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2021 Recruiting Expectations

I didn’t look at it that way, and yes I suppose that would be luck on one hand, and bad luck for the players.
For sure with the players , it was bad luck at the time. But they now all get to play together on this "super team" essentially. As was pointed out above only 2 (Cayo and Gilly) of the 5 seniors on the roster were actually recruited 4 years ago. It is highly unlikely that we see a scenario play out like this ever again to get a 5 man senior class.
 
Re: Dread...I seem to remember similar concerns when we took a 6 man from a top program with limited statistics to get excited about when we offered David Gonzalvez.

That one worked out ok.

#trusttheprocess
 
Nicely done Fan 2. Very good comparison. And Gonzo came in with a winning mindset and ready to play from day 1. I definitely see things in Dread's game that will translate quickly to our level. The more I re-watch Dread and Randolp's tape the more I like - even if I am still upset we didn't get a 6'8 guy that can play.
 
For sure with the players , it was bad luck at the time. But they now all get to play together on this "super team" essentially. As was pointed out above only 2 (Cayo and Gilly) of the 5 seniors on the roster were actually recruited 4 years ago. It is highly unlikely that we see a scenario play out like this ever again to get a 5 man senior class.
Yes 97 you understood my points. Thanks for the assist.
 
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I
This is a really sound argument. The only fly in that ointment is that Mooney does not have a terrific record in the transfer market. You have TJ Cline and then a bunch of misses or reaches in his 15 years, when you look at big men transfers. So, I kind of seem the same issue presenting itself.

A high quality big man is still going to have the allure of other BCS programs to choose from, whether they are a high school or college transfer. At the end of the day, Mooney still has to close the deal.
would amend this that CM has missed in the grad transfer route and been overly quiet on the undergrad transfer route. I think he’s technically probably 2 for 3 on regular transfers with TJ and Blake. Wood was a miss and Crabtree is tbd. He probably needs to be more active there, but he’s been more active in the last five years than the 10 or so before that.
 
So NCAA is talking about giving winter sport athletes another year of eligibility. I imagine there's a good chance that affects our recruiting plans.

As with spring sports from last year and current fall sports, the NCAA would no doubt have a mechanism to deal with exceeding the normal scholarship limit, but with a large senior class, we could plan to hold back on our remaining two 'ships until this is settled.

No reason for us to potentially go to 18 scholarships next year if some/most/all would plan on coming back...PT is hard enough to earn already. Of course I have no idea how many of our seniors would be interested in coming back.

 
especially w all the budget issues why would schools be voting to make those worse.

back to recruiting expectations...underwhelming.
 
o NCAA is talking about giving winter sport athletes another year of eligibility. I imagine there's a good chance that affects our recruiting plans.
Would this apply only if the season is not played? I would guess that if we have the season we are expecting and get to play the games, all our seniors would be ready to move on and take the next step in their lives anyway.
 
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And if Gilly comes back again, imagine how bad he could obliterate the all time steals record.
I don’t think Gilly would want to do that. Why have an asterisk next to your name (ie over a 5 year period) if you could win the title outright?

If there is an eligibility extension, I don’t think there would be more than one (if that) starter that would come back for another year. However, I would guess this extension would apply to the entire roster and if so there could be a number of players that would take an extra year. Sal and Grace being two. I bet that made a number of forum folks happy.
 
Would this apply only if the season is not played? I would guess that if we have the season we are expecting and get to play the games, all our seniors would be ready to move on and take the next step in their lives anyway.
Presuming it’s the same as the fall sports policy, it’s a blanket extension, regardless of whether this season is played. Originally, they were going to offer it only if players played in less than 50% of the normal max number of games, but they ended up giving it to everyone.
If there is an eligibility extension, I don’t think there would be more than one (if that) starter that would come back for another year. However, I would guess this extension would apply to the entire roster and if so there could be a number of players that would take an extra year. Sal and Grace being two. I bet that made a number of forum folks happy.
Yes, it applies to everyone, not just seniors. But also keep in mind that schools aren’t required to give players the extra year of scholarship, so there has to be willingness on both sides.
 
I know they're trying to do the right thing but I think it's a huge mistake. you hurt as many kids as you help. probably more.

a lot of kids will take the extra year and start their masters. I assume the roster exemption will be for one year? can't be indefinite. so you give some kids a 5th year, but at some point ... probably the current high school junior class ... there will be a year with many fewer scholarships available. how is that fair to them?
 
