Wichita State Game Observations

plydogg

Team Manager
Mar 2, 2018
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Quinn was a huge get at the time. We got him over programs like Loyola Chicago, Penn State, etc. If we didn't get him Mooney would have been crushed because "He fits our style so well, how could you not get him". Yet, now it is that we have missed out on so many 4/5's. Grace, while nobody seemed to have a lot of faith in after his freshman year, turned into a crucial player for us on an NCAA TOURNAMENT TEAM.
With all due respect, you joined the board 109 days ago. How would you know anything of what people on this board would have said? Or what they said when he signed
 
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plydogg

Team Manager
Mar 2, 2018
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They had shots they could make! WTH are you talking about. He can only draw up so many plays. He can’t pass it to the guys to shoot it. That’s our play makers fault. And we have 2 point guards according to you guys, they can’t create shots? Mooney has to do it?
I’ll bite. Drawing up only 3s for the opening 8 minutes of a game for a team that shoots the 3 poorly is not what I would call setting up the team for success.
 

POMSpidur

Rookie
May 26, 2022
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I’ll bite. Drawing up only 3s for the opening 8 minutes of a game for a team that shoots the 3 poorly is not what I would call setting up the team for success.
So did he make adjustments or didn’t he? Because I thought it was said he did not make adjustments. But if we only shot threes then, what happened the rest of the game…
I guess he should have told them “Isaiah, Tyler, Jason, don’t shoot threes if you’re open.”
I think that might help us. You’re right plydogg, smart thinking man. Silly CM
 

AnnapSpider

Graduate Assistant
May 8, 2003
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Isn’t the “Princeton“ offense suppose to be able to deal with zone.
Did anyone see any of the vaunted Princeton offense? Maybe ai missed it.
 

spider23

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May 31, 2002
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Justin Harper type at the 4? Yeah let’s just get a 7 foot nba guy who can shoot. Who was good for 2 of his 4 years…
He was not near 7 feet. If he was he would be a 15 year starter in the league. I believe at the combine he measured more like 6'7.5 or 6'8. He was not crazy recruited, had a Prividence offer when they weren't as good. If u ask me that is the perfect success story to sell, call me crazy.
 

SpiderK

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Dec 3, 2014
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At his post-game presser last night Mooney said he was surprised by Wichita playing zone. Surprised, really?? Isn't his job not to be surprised?
Agreed, that was the dumbest thing Mooney has ever said. Princeton, hmmm?
 

SpiderK

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Dec 3, 2014
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Quinn was a huge get at the time. We got him over programs like Loyola Chicago, Penn State, etc. If we didn't get him Mooney would have been crushed because "He fits our style so well, how could you not get him". Yet, now it is that we have missed out on so many 4/5's. Grace, while nobody seemed to have a lot of faith in after his freshman year, turned into a crucial player for us on an NCAA TOURNAMENT TEAM.
Quinn, Burton, Bigelow are all fine. It’s the guards that are killing us now. Can’t shoot, turning the ball over and can’t make free throws.
 
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MrTbone

Head Coach
Apr 27, 2005
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My one observation isn’t unique to this game. Why do we not seem to show urgency when we are down at the 4 minute mark in the second half?

Last night we were down 5 I believe with 3:30-ish to go and if you do the math, you’re basically calculating you’ve got 3-4 possessions to make up 5. But it takes us 23 seconds to get our next possession run which in this case just generated a turnover.

It makes me nuts, it feels obvious to me that we have to accelerate our pace.
 

spiderman

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Jun 7, 2001
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Thinking that Quinn was going to be the next Grant or Klein was crazy talk. He is a Patriot League player at best,
are you saying he's no Joe Klein?

Joe-Kleine.jpg
 

VT4700

Graduate Assistant
Dec 16, 2016
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There will be plenty of games Quinn will be a factor in. Some not as much, and that's okay. We don't need Quinn to carry us. We have 6 other guys that should get a lot of minutes every night.

Tyler, Bigelow, and Nelson each need to get 35+, so let's say a combined 105 for them. Goose, Roche, and Grace, when he comes back, need close to 25 each, so let's call that about 70 total for them. Each of these guys could have games where they get 30 minutes, but 70 combined seems right here. We will need offense and 3 point shooting, so that is why I want Roche out there a lot. And, I have seen no issues with his defense to worry me.

