Playing Time

[MrTbone]

Yeah, I just found it interesting that the "new"guys were mentioned prominently (meaning all three freshmen and Marshall) along with trey. Five guys for basically two spots.

Not mentioned much was Deion. Could be because he's not a shiny new object though.

 

[keefusb]

I think Deion spends most of his time as a 4 or even a defensive 5.

 

[PhillySpider]

I honestly think that to be as good as we all want to be, we need to hope we see some real changes in the lineup/playing time distribution and that those changes are the result of one or two guys emerging and forcing their way in!

What was basically this group (plus an all-timer in our program and a solid contributor in ANO) has actually been a little disappointing ever since Ced went down with injury two years ago. I really believe its a "make-up" issue. Not the make-up of any individual player, but the make-up of the team and how it fits together. Guys like DT and TD are very good on D, but really can't contribute on offense (especially ours) while other guys (like SDJ and TJ and somewhat KA last year) are really great offensive players, but can be exploited on defense (especially our defense). Add in that both DT and TJ have been underwhelming as rebounders. So, our expected lineup (TJ,DT,TA, SDJ, TD) isn't great on O or on D or off the glass - - no signature etc. This also leads to all that situational substitution stuff and different rotations game to game etc.; all of which really hurts continuity and confidence.

Any/all of these players can be effective members of good or even very good teams, but I think time has shown that these players don't fit together as a group well enough to excel. Can they be decent/good - - sure, and they have been already, but to really excel and push to the Top levels of the A10 and clearly earn a NCAA bid etc., I think we need to find some other contributors who push some incumbents into more supporting roles. In short, our players best suited to be role players need to be role players and not major players.


I don't expect any of these players to be significantly different players than they were before, so I think we need to hope that a couple of guys really emerge as guys who can both defend and score and enable us to put some better balanced line-ups out there and then supplement that with the "specialist" types. For example, I really think Wood COULD be key. If he can emerge at the 3 as a guy who can shoot consistently, while also being a solid defender who also rebounds well for a three, then we can maybe live with TD at the 2 for some longer stretches. This lineup would be fairly big and defensive, but with much better offense than when we had DT at the 4 and TA the 3. But its a big IF - - Wood needs to actually shoot/score it well and not be a significant downgrade from DT defensively. If he's only better offensively and much worse defensively, we still have the same problem. If they both end up playing like 20 minutes or so a game, we'll know we haven't really solved the problem - - just sort of added more of the same!

 

[Ulla1]

Great post, Philly. Agree 100%. OSC

 

[SouthJerseySpiderFan]

Super writeup Philly! Feeling the same way as you. Depth of talented players suiting up for UR these days means CM way of giving more playing time to upperclassmen won't get this team where it wants to be.

Expect to see TA, TJ, and SDJ to get 30 minutes but who knows beyond that. Maybe KF even pushes SDJ for time. Yes, Wood providing an offensive boost would be big. Expect to see Julius and Pisto given more time than frosh usually get under CM to see if they have it especially with the two local stars arriving next year.

 

[97spiderfan]

Philly, excellent post. I might nitpick that part that TJ is not great in our defense (I think his defense got much better as the year went along). Deion and Trey on an NCAA caliber team are probably your 6th and 7th guys off the bench, versus starters. I have wanted Trey as our 6th man for the past several years because I think that is a role that suits his playing style best. We might survive with one of them as a starter, but not both and be an NCAA team. That is not to diminish their critical role on the team, both of them probably need to garner 20 minutes a game for us to be successful, we just can't be giving them 30 minutes per in a starter's role capacity.

If we are going to be an NCAA team this year, it will have to mean that one (or more) of our new players is able to step in and play a significant role in this years team. If we just roll out with the same team we had last year (minus Kendall and ANO), it would be difficult to see us being anything more than what we were last year. This is also probably why some of the national prognosticator rank us a bit lower.

 

[spiderman]

I think this board undervalues Trey and Deion a bit. I know they don't shoot it all that well, but they're ridiculously strong, terrific defenders, great athletes, and leaders. we'll see the best of them their senior year. expecting a freshman or an incoming transfer to be a major step up is asking a lot.

