Peter Thomas back as an assistant coach
- Thread starter Eight Legger
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not shocked at all. he does have 15 years of coaching and 5 as associate head coach. so experience is there.
Does the Earth revolve around the sun? Does Mooney fill his staff with former players? Kind of the same answer to both. What I'm shocked by, is why no one on this board thought of Peter Thomas as the obvious answer to this question.
*cough*
(Yes, I know I dismissed it.)
richmond.forums.rivals.com
(Yes, I know I dismissed it.)
Rob Jones gone
Well - with Jay Wright stepping down and Fordham coach possibly taking over - there are a handful of coaches in flux right now that might pick up the phone if Mooney called.
richmond.forums.rivals.com
Prescient nonetheless. Take a bow.*cough*
(Yes, I know I dismissed it.)
Rob Jones gone
Well - with Jay Wright stepping down and Fordham coach possibly taking over - there are a handful of coaches in flux right now that might pick up the phone if Mooney called.
I should have known you would have been on that. If we ever have a top poster award for this message board, you have my vote.*cough*
(Yes, I know I dismissed it.)
Rob Jones gone
Well - with Jay Wright stepping down and Fordham coach possibly taking over - there are a handful of coaches in flux right now that might pick up the phone if Mooney called.
Glad to have Peter back - but this is not a surprise. Mooney typically thinks inside the box on these types of hires, so no shock this is the same.
And from Peter's perspective - this is a good business decision on his part. I would think and hope that even our new promoted assistant - Gipe, makes more than the top assistant at Campbell. And I am thinking Pete might move in as a top assistant and within a year or two, he gets Associate Head Coach title. Not to mention - from a career standpoint, it looks like McGeehan is stuck at Campbell. He is not really losing enough for Campbell to get rid of him (2nd and 3rd place finishes in conference past 2 years) - and not winning enough to move on elsewhere. And there is a chance - with another bad year or two, he gets fired and Pete is looking for a job. But come back to UR, Mooney just made improbable NCAA run with A10 title, and Pete knows it is probably another 4-5 years before UR thinks about firing Mooney again. And long term - If Mooney and staff are able to string together another NCAA appearance or two in the next 3-5 years, Thomas will get some credit and maybe an interview or two at lower level schools. OR - he sticks around long term with Mooney and maybe is in line to take over head coach at UR when the time comes - assuming Mooney leaves after a successful run.
So really - makes a lot of sense from Peter's perspective. And this makes sense from Mooney's side as this has been done many times before.
And from Peter's perspective - this is a good business decision on his part. I would think and hope that even our new promoted assistant - Gipe, makes more than the top assistant at Campbell. And I am thinking Pete might move in as a top assistant and within a year or two, he gets Associate Head Coach title. Not to mention - from a career standpoint, it looks like McGeehan is stuck at Campbell. He is not really losing enough for Campbell to get rid of him (2nd and 3rd place finishes in conference past 2 years) - and not winning enough to move on elsewhere. And there is a chance - with another bad year or two, he gets fired and Pete is looking for a job. But come back to UR, Mooney just made improbable NCAA run with A10 title, and Pete knows it is probably another 4-5 years before UR thinks about firing Mooney again. And long term - If Mooney and staff are able to string together another NCAA appearance or two in the next 3-5 years, Thomas will get some credit and maybe an interview or two at lower level schools. OR - he sticks around long term with Mooney and maybe is in line to take over head coach at UR when the time comes - assuming Mooney leaves after a successful run.
So really - makes a lot of sense from Peter's perspective. And this makes sense from Mooney's side as this has been done many times before.
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And I think this is a the perfect for UR administration. Imagine if we did win a lot and gathered a lot of attention, and needed to constantly upgrade facilities, increase recruiting, admissions, etc. I think the administration likes it right where its at. We make the tourney every so often, we win more than we lose, we are competitive, but not ot the point of taking that step that would require that next level investment.
Of course it makes sense from Peter's perspective and from Mooney's as well. Does it make sense from a UR basketball program perspective is the better question. That answer is a lot less clear cut. Time will tell. But yeah, this was low hanging fruit for Mooney and Peter Thomas.
I think the administration would be fine if we win a lot.
If we went to the NCAA every year and won more than we lost each year when we got there for 10 years, why would there be a need to upgrade anything?
There was a noteworthy enthusiasm bump from this years tournament appearance. I think Hallock wants to experience that again and frequently.
They would be fine to a point. But with winning, comes more pressure to stay on top and in the world of college basketball - that means spending more money. Granted - if your making more appearances, you should have more money to spend - but the more you do that, the more you emphasize Athletics. And I don't think UR administration wants to be known for athletics. I think they like that we have a "good" and "competitive" athletics program, especially in basketball and football. But past that - they don't want too much success, that would draw too much attention to the wrong thing at UR - sports, and not the books.