This seems like a clear top 6 to me. Best guys play, and these are our top 6, so I would give them at least 175 minutes. So, Quinn and the others can get about 25 minutes. Quinn would be 7th in minutes because he will have some 20 minute games with the right match up. I like Dji only backing up Nelson. 18 minutes was too many the other night. I guess with Grace out we needed to change a little, but 0 shot attempts and 1 point in 18 minutes on a night we scored 53 is just not impactful enough. We need more offense out there, so I would like to see Randolph, and Crab, when he gets back, to get those extra non PG minutes after Goose and Roche. I have been a big Goose guy, but I agree with those who say we need more from him offensively. But, I still have him and Roche as my main guards out there with Nelson. I am a best guys play guy, and would ride our top 6 (7 counting Quinn). Just my opinion, though.
 
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spiderman

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sometimes there's a clear drop off which makes it easy. I don't see it yet.

Burton's a stud. Bigelow and Nelson have flashed enough to make me want them to play a lot. I'd start with giving those three 30 mpg.

after that? meh. Grace had one above average game. I don't think anyone else has.
so I'm still going 9 deep with Grace, Goose, Quinn, Roche, Bailey and Randolph unitl I know who to drop off. Crabtree has to get a look too. I'm hopeful a couple of these guys will step up soon and lock in their spots.
 

MrTbone

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Apr 27, 2005
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sometimes there's a clear drop off which makes it easy. I don't see it yet.

Burton's a stud. Bigelow and Nelson have flashed enough to make me want them to play a lot. I'd start with giving those three 30 mpg.

after that? meh. Grace had one above average game. I don't think anyone else has.
so I'm still going 9 deep with Grace, Goose, Quinn, Roche, Bailey and Randolph unitl I know who to drop off. Crabtree has to get a look too. I'm hopeful a couple of these guys will step up soon and lock in their spots.
I think this is in essence what I was saying. It seems dubious that the guys in those 5-7 (even 8/9) spots have clearly separated, so maybe you give a bit more equal distribution of time and see what is clicking.

I don’t think we project as an at large team, so I’m personally interested in seeing a fair bit of time from guys 5-9 in more even increments to see what lineup is working best.
 

VT4700

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sometimes there's a clear drop off which makes it easy. I don't see it yet.

Burton's a stud. Bigelow and Nelson have flashed enough to make me want them to play a lot. I'd start with giving those three 30 mpg.

after that? meh. Grace had one above average game. I don't think anyone else has.
so I'm still going 9 deep with Grace, Goose, Quinn, Roche, Bailey and Randolph unitl I know who to drop off. Crabtree has to get a look too. I'm hopeful a couple of these guys will step up soon and lock in their spots.
Roche was 4-6 from 3 against No. Iowa. You don't call that above average? Also, he was 2-5 last game from 3. And, his defense has been fine. I think the first 4 games shows we need shooting and offense, so we need him out there a lot. You still dont think we want a healthy Grace out there a lot? Wow.

I'm not saying don't play more than 7. Dji backing up Nelson is 8, and if Randolph and Crab get minutes, that's 10. As long as they don't turn it over, I don't think these guys hurt us if they get some minutes here and there, so I'm not saying don't play them. I am just saying ride the top 6 (7 if we get a good Quinn match up) a lot, and give them most of the minutes because, IMO, we have clear separation.
 

spiderman

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Roche was 4-6 from 3 against No. Iowa. You don't call that above average? Also, he was 2-5 last game from 3. And, his defense has been fine. I think the first 4 games shows we need shooting and offense, so we need him out there a lot. You still dont think we want a healthy Grace out there a lot? Wow.

I'm not saying don't play more than 7. Dji backing up Nelson is 8, and if Randolph and Crab get minutes, that's 10. As long as they don't turn it over, I don't think these guys hurt us if they get some minutes here and there, so I'm not saying don't play them. I am just saying ride the top 6 (7 if we get a good Quinn match up) a lot, and give them most of the minutes because, IMO, we have clear separation.
my mistake with Roche. his Northern Iowa game was very good. so he has one above average game like Matt. no, going 2-5 for 6 points in 26 minutes does not qualify as above average. but yes, Grace and Roche are 4th and 5th so far. Quinn, Goose, Dji and Randolph have all been pedestrian but all should continue to get chances. and Crabtree.
 

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