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What should the billboard say this year?

urfan1 said:
from a reasonable source before sports being canned, T&F had one, Soccer had 3. Don't know they had it accurate, but from one I have respected.
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I had a close personal relationship with our last full-time men's soccer coach. The NCAA at that time provided for a maximum of 9.5 full scholarships for D1 men's soccer. I was told that our men's soccer program had been fully funded during most of the Gettler era, but that it had been gradually scaled back over time. I believe this played a major role in Gettler's departure, and by the time soccer was cut, we were down to something like 5 full schollys (which were divided among about a dozen plus players). Have no idea about track and field.


#NoMoreMooneyTruthing
 
GaySpider said:
I was shocked when I learned that not all D1 players got full rides. I figured any started on a team sport got one.
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Unless you play FB, MBB or WBB, you probably do not receive a full scholarship.

Very few of our athletes are on full athletic scholarships. But, with the accompanying financial aid almost all UR students receive, they do not come anywhere near paying full sticker price and many are on at least a 3/4 academic/athletic scholarship.

Women's T&F/CC can have up to 18 or 18.5 scholarships. Men's T&F/CC maxes out at 12.5 or 12.7, I forget which.

And yes, we have a $2.5 billion endowment. However, it is not unrestricted. You cannot simply take the earnings from that endowment and spent it on whatever you want. Much of the fund is specifically dedicated to endowed professorships, endowed student scholarships, etc.

If you want to contribute to a specific sport/project, indicate as such on your Spider Club donation. That's what I did on my most recent SC donation.
 
The NCAA has maximums for each sport. It is up to each individual school how many scholarships it chooses to award in those sports.
 
GaySpider said:
So , you could have a men's sport, not have the women's sport, but balance it out for Title 9 reasons by just giving more schoolies to the a womans team?
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I believe this is correct. I think (not 100% sure) the underlying theme with Title IX is that spending/money must be equal between men's and women's sports. Scholarships are usually the easiest thing to relate to because if you have a football team with 80 full scholarships, then you need to find that somewhere each year. Easiest way is to give out 80 women's scholarships.
But my understanding as well is that it does not need to be equal right away - you have several years to span it out. i.e. - a school that adds football or does not need to add women's sports the same year. You have time to spread it out and get it over time.
Which makes the soccer and track cut even more perplexing - because we have womens soccer and track - so facilities are the same. Travel costs will be the same, etc. So really - the University cut, as mentioned above - maybe only 5 scholarships in total by cutting those sports?
 
The number of total athletic scholarships awarded, and total number of athletes on every team, should roughly equal the male/female proportion of the student body, within 5% or so.

When we dropped men's soccer and track/CC, we significantly lowered the number of male athletes, even with the addition of lacrosse (cross country and T&F counted as separate sports, even though they included some of the same athletes). That helps with Title IX compliance. All rostered athletes count, not just scholarship athletes.

Facilities, practice times, how teams travel, training/coaching staff, SID staffing, etc., should be equal between comparative sports. If MBB flies, WBB flies also, etc.
 
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Example... golf is allowed 4.5 mens scholarships and UR only gives 3.5. Most sports at UR are not “fully funded”.

http://www.scholarshipstats.com/ncaalimits.html

Looking at that list its amazing how many full rides are given to football compared to other sports. 63 for FCS schools like UR. Football milks the sports program dry. Now I see why Hofstra dropped it years ago. That is tough to sustain.
 
fatherspider said:
Example... golf is allowed 4.5 mens scholarships and UR only gives 3.5. Most sports at UR are not “fully funded”.

http://www.scholarshipstats.com/ncaalimits.html

Looking at that list its amazing how many full rides are given to football compared to other sports. 63 for FCS schools like UR. Football milks the sports program dry. Now I see why Hofstra dropped it years ago. That is tough to sustain.
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FCS Football is 63 including any partials. (so 58 Full + 10 Half = 63) Although it seems to be more difficult to give Half Scholarships anymore.