I don’t think they’re mutually exclusive. No one is questioning duke’a academic creds just because their bball program is a winner.
but yes, perhaps the costs go up. No real way to know other than giving it a whirl.
McGeehan isn’t going anywhere. With the exception of one year, he’s been consistently competitive since about 2016. That’s all Campbell wants.
But Duke is okay with being known first as Duke Basketball. Its a great school - but when you say Duke - I am willing to bet 90% plus of general public think "basketball" and Duke - once they turned things around with Coach K - was willing to invest and keep it going. They continue to invest even today in everything they do. And I would argue - Duke in as a whole University has reaped the benefits of that good basketball team. But Duke administration made the decision many years ago - lets ride this train and see where it takes us. And it ended up taking them to a very special place.
Mooney adds Peter Thomas to Men's Basketball staff - University of Richmond Athletics
RICHMOND, Va. – Peter Thomas has been hired as an assistant coach, Richmond men's basketball head coach Chris Mooney announced Tuesday.
richmondspiders.com
I think the administration is also happy that their aren't petitions, billboards and the like questioning their wisdom and decision making around athletics. I think the administration is probably also happy with their fundraising hauls they geared around our tournament run. I think the administration may have resolved that they were OK not going to the tournament and then we actually went to the tournament and realized all of the really great shit that happens when you make the tournament and maybe they think a little bit differently now.
You would think they would "think a little bit differently now" - but remember, we made back to back appearances and that didn't change their thinking. But one trip to dance is not going to change their mind - it is up to Mooney and the team to make multiple trips in a short time frame to show them the way. Otherwise - they will be perfectly content with making the tourney every so often and look at as a bonus, and not something we should expect.
Well Trap, this is the debate we had been having for awhile now. It did seem like the admin is all in, or pretty far in the last several years - with some (cough, cough looks in mirror) claiming the only piece was not upgrading at coach. We got: shiny new practice facility, charters to games, renovated RC (top 3 arena in A10 now), relaxed admissions for hoops (straight from the horses , er posters mouth), etc etc. So other than upgrading conferences and the such, not sure how much more you think admin can do? I do agree that it now falls on Mooney. Since the beginning of March, he certainly is doing his part, but will be nice to see continuation of the trend. He certainly got out of his comfort zone by brining in some transfers that should be competing for immediate playing time. That is a good first step. I think this year will have more challenges on how to manage chemistry, playing time, etc than he has faced in the past. We typically can map out the minutes fairly accurately at this time of year for the next season. I think we should have 12 guys expecting big minutes and big roles this year, 10 at least as no idea Noyes and Dread's mindset. But have to think everyone else (excluding Walz too) potentially thinks of themself as a starter, or 20 minute guy. Should be a very interesting season with some high expectations again.
Even the guys most of us on this board are not expecting to have big roles, may be expecting it - and based on our resident insiders comments seems to be the case. We were told to look out (paraphrasing) for Randolph's contributions this year, and also one insider had Noyes in the starting lineup pre-transfers. And if I am those guys, I didn't come here to sit on the bench for 730+ days of my hoops life. No way.
where do some of you get your opinions on what the administration (Hardt?) is and isn't happy with?
did anything really changed with the administration? was the adminstration holding us back in anyway?
nobody's been denied admission in a long time but that doesn't prove relaxed admission standards. maybe the same guys with questionable academics would be denied still today. maybe we've just been recruiting guys that fit academically.
the arena upgrades and practice facility were funded by donors ... mainly the one that most seem to like to complain about. he certainly hasn't been holding us back.
did anything really changed with the administration? was the adminstration holding us back in anyway?
nobody's been denied admission in a long time but that doesn't prove relaxed admission standards. maybe the same guys with questionable academics would be denied still today. maybe we've just been recruiting guys that fit academically.
the arena upgrades and practice facility were funded by donors ... mainly the one that most seem to like to complain about. he certainly hasn't been holding us back.
We also have a different President, Athletic Director, BOT, and many other in position of influence now than we did last time we made the tournament. UR isn't some stoic institutional body that never changes. While, I agree we have some institutional bias towards academics, we have done a lot of different things to show we want to make a bigger impact (upgraded arena, brand new practice facility).
We might go right back into our rut again, that is entirely possible, but I am choosing to believe now that some folks have seen the light (Hallock sure did seem to have a great time at the A-10 tournament and NCAA tournament). I think Mooney certainly has some pep in his step as evidenced by the recruits he just picked up. I bet we raised a lot of money and brought in some great new donors as a result of that run.