I agree I don't love them both on the floor all the time because of the shooting. but I always want one on the floor, and they can combine at times. and we ARE going to dance with them.

 

[97spiderfan]

S-Man, Good points on Trey and Deion. As for new guys stepping in, Marshall Wood is a junior transfer from a BCS program, he has been playing college basketball in some capacity for 3 years now, I think he should be ready. Big difference between a college transfer and a true freshman.

 

[spiderman]

agreed, I hope for a lot from Wood. and Fore got his feet wet so he's not a true freshman. and we've heard the other freshmen can play. but I think Deion and Trey will be a huge part of what we accomplish this season, and I don't think that's going to hold us back at all.

 

[PhillySpider]

I don't think I underestimate DT or TD. I honestly think some people overate their defensive contributions. Especially DT since being a great defender as a big absolutely requires that you be a very good rebounder too!

They are great defenders. But they are very limited and that keeps them from being great players. DT is also a big and bigs who can't score absolutely have to rebound - - he's just not been a great rebounder either. That doesn't diminish from his defensive ability, but it limits his total contribution. TD is similar in that he is a great defender, but not only doesn't shoot it great, he's not a great ball handler or passer. They are not necessarily bad at some of these other things - - but just average. So, excellent on D, OK in some other areas and "challenged" on offense (and at the line). That adds up to me to guys best suited as role players to give you like 15 minutes and maybe a few more on nights someone is in foul trouble or they seem to be really effective or we absolutely need a shut down defender on a superstar etc. As discussed numerous times here, they especially can't play together much unless its late game defensive possessions (and even then its risky cause we don't want them getting fouled if/when we get the ball back). Starting one is probably fine but the rotation should generally be moving one of them in as the other moves out except in very particular game circumstances.

 

[keefusb]

TD is probably the best rebounder on the team, among other things he brings to the table. I do wish he was a better FT shooter, but you can't have everything.

I predict both TD and DT will either start, or get starters minutes. They will definitely be on the floor at the same time, just a question of how much.

 

[CatfishKhan]

TD is similar in that he is a great defender, but not only doesn't shoot it great, he's not a great ball handler or passer.

Trey Davis was third on the team in assists and DT was the only starter last year with fewer turnovers. Trey is also our #2 returning rebounder. We will be just fine with him out on the court for 30+ minutes. Deion Taylor is the one we need to pick up his game or get pushed to the bench. DT had a bad offensive year last year, but I think there is an excellent chance we will get a small bump from him this year, particularly if his back troubles are over.

 

[97spiderfan]

This is why I think many stats are overrated: The reason DT had so few turnovers is because he is basically a stationary player on offense. The other starters had more turnovers because they were attempting far more shots, drives, etc... As for Trey being 3rd on the team in assists. He was our starting 2 guard last year who played 30 minutes per game. By pure happenstance, he would have to be Top 3 on the team in assists.

 

[NewURfan]

These two guys are our best role players to the three scorers we have. The thing that keeps the " make up" of the team in question is the style of play we identify ourselves with. We run a system where it requires shooters on the floor. Our production with slashing athletes that don't fit this system has been poor when these guys are constantly open. There so call offensive abilities shooting wise is limited thus we call them liabilities. IMO we should play to teams overall strengths where it helps our athletes confidence and production on offense. .not saying totally change system but add more philosophies just like we add new talent each year.

We need TD and DT experience and energy to win. We just need to find a way at certain intervals during the game where the game flow allows when either one or both on the floor at the same time they can contribute at both ends.

Predidiction:
This will be TD and DT funnest and best year..

 

[CatfishKhan]

Among returning players Trey Davis is:

#2 in rebounding (to Terry Allen)
#2 in assists (to Shawndre Jones)
#2 in steals (to Terry Allen)
#3 in blocks
#4 in turnovers

He is not a star, but he is not a bench player.