Basketball and FBS Football count partial scholarships as full scholarships. (so 4 half scholarships in basketball would leave 9 available)
 
That is certainly an issue at some schools.
At some schools, the MBB coach makes more $$$ than all of the other teams' head coaches combined.
 
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There are no half-scholarships in FBS football or D1 basketball. All are full rides.
 
Wood Hall said:
There are no half-scholarships in FBS football or D1 basketball. All are full rides.
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I am not certain it is not allowed, but because it is a head count, no one ever has.
2 half scholarships would reduce your available scholarships by 2 full scholarships.
For instance, if in basketball you gave 2 half scholarships, you could only give 11 full scholarships. So it gives no advantage and only a disadvantage.
 
GaySpider said:
Football cause some schools to go deep into debt
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Anyone know what is the payout structure for FCS football? I assume you get something for making the playoffs and then probably a little more each game you win - similar to the NCAA basketball tournament - but I have no idea.
I would not expect a good FCS program to be making money, but I would think in years you make the playoffs and win a game or two, and if you have a conference with multiple teams (CAA) - I would think you could get close to even?
But again - I have no idea what the payout structure is, anyone know?
 
Here is an interesting poll - who will get let go first.

1) Mooney at UR
2) Beilein at Cleveland

I know Belien has won at every level, but Cleveland is terrible. I think his best bet is to tank this year and next hope to pick up two high picks, but that is risky as a new coach because your already giving in to two losing seasons, and probably a 3rd before you see a turnaround.

Mooney - all he needs to do is make an NCAA this year or next year and you know he locked up for 5 more years.

So short term - Mooney is on the hot seat, but long term - anyones guess.
 
SpiderTrap said:
Anyone know what is the payout structure for FCS football? I assume you get something for making the playoffs and then probably a little more each game you win - similar to the NCAA basketball tournament - but I have no idea.
I would not expect a good FCS program to be making money, but I would think in years you make the playoffs and win a game or two, and if you have a conference with multiple teams (CAA) - I would think you could get close to even?
But again - I have no idea what the payout structure is, anyone know?
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There is none. Sometimes team lost $ on playoff games because you had to put up guarantee (payment TO ncaa) to host games. Those can early round games especially can be hard to sell tickets, and if you didn't sell enough you lost $. If you could sell a lot of tickets that is where you would make some $, but only a few programs can do that, and it would not be much profit. Think of the old NIT basketball model.

Now the NCAA does true seeding but I'm pretty sure you still have to put up some type of guarantee so making any $ is really contingent on ticket sales, which again don't give you all that much except covering costs and the guarantee paid to NCAA.

The NCAA does cover travel costs for away teams.

Anyway there is no payout structure like FBS or NCAA tournament. If you're a big program like NDSU u can make some money but it ain't coming from the NCAA. Most of the rest are just looking to get by. If you get to the neutral site national championship game perhaps there is a nominal payment given the ESPN coverage but I kind of even doubt that.
 
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SpiderTrap said:
Here is an interesting poll - who will get let go first.

1) Mooney at UR
2) Beilein at Cleveland

I know Belien has won at every level, but Cleveland is terrible. I think his best bet is to tank this year and next hope to pick up two high picks, but that is risky as a new coach because your already giving in to two losing seasons, and probably a 3rd before you see a turnaround.

Mooney - all he needs to do is make an NCAA this year or next year and you know he locked up for 5 more years.

So short term - Mooney is on the hot seat, but long term - anyones guess.
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Beilein always takes over bad situations and never been fired. The Cavs may be the worst of them all (tho WVA was also dire) but he's used to rebuilds. Never bet against JB. Plus he's 66 he'll probably retire first.

Granted we have Jabba as AD and apparently here at UR we give out lifetime contracts so the answer is probably none of the above.
 