Idk, my niece went to duke. At no point in her run up to applying, decision to go, or time there did we ever talk bball. It was always academics.
perhaps that’s an exception but I think plenty of people think about duke just being a strong academic school.
Duke is a strong academic school no doubt. And people know it as such. But the reason they know it to be a strong academic school is in large part due to the success of the basketball team. Prior to Coach K taking over - they were a respectable basketball team. Coach K took them to new heights, especially as college athletics and basketball blew up as well. But that put more eyes on the University through basketball, which as a result - highlighted their academic achievements because as kids looks at the school and do research - they realize, this is a good school. Better students apply and next thing you know - you academics rises as well.
I just think our administration, both athletics and overall school, are hesitant to make sports - with Basketball being the main focus because football is only I-AA, to make that next great leap. Now - Mooney and team can force their hand a bit by making multiple tourney's a short time period - but I think our administration is just fine with making the tourney every so often and just being competitive in other years.
And the the things they have done to "show bigger impact" - updating Robins center, locking down our coach for 10 years and million dollar deal after last NCAA run, charter flights, practice facility, etc. Those are all well and good, but I always felt like we were late to the party and did those secondary to other programs. It was like - we were trying to keep up, not trying to get ahead of other programs in my opinion.
I will say - so far this offseason - Mooney and staff have done what they need to do in the portal to fill holes and hopefully make another run. Time will tell how that plays out on the court because this will be the first time that Mooney has a team not only heavy with transfers, but transfers we likely need to play and produce in order for this team to be successful next season. So how quickly those new guys can fit in and take the lead in some instances will be the driving force if this team has NCAA chances. BUT - as of right now, they have assembled a roster on paper that could give us a shot.
I just think our administration, both athletics and overall school, are hesitant to make sports - with Basketball being the main focus because football is only I-AA, to make that next great leap. Now - Mooney and team can force their hand a bit by making multiple tourney's a short time period - but I think our administration is just fine with making the tourney every so often and just being competitive in other years.
And the the things they have done to "show bigger impact" - updating Robins center, locking down our coach for 10 years and million dollar deal after last NCAA run, charter flights, practice facility, etc. Those are all well and good, but I always felt like we were late to the party and did those secondary to other programs. It was like - we were trying to keep up, not trying to get ahead of other programs in my opinion.
I will say - so far this offseason - Mooney and staff have done what they need to do in the portal to fill holes and hopefully make another run. Time will tell how that plays out on the court because this will be the first time that Mooney has a team not only heavy with transfers, but transfers we likely need to play and produce in order for this team to be successful next season. So how quickly those new guys can fit in and take the lead in some instances will be the driving force if this team has NCAA chances. BUT - as of right now, they have assembled a roster on paper that could give us a shot.
Do you really think anyone in the administration wouldn't want our basketball teams to win as much and as often as possible? Everything we have done screams that we want to win. I don't think the Robins Center, the practice facility, and the charter flights are just keeping up with our peers, they are passing them, and passing them by a lot in many cases. And, as has been said many times on here, our coach makes over a million a year. All of this seems a lot better than what most of our peers have or are doing. Also, why would we go to the A-10 if we didn't care a lot about our basketball team? Allow me to disagree because I think everything we have done says just the opposite of what you think.
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We kept Mooney through a longer tournament drought than essentially any other school at the A10 level or higher has done. To many people, that makes it seem like winning isn’t the top priority.
The keep Mooney argument because we don't care about winning makes no sense because we never would have paid him like we did if we didn't care. And, I was responding to Trap saying we don't want to win too much or have too much success. He has nothing to back that up with, and pretty much everything he has said can be proven wrong. He said we didn't do anything after the back to back tourney appearances? What about upgrading the Robins Center? He said if we won a lot, we would have to upgrade facilities and increase recruiting. Uh, that is exactly what we have done. So, Trap, you think after Ced went down with his injury in 2014, the administration went, "whew, we were on the bubble. Now, the good news is we won't make the dance without Ced." Or, the next year when we were the 1st team out, you think they were glad we lost to VCU in the A-10 tourney, and then glad we lost to Miami in the NIT because " we don't want to win". Or, 2017, you think they were glad VCU hit the tying 3 against us and beat us in OT in the conference semis? Or, maybe they celebrated when COVID stopped the 2020 season because we were winning too much, right? Or, maybe they want us to struggle next year because back to back dances would be a bad thing? I just couldn't disagree more, but, hey, just your opinion, so all good, and we can disagree.