Trying to wrap my head around the implications, but doesn't seem guaranteed that there is an impact that would necessarily hurt kids scholarship-wise. Impact on future scholarships depends on whether schools opt to keep giving out their usual number in addition to the extras.

But either they give out fewer scholarships or the PT had to be spread around more, so certainly there's some impact.
 
let's say the average team has a full roster with 3 seniors this year and 3 recruits lined up to take their place. say 2 of the 3 seniors decide to take the extra year in 2021-22 to play basketball and start their masters for free. why not? the roster that year would be 15 and only the 2 that came back are finishing their eligibility. unless kids leave due to graduation without playing their 4 seasons, there are no spots available for the next class to get back to 13 in 2022-23

now obviously top 100 or even top 250 kids in the 2022 high school class will find their way onto rosters. but there's usually like 1,100 scholarships to be filled .

and that's just men's basketball. add up all the other sports. that class gets screwed.
 
now consider the Ivy league. they get 4 years of school to play. no redshirts. and they can't stay and play as graduate students (see Noah Yates). so if the NCAA says they all get an extra year of eligibility, then every year for the next 4 years the entire senior class is eligible to grad transfer to scholarshipped schools. some will certainly take advantage of that, again reducing the number of scholarships available for high school seniors.
 
let's say the average team has a full roster with 3 seniors this year and 3 recruits lined up to take their place. say 2 of the 3 seniors decide to take the extra year in 2021-22 to play basketball and start their masters for free. why not? the roster that year would be 15 and only the 2 that came back are finishing their eligibility. unless kids leave due to graduation without playing their 4 seasons, there are no spots available for the next class to get back to 13 in 2022-23
No, there would still be spots left. The schools can continue to go over 13 until all of the kids on the roster this year have moved through the program.

Let's say you have 3 seniors, 4 juniors, 3 sophomores, and 3 freshmen this year, with 3 recruits lined up to replace your outgoing seniors. You're also looking ahead to the next recruiting cycle where you'll have 4 slots available.

Say 2 of 3 three seniors come back next year as you say, so you'd have 15 scholarships being used. So you have 2 "super seniors", 4 seniors, 3 juniors, 3 sophomores, and 3 freshmen.

In your recruiting next year, you'll still have 4 spots available, as the four seniors (or however many decide to come back) will become super seniors and won't count against the limit. So for scholarship calculation purposes for the following season, you'd have 3 seniors, 3 juniors, 3 sophomores, and your 4 freshman slots. (Plus up to 4 non-counting super seniors.)

You don't have to get back down to 13 scholarships after next year...all of the current guys would get a potential extra year tacked on at the end where they don't count against the limit.

At least that's my understanding.

As for the transfer issue, I have not seen how that would be handled...I don't know whether you maintain that year of not counting if you transfer.
 
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thanks SF. I didn't realize the roster expansion goes on for 4 years. for schools, that gets expensive. not sure every school will justify the extra scholarships.

another issue will be playing time on a 25% larger roster for all these sports, especially if carried out for 4 years. PT will obviously be difficult to come by. more athletes on the roster just means more athletes on the bench. more athletes not playing will likely mean even more transfers than usual.
 
Because of our 5-man senior class, we stand to have some of the biggest immediate impact if the guys want to come back. That said, three of the five already sat out a year for various reasons and are currently grad students, so they may just want to move on.

Looking at senior class sizes in the A-10:
5: UR
4: Dayton, GMU
3: Davidson, Duquense, Fordham, SLU
2: GW, La Salle, UMass, URI, SJU, VCU
0: Bona

I feel like things will naturally even out more in subsequent years. Many guys won't want to stick around for the extra year, while some schools will probably shift open scholarships around a bit, and transfers will smooth things out. So there will probably be some combination of impacts including fewer scholarships awarded overall in some upcoming classes and larger rosters that spread PT more thinly.

Like I said, I don't know how transfers are handled, and that's an interesting one. Could you have 10 guys grad transfer into a school and not count against the 13? I wouldn't put it past Kentucky or someone else to take a roster of 20+ studs with some of the transfers just willing to take a shot at getting some PT there or at worst enjoying the ride to a national championship.
 
I don’t get it. They’re having a 25 game season. It probably wasn’t that many years ago that that would be
considered a full season. Am I wrong?
 
You are not wrong, but the precedent has already been set with the fall sports that are still expecting/hoping to get in close full seasons at some point during this year.
 
