidson loses Lee, Brajkovic and Jones. I knows they got a big man transfer but he didn't putt up great numbers at whatever lower level school he came from. I'm sure they will be competitive as always, but seems like they are going to be down from this year.
Seems that way - but even a down year for Davidson might be a 5th place finish in the league and make some noise in A10 tourney.
Davidson has been in A10 8 years, and only in 1 year did they not make NIT or NCAA. And that year they finish 9th in A10. Came back next year and made NCAA.
Davidson has been in A10 8 years, and only in 1 year did they not make NIT or NCAA. And that year they finish 9th in A10. Came back next year and made NCAA.
he's a 35% three point shooter. that's pretty good but not amazing. certainly not by NBA standards. so it better be his athleticism that they think highly of. and his size.
yeah I disagree w sman too there. Don't find it rare. Think many (even physics?) will say u can jump off 2 feet higher if you're doing it right. But it's probably pretty close. In basketball u r just running a lot and don't always have the luxury off 2. the acceleration you get off 1 helps but obv u have more force off 2. in short spaces no doubt you go higher off 2. I think NBA may look for the bounce off 1 more since there is a lot more dunking off the move, off the break etc in nba. but idk. I was talking from their perspective, it's not a concern of mine.
yeah that's a pretty big hit but they did get 2 good transfers in. And now I'm thinking they may still be heavy on Andrew Carr too with Lee leaving. So the transfers minimize but it won't be an equal swap.
Skogman is solid. Transitioned into a starting role for Buffalo this year, but only averaged 24 mpg. Averaged 8 and 6, but had a handful of double doubles. Shoots well from everywhere including beyond the arc. Great fit for them.
My point was that if he was a 25% shooter or didn't shoot 3's like Cayo - he would be getting no looks at all. Even with his current athleticism. But I think they see he can shoot 35% and that would likely translate to about the same in the NBA as I think he has the range to shoot NBA distance and with the extra practice and right team - he could shoot 35% in the NBA from deep. And currently - if you can shoot 35% from 3 in the NBA - your a top 100 shooter in the league. Combine that with his athleticism - and I think teams see a guy they don't have to hide on defense or worry about can he get a rebound, can he survive night in and night out. His athleticism helps - because you are right, he doesn't shoot that well enough to make it alone on that. But i think its the overall combination of both, with his shooting ability leading the way - that helps get him looks. PLUS - I think most NBA teams agree, and I agree as well - they can take someone from college and raise their shooting ability - mainly because they have all day to work on it.
Look at another guy from A10 - Obi Toppin. He had elite level athleticism and just an okay shot. Even if he could shoot outside 5 feet, teams would have taken Obi in first round.
I think Burton has a shot to make NBA, but I think his role will be a 2nd squad guy, who can knock down shots, play solid defense, and give you 15 solid minutes a night. Nothing wrong with that - you can have a long career and make a lot of money doing that. Not to mention - as a rookie, he is a shooter who is cheap - which with the super teams these days - is very important. They need cheap players to round out their rosters, usually with guys who can either play solid defense - or make shots.
Toppin is bigger, a super athlete, shot 40% from 3 and 70% from 2. and he's still having trouble getting playing time. the talent level in the NBA is insane.
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