 

[ur2K]

TD is a pretty good ball-handler. He shouldered a pretty big load in the games against that team on Broad Street with very few TOs

 

[spiderman]

Deion had more rebounds per minute played than Trey and TJ. ANO and Terry were better.
we're going to need Deion this year. he's a big part of this team.

 

[keefusb]

Not to diminish TD's ball handling skills, but I believe that SDJ and K0 shouldered most of that load against Broad Street Community College last season.

 

[ur2K]

Not to diminish TD's ball handling skills, but I believe that SDJ and K0 shouldered most of that load against Broad Street Community College last season.

SDJ only played 16 mins at their place. TD played 34 with one TO. That's the performance I'm thinking of.

 

[CatfishKhan]

Deion had more rebounds per minute played than Trey and TJ. ANO and Terry were better.
we're going to need Deion this year. he's a big part of this team.

Yes he had more minutes per rebound than those two, but just barely. I think if one of TD or DT gets pushed to the bench, it will be DT. It is the prediction that both will get pushed to the bench and see much reduced playing time that is unrealistic. I'm not going to predict DT to the bench, but I wouldn't be surprised if it happened.

 

[TBSpyder]

I trust CM to get it right, who plays where and for how many minutes. I do disagree that Trey played many minutes as a 2. When I look at the statistics, there were very few minutes a game, where there weren't two true guards on the court. Usually it was Kendall and SDJ, with JJ subbing for SDJ. If we were pressured, sometimes Trey and even, Terry, would come back, and receive the ball, and bring it into the frontcourt. Trey played mostly as a 3. But with much talent in the frontcourt, it is conceivable that Trey might play a few more minutes at the 2 this year. Lots of decisions for CM to make. In less than a month, we'll have a clue as to what he's decided.

 

[SouthJerseySpiderFan]

Seeing any of these starting 5's to begin the season would make me feel good about what must have went down in preseason practice/scrimmages.

TA, TJ,, TD, JJones SDJ
TA, TJ, MW, TD, SDJ
TA, TJ, TD, Julius/Pisto, SDJ

Plenty of interchangeable parts and CM has his work cut out for him in finding the right mix. With WF, WV, Cal/SDS, Fla included in the first 7 games hopefully coach gets it right early.

That being said with some tough road OOC games a 8-4 and even 7-5 record wouldn't surprise me as long as team looks good going into conference play.

 

[urmite]

I trust CM to get it right, who plays where and for how many minutes. I do disagree that Trey played many minutes as a 2. When I look at the statistics, there were very few minutes a game, where there weren't two true guards on the court. Usually it was Kendall and SDJ, with JJ subbing for SDJ. If we were pressured, sometimes Trey and even, Terry, would come back, and receive the ball, and bring it into the frontcourt. Trey played mostly as a 3. But with much talent in the frontcourt, it is conceivable that Trey might play a few more minutes at the 2 this year. Lots of decisions for CM to make. In less than a month, we'll have a clue as to what he's decided.

In the last 5 games of last season, TD played 35-45% of his minutes with only one other guard on the floor. The rest he was at the 3, either as a guard or forward.

 

[spiderman]

Seeing any of these starting 5's to begin the season would make me feel good about what must have went down in preseason practice/scrimmages.

TA, TJ,, TD, JJones SDJ
TA, TJ, MW, TD, SDJ
TA, TJ, TD, Julius/Pisto, SDJ

Plenty of interchangeable parts and CM has his work cut out for him in finding the right mix. With WF, WV, Cal/SDS, Fla included in the first 7 games hopefully coach gets it right early.

That being said with some tough road OOC games a 8-4 and even 7-5 record wouldn't surprise me as long as team looks good going into conference play.

I'm hoping for option 3, assuming Julius or Jesse (or Khwan) is ready.

 

[sdspider]

SouthJers, don't forget about Fore. The guard spot is intriguing, with Fore and the two frosh JJ and TD all having a shot to play there. I agree it will be very interesting to see what lineups work. I am hoping Wood breaks in and shows enough to equalize DT's playing time. So we can have that balance of D and scoring. We've got so many options its exciting. And what about PF, how much time does he get?