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GKiller said:
Beilein always takes over bad situations and never been fired. The Cavs may be the worst of them all (tho WVA was also dire) but he's used to rebuilds. Never bet against JB. Plus he's 66 he'll probably retire first.

Granted we have Jabba as AD and apparently here at UR we give out lifetime contracts so the answer is probably none of the above.
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So do you think JB took the job knowing they will be no good in the next 3-4 years and if he just takes the paycheck and coaches till he is 70 - he can then resign at that point?

Maybe a better question then - who has more wins next year - the Cavs or Spiders.

Note - the Cavs only won 19 games last season.
 
SpiderTrap said:
So do you think JB took the job knowing they will be no good in the next 3-4 years and if he just takes the paycheck and coaches till he is 70 - he can then resign at that point?
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Nope not at all. He'll turn it around quicker than expected. Also he had a secure very high paying job at Michigan. He didn't take the Cavs for a paycheck he took it for the challenge. Maybe he coaches past 70 I don't know but he's 66 and had heart surgery, he's closer to retiring that's all.
 
GKiller said:
Nope not at all. He'll turn it around quicker than expected. Also he had a secure very high paying job at Michigan. He didn't take the Cavs for a paycheck he took it for the challenge. Maybe he coaches past 70 I don't know but he's 66 and had heart surgery, he's closer to retiring that's all.
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I wouldn't discount the paycheck either. He was making nearly 3.4 million at Michigan. I have not seen a figure yet for his NBA salary - but he did get a 5 year deal - so technically they have him coaching until 71. But if you look at the following list of NBA coaches salaries and pretty safe to assume he would not take a paycut to go coach one of the worst teams in the league - I think it is safe to estimate he is getting between $5-6 million a year in the NBA. If he is not - then he is not as smart as I thought he was. But seeing two recent college coaches on there - Donovan (6 million) and Hoiberg (5 million) makes me think between 5-6 million. Money was definetley a factor. Yes - he wants the challenge - but this is a nice a little nest egg as well he is setting up in his final years for his grand kids.

https://www.boydsbets.com/highest-paid-coaches-nba/

I could also see him as well - maybe being an assistant on his son's Patrick' staff if he is still a head coach when JB leaves the pros. That would be a great storyline - his first assistant coach job will be under his son.
 
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SpiderTrap said:
I wouldn't discount the paycheck either. He was making nearly 3.4 million at Michigan. I have not seen a figure yet for his NBA salary - but he did get a 5 year deal - so technically they have him coaching until 71. But if you look at the following list of NBA coaches salaries and pretty safe to assume he would not take a paycut to go coach one of the worst teams in the league - I think it is safe to estimate he is getting between $5-6 million a year in the NBA. If he is not - then he is not as smart as I thought he was. But seeing two recent college coaches on there - Donovan (6 million) and Hoiberg (5 million) makes me think between 5-6 million. Money was definetley a factor. Yes - he wants the challenge - but this is a nice a little nest egg as well he is setting up in his final years for his grand kids.

https://www.boydsbets.com/highest-paid-coaches-nba/

I could also see him as well - maybe being an assistant on his son's Patrick' staff if he is still a head coach when JB leaves the pros. That would be a great storyline - his first assistant coach job will be under his son.
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Didn't discount it. Yes he's getting paid more but it is assumed he'd get at minimum nba fair market value, but likely even higher given his stature.

I was answering your absurd question insinuating he took the job just to be bad for many years and collect a paycheck.

He had his eye on NBA for a while, and likes challenges, especially with Cavs being a young team to mold. The NBA and the challenge were the drivers of the move. He's a mega millionaire the $$ comes with the territory.

Not sure you get the $ part anyway, I remember u saying moving expenses were 1 reason not to leave WVA for the Michigan job. Still one of the all time unintentionally funny statements on this board imo.
 
GKiller said:
Didn't discount it. Yes he's getting paid more but it is assumed he'd get at minimum nba fair market value, but likely even higher given his stature.