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We paid Mooney the 1 million and 10 year deal is response to VCU, we needed to keep up with them. Our practice facility was delayed several years ago, and we just opened it this past year. We have upgraded the Robins Center is looks great - but we have to solve the student issue (we have a top 3 arena in the A10, but probably a bottom half game atmosphere).
I am not saying our administration wants us to lose, they certainly do that. All I am saying is that they will not be upset or bothered if we continue down the same path - wait a few years and maybe make the tourney again. And if we continue to make the tourney - which is everyone's hope, will they continue to invest? That will mean - more upgrades, more charters for better OOC games, bigger salaries, probably adding more staff, trying to secure NIL deals, more transfers, etc. College basketball is just one glorified arms race. And once success hits - you will have a decision to make - take part in it and go all in, or sit it out and watch others. To this point, especially after back to back tourney's many years ago - we have been content sitting out.
TIme will tell over the next few years, but if the past is any indication of the future - I don't expect much to change.
I am not saying our administration wants us to lose, they certainly do that. All I am saying is that they will not be upset or bothered if we continue down the same path - wait a few years and maybe make the tourney again. And if we continue to make the tourney - which is everyone's hope, will they continue to invest? That will mean - more upgrades, more charters for better OOC games, bigger salaries, probably adding more staff, trying to secure NIL deals, more transfers, etc. College basketball is just one glorified arms race. And once success hits - you will have a decision to make - take part in it and go all in, or sit it out and watch others. To this point, especially after back to back tourney's many years ago - we have been content sitting out.
TIme will tell over the next few years, but if the past is any indication of the future - I don't expect much to change.
I just don't see where you are coming from here. You said we have been content sitting out since our back to back tourney years when I see it as just the opposite. You said there hasn't been much change, but there most definitely has. Seems like everything you are asking for we have done, but your response to that is "yeah, but...."
See post #29. Says a lot. A whole lot.
You seem to be saying Admin wants to win, but were unlucky, because a key injury(ies) crushed a great season or we lost a heartbreaker to a buzzer beater. All teams endure these, but a school committed to athletics is more likely to be positioned to deal with them. Sure the Administration wants to win, but it appears far from a priority or a strategic marketing consideration for our school.
And in many non-revenue sports we do not fund the maximum allowable scholarships despite the obvious ability to do so. Like competing with hand tied behind your back.
Don't have to look far to see that athletics, in many cases, is not as great a priority to us as it is to many of our opponents. JMU led us around by the nose in football in recent years just as VCU routinely does in basketball. We have sat back and taken it.
I want my school to be the best in all facets of its operations including athletics. Successive Administrations appear from their actions or, more accurately, inactions, to be more interested in glitter than glory. Facilities over winning. Have higher hopes with respect to our new Prez. We shall see.
I think the administration wants to win, but I don’t think it is their top priority.
I also don’t think everything we have done screams that we want to win. I think it screams that we want to compete.
In my opinion the top priority has been to keep a respectable long-term record with a scandal free program
Sorry to disagree (or attack in his mind) with VT again, but an administration that cares about winning doesn't accept a decade of no NCAA or 5 years of no playoffs for football. They don't talk about competing, they find ways to win. The zero accountability that spews out of the Robins Center and the men's basketball program says it all. VT and others can continue to make excuses for not winning enough and only having 3 NCAA tournaments in 17 years. But this program hasn't consistently won enough and 1 improbable run to the A10 Championship doesn't change that. Hopefully CM has righted the ship, but he's lost the benefit of the doubt. Prove it starting next year.
Agree 100% plydog. I think UR does enough to put on the show we care, and like you say - compete, scandal free, and respectable record. But I don't see it as a top priority. Now should it be a top priority? That is another question. I think it can be 1 and 1a when you talking athletics and the academic success of the University. But I think to this point - it has clearly been academic success is 1 and athletics is maybe 2, maybe even further down the list.
So, those that think we don't care enough about winning, what exactly do you think we should be doing? Obviously, a $17 million Robins Center renovation, and a $15 million practice facility means nothing to you, so what are you looking or hoping for?
it's not so easy to me. yes, an administration that "cares about winning" might have fired Mooney in 2018 or 2019. that's what you're asking for, I assume? after landing Gilyard, Golden, Sherod and Cayo, but before they had time to succeed?
we'll never know if a new guy would have done better. I personally think it would have started a rebuild after losing some guys. regardless, odds are pretty good that we don't go better than 62-29 the next 3 years with an NCAA win, an NIT win, and a likely NCAA bid in 2020. but at least if we fired him we would have showed we cared about winning, right?
I think a program that cares about winning has to constantly decide if their guy is the right guy. I think we do that. not everyone is going to agree with the answer. but I think the end results the past 3 seasons validate their decision.
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