The only thing I know is that Mooney favors experience, so I expect to see a lot of time with TD and DT on the floor. Just hoping its not always together, so we can have that 4th shooting threat, instead of only three out there.

 

[keefusb]

I think KF will play around 10 minutes a game this season, if for no other reason than to give SDJ a break at the point. I don't see him and SDJ playing a lot together unless we are trying to beat sustained full court pressure. Good news it that we will have KF and his freaky athleticism for 4 more years.

 

[Ulla1]

I think KF will play around 10 minutes a game this season, if for no other reason than to give SDJ a break at the point. I don't see him and SDJ playing a lot together unless we are trying to beat sustained full court pressure. Good news it that we will have KF and his freaky athleticism for 4 more years.

Moreover, Khwan made 87% of his free throws in high school.

 

[Not-A-Homer]

Seeing any of these starting 5's to begin the season would make me feel good about what must have went down in preseason practice/scrimmages.

TA, TJ,, TD, JJones SDJ
TA, TJ, MW, TD, SDJ
TA, TJ, TD, Julius/Pisto, SDJ

Plenty of interchangeable parts and CM has his work cut out for him in finding the right mix. With WF, WV, Cal/SDS, Fla included in the first 7 games hopefully coach gets it right early.

That being said with some tough road OOC games a 8-4 and even 7-5 record wouldn't surprise me as long as team looks good going into conference play.

TA, TJ, TD, Julius/Pisto, SDJ
Mix in heavy doses of Marshall Wood & Kwan Fore, add situational DT, and you have identified what many believe can be an NCAA team.

However, Chris Mooney is coach, and I suspect that he will see it differently. I concede that it is his gun club.

 

[sdspider]

DT you would think has the most playing time to lose, but I wonder if that's really going to be the case. Any wagers? I'd love for him to surprise us all. He's got the hops just think he needs some confidence.

Anybody know how many minutes Anthony averaged as a frosh? I remember Mooney saying he was too good to leave off the floor and he ended up winning the A10 rookie of the year. Will we see something like that again?

Can't wait for the season to start.

 

[Ferrum Spider]

I think a player like Wood is going to command more and more playing time as the season goes on. Remember seeing tek play uva when he was a freshman and remember thinking he's the only guy on that team I'd take on roster at that time for our team. He was in a bad situation at tech and I imagine a change of scenery will do him well. Not sure where he's going to factor in early on as it takes time to adjust offensively and defensively, but I see him having a major impact by seasons end.

 

[fan2011]

DT you would think has the most playing time to lose, but I wonder if that's really going to be the case. Any wagers? I'd love for him to surprise us all. He's got the hops just think he needs some confidence.

Anybody know how many minutes Anthony averaged as a frosh? I remember Mooney saying he was too good to leave off the floor and he ended up winning the A10 rookie of the year. Will we see something like that again?

Can't wait for the season to start.

K0 actually played more as a freshman than as a sophomore. He played over 25 minutes a game as a freshman. Here are some other players we have and the minutes they got as freshmen:

Terry Allen: 13.3
SDJ: 13.7
ANO: 19.2
Trey: 12.6
Deion: 14.6
Ced: 16.5

Losing K0, ANO and possibly Josh means that we have ~70 minutes per game up for grab (~35% of all available minutes). We will see freshmen get a lot of time this year.

 

[urfan1]

it's a combination of the returning players and the talent of the incoming players.

 

[97spiderfan]

We are used to the most recent past couple of years, where freshman didn't play hardly at all (outside of SDJ). That was largely due to those freshman not being very good.

 

[Ulla1]

We are used to the most recent past couple of years, where freshman didn't play hardly at all (outside of SDJ). That was largely due to those freshman not being very good.

Also due to the fact that Khwan was injured. OSC

 

[URWeb95]

I think your regular 8 man rotation is DT, TA, Cline, TD, SDJ, MW, KF and whomever is more ready (Johnson or Pistokache). I think Friendshuh may get some limited time as well. If and when Josh Jones is reinstated, he could take the minutes assigned to either Johnson or Pistokache. My thought is that Dominaus redshirts but I have not heard that officially.