I was answering your absurd question insinuating he took the job just to be bad for many years and collect a paycheck.

He had his eye on NBA for a while, and likes challenges, especially with Cavs being a young team to mold. The NBA and the challenge were the drivers of the move. He's a mega millionaire the $$ comes with the territory.

Not sure you get the $ part anyway, I remember u saying moving expenses were 1 reason not to leave WVA for the Michigan job. Still one of the all time unintentionally funny statements on this board imo.
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I dont recall the moving expenses quote - I think the statement I said was the buyout at WVU was a couple million and I remember Michigan did not want to pay it all for him. The original buyout was 2.5 million and Michigan was balking at paying that as most schools will pick up the tab. I think my statement was more likely - I would not take the Michigan job unless they agree to pay the full buyout - because in all fairness, if they really want you - they should pay to get you. I assume they did this and it all worked out in the end.
I just have a different perspective on college coaches having talked with a few of them in the past - and listen to talk shows on the radio. Yes - they all love challenges, they all want a chance to win the title but at the end of the day - they also have egos to go with it. And only 1 person can win it all each year. But the next best thing - is being the highest paid and that, in my opinion - drives a lot of them when they get to that high of level.
 
SpiderTrap said:
I dont recall the moving expenses quote - I think the statement I said was the buyout at WVU was a couple million and I remember Michigan did not want to pay it all for him. The original buyout was 2.5 million and Michigan was balking at paying that as most schools will pick up the tab. I think my statement was more likely - I would not take the Michigan job unless they agree to pay the full buyout - because in all fairness, if they really want you - they should pay to get you. I assume they did this and it all worked out in the end.
I just have a different perspective on college coaches having talked with a few of them in the past - and listen to talk shows on the radio. Yes - they all love challenges, they all want a chance to win the title but at the end of the day - they also have egos to go with it. And only 1 person can win it all each year. But the next best thing - is being the highest paid and that, in my opinion - drives a lot of them when they get to that high of level.
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Your assumption is wrong. Beilein paid the buyout to WVA personally.
 
Pretty sure JB doesn't need the money. Not saying money was a non-factor but it terms of why JB went to Cleveland, I would say money ranks pretty far down the list. Wanting to coach at the highest level in the NBA and prove he can do it there, probably number 1 for JB.

That has been his MO his entire career.
 
If I had to guess - I think a big part of why he jumped now to the NBA was because of the state of NCAA hoops, especially with the FBI probe. JB has always been a guy that prides himself in running a clean program and following every single rule that NCAA puts out there. But I think he was realizing - it is impossible to compete when no one else follows those same rules or beliefs.
How do you expect to beat Kansas, Kentucky, Duke, UNC, etc - when you know they are paying kids and breaking rules left and right and there is really nothing the NCAA can do about it. When you get to the level of Michigan - you have to make a choice, join them - or try to beat them otherwise, but you chances are very diminished. Your then hoping you get kids who stick around at least 3 years before turning pro - which just doesn't happen much anymore. UVA pulled it off - but look at them - they lost as a 16 seed, then won it the next year. And this year - will likely come back to earth until Bennett can find some kids to replicate that type of success.
 
SpiderTrap said:
If I had to guess - I think a big part of why he jumped now to the NBA was because of the state of NCAA hoops, especially with the FBI probe. JB has always been a guy that prides himself in running a clean program and following every single rule that NCAA puts out there. But I think he was realizing - it is impossible to compete when no one else follows those same rules or beliefs.
How do you expect to beat Kansas, Kentucky, Duke, UNC, etc - when you know they are paying kids and breaking rules left and right and there is really nothing the NCAA can do about it. When you get to the level of Michigan - you have to make a choice, join them - or try to beat them otherwise, but you chances are very diminished. Your then hoping you get kids who stick around at least 3 years before turning pro - which just doesn't happen much anymore. UVA pulled it off - but look at them - they lost as a 16 seed, then won it the next year. And this year - will likely come back to earth until Bennett can find some kids to replicate that type of success.
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What do you think the highest level is a team can reach in the NCAA before they have to start paying players?
 