Because of our 5-man senior class, we stand to have some of the biggest immediate impact if the guys want to come back. That said, three of the five already sat out a year for various reasons and are currently grad students, so they may just want to move on.
for our current grad students athletes ... you can't get a masters degree in one year, can you? I'd think if you started your graduate degree and have the opportunity to finish it for free ... why wouldn't you?
 
Yeah, typically two years of evening courses, although might be able to squeeze it into one if you schedule heavily and they have some summer classes you can take. But not sure if it's really feasible schedule-wise, and I imagine a high course load isn't really of interest to them either with their other commitments.
 
says here “The additional eligibility,” an NCAA spokesperson told the Union-Tribune by email, “is only at the current school (and) cannot be used at a different school.”

I'm not sure if the roster exemption will really carry forward for 4 years, and even if it does I don't think every school will utilize the exemption. if that's true, this really is unfair to current high school kids. there will be fewer spots open, taken by kids who get an extra year even though they might play 27 games this year and have March Madness.
 
one more spot. clearly has to be 6'8" minimum. we can hold for a transfer but I don't think a grad transfer works any more.

a grad transfer that is finished when Matt & Sal graduate leaves Weir as the only big the roster. we'd have to fill 2 big man spots in one class and they'd have to be ready to play as freshmen. that's not ideal.

so I think we'll be in the market for a regular transfer. doesn't matter if he has to sit or not ... nobody seems to anymore. I actually think we should still be in the market to fill the last spot with a HS big man if we can find one. maybe a Euro. seems late for that though.
 
one more spot. clearly has to be 6'8" minimum. we can hold for a transfer but I don't think a grad transfer works any more.

a grad transfer that is finished when Matt & Sal graduate leaves Weir as the only big the roster. we'd have to fill 2 big man spots in one class and they'd have to be ready to play as freshmen. that's not ideal.

so I think we'll be in the market for a regular transfer. doesn't matter if he has to sit or not ... nobody seems to anymore. I actually think we should still be in the market to fill the last spot with a HS big man if we can find one. maybe a Euro. seems late for that though.
Agreed, we have to sign a big man with this last ship. Whether that be transfer, high school, international, really does matter, has to be a big man and to clarify for Mooney, a high quality big man recruit. Don't be grabbing some guy in Spring with offers from American, Mississippi Valley State and IUPUI and try to sell that to us.
 
I am thinking this needs to be a transfer - someone with 2-3 years eligibility remaining. It does not seem like we are in with any hs bigs at the moment, though I am hoping we are and it is just not publicized. I feel like this is a pretty solid class. Really like Nelson's game and ability to make plays and score. Between he and Wilson in frosh class, great shape at the 1 position. SG - I think we have good options between Dji, and Dread. Wing - lots of options with Dji,Dread, Randolph, and now Noyes. All multi positional and I think at least 3 or maybe all have pretty high ceilings, as well as a low bust factor. Still need bigs, and with transfer numbers so high in the game we should be able to present ourselves as a very viable option - just need moon man to do it.
 
I am thinking this needs to be a transfer - someone with 2-3 years eligibility remaining.
Agree. Seems like the odds are in your favor of finding what you need versus hoping you can develop a player. Of course, big man recruiting hasn’t been a strong suit, so we have to hope that the recent positive outlook and the new practice facility can win over a previously highly recruited player that went P5 but can’t get enough playing time, had a coaching change, or just didn’t like the school initially chosen.
 
I suppose we could technically move Nick off of a basketball scholarship for second semester, but ya, nothing's going to happen this year. Even with the NCAA granting nearly every waiver request, they're taking many months to do so.
 
one spot left and in need for a frontcourt player, how can a big man target of ours watch that game yesterday and not want to be part of this?!

I know our staff does this all the time, but this weekend's Grant and Nathan highlights should go out to every big guy we're interested in ... whether it's a senior, junior, or in the transfer portal. this is a fun offense for highly skilled big men.
 
23 is this the kind of guy we want? man if we only landed Grant Williams back then.

 
23 is this the kind of guy we want? man if we only landed Grant Williams back then.

Yes Gkiller, that is the kind of guy I want. SEC POY, NBA player. I saw that but didn't make the connection. If we had landed Grant, we probably are in a nice 6 year run with multiple NCAA appearances. But seriously, I am really hoping we can land a talented big for next season.
 
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