GaySpider said:
What do you think the highest level is a team can reach in the NCAA before they have to start paying players?
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I was under the impression that pay would be primarily for the players, not the team, i.e., that if a player's likeness was marketable then he/she would be able to share the profit a school or outside entity made from selling gear or other merchandise that promoted the player. However, I guess that if the team or school is a marketable commodity, take Bama or Clemson, for example, then the school or team would benefit as well. Not sure how such teams might distribute the benefits among its players.

I'm sure that this will change the landscape of collegiate sports, but at first blush, it does seem fair that a player whose athletic skills warrant commercial marketing should at least share the benefit of that marketing.
IMO, it also seems that we may be on the path to reestablishing collegiate sports as truer amateur endeavors if we can separate the commercial sports from the schools to which they are today attached and place them within a commercial domain. A huge task, for sure, but worth consideration.
 
invinoveritasinaquasanitas said:
I was under the impression that pay would be primarily for the players, not the team, i.e., that if a player's likeness was marketable then he/she would be able to share the profit a school or outside entity made from selling gear or other merchandise that promoted the player. However, I guess that if the team or school is a marketable commodity, take Bama or Clemson, for example, then the school or team would benefit as well. Not sure how such teams might distribute the benefits among its players.

I'm sure that this will change the landscape of collegiate sports, but at first blush, it does seem fair that a player whose athletic skills warrant commercial marketing should at least share the benefit of that marketing.
IMO, it also seems that we may be on the path to reestablishing collegiate sports as truer amateur endeavors if we can separate the commercial sports from the schools to which they are today attached and place them within a commercial domain. A huge task, for sure, but worth consideration.
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Good answer, but let me clarify:

At what level do you think teams are currently offering under the table cash payments to players?

I am pretty sure, based on nothing but conjecture and what I see on line, that all starters on p6 football teams get some illegal cash.

I'd also say all P6 basketball teams scholarship players, and even "walk ons" get some kind of bennies.

Not meant as a smear, and I think the NCAA rules are stupid so this isn't a moral judgement.

Also those schools with big time aspirations, like USF, Boise State, and Liberty are probably paying to get some good recruits to come in and build up the program.

I think Michigan's Fab 5 and Cam Newton's whole thing is the tip of the iceberg, and if you start pulling the thread a lot would unravel.(Which the current FBI investigation might do)

Did anyone ever see Blue Chips with Nick Nolte?
Boosters get jobs for kids relatives, pay off mortgages, provide cars. But come on.

For basketball, I bet every "one and done " gets something.

Just speculating here
 
spiderman said:
The NCAA's top decision-makers voted unanimously Tuesday to allow college athletes to profit from their name, image and likeness "in a manner consistent with the collegiate model."
https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/27957981/ncaa-votes-allow-athletes-profit-likeness
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Now that helps relieve some of my concern on how vaguely some of these proposals have been worded.

My original thought-
A booster would buy an autographed photo of a player for $3.2 million the day before he announces which institution he was going to attend...
 
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To address the original topic, personally I will be supporting all aspects of the basketball program.

However individual aspects of it will be reevaluated on December 7...
 
Good troll to the Mafia here. Almost as funny is that some of the moron vcu fans think it was a troll towards them. Others have a point...that's the billboard? I like simple & classic & I'm no marketing guy but shouldn't we be promoting how to buy tickets or something.

 
At least basketball is spelled correctly. But isn't our team name "Spiders"?
 
ur2K said:
At least basketball is spelled correctly. But isn't our team name "Spiders"?
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Yes, but since there is only one player featured on the billboard, it therefore becomes "Spider" basketball. I don't like his odds against Vandy, but I guess we'll see...
 
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