Of course, there is still his physical difference from November 2019 to November 2021...
Nick Sherod returning for final season!
- Thread starter plydogg
- Start date
Glad to have Nick and his parents back in the Robins Center .............praying he avoids all injuries and has a great wrapup to his Spider career. Has a good "shot" at being in top 5 of Spider all time 3 point shooters.
Welcome back Nick. It is great to have a native Richmonder
on the team. Great leader who can shoot the lights out.
He will continue to be the heart and soul of our team.
Hopefully, we can have a great and memorable season, despite
Coach Mooney.
Hopefully, he will hire Kevin Anderson to help him fire up this
veteran team to have a season that we will always be proud of.
on the team. Great leader who can shoot the lights out.
He will continue to be the heart and soul of our team.
Hopefully, we can have a great and memorable season, despite
Coach Mooney.
Hopefully, he will hire Kevin Anderson to help him fire up this
veteran team to have a season that we will always be proud of.
So glad Nick is back. He deserves this and will make the team better. Here is how I see him fitting in.
I agree he is coming off the bench, most likely as our 6th man, but probably not to start the season. Sherod can only play the 3 (he wasn't even playing a guard role before this second ACL injury) that is Burton's spot and Burton isn't giving it up. What I think happens is that Mooney will eventually move Burton around to accomodate Sherod's minutes. Burton can play the 4, or we can go small ball with Cayo and Burton as our bigs with Sherod at the 3. Sherod is an excellent rebounder and tough body to move around in the interior so I can see that line up when Golden is out.
This is going to be a serious challenge for Mooney to manage. The man is rigid and set in his ways, so having to shuffle the line-up is not something he is used to. I suspect he will try to shoehorn Sherod into starting at 2 guard earlier on (since we have an opening there). This will not go well as it will expose a lot of defensive defiencies and we will eventually settle the above mentioned pattern.
Maybe if Mooney doesn't hire another yes man assistant coach with at least one of these hires, we can avoid this trial and error of where to fit Sherod back into the line-up. Let us hope.
I agree he is coming off the bench, most likely as our 6th man, but probably not to start the season. Sherod can only play the 3 (he wasn't even playing a guard role before this second ACL injury) that is Burton's spot and Burton isn't giving it up. What I think happens is that Mooney will eventually move Burton around to accomodate Sherod's minutes. Burton can play the 4, or we can go small ball with Cayo and Burton as our bigs with Sherod at the 3. Sherod is an excellent rebounder and tough body to move around in the interior so I can see that line up when Golden is out.
This is going to be a serious challenge for Mooney to manage. The man is rigid and set in his ways, so having to shuffle the line-up is not something he is used to. I suspect he will try to shoehorn Sherod into starting at 2 guard earlier on (since we have an opening there). This will not go well as it will expose a lot of defensive defiencies and we will eventually settle the above mentioned pattern.
Maybe if Mooney doesn't hire another yes man assistant coach with at least one of these hires, we can avoid this trial and error of where to fit Sherod back into the line-up. Let us hope.
I still can't buy into Cayo at the 5 and I don't think we will or should ever see it.
Cayo's a good basketball player. but as a backup to Golden, Grace is a better 5 for what we do on the offensive end and Sal is a better 5 on the defensive end. Nathan's just not a 5. if size didn't matter, you could just play Burton at the 5 too. heck, never recruit centers. but it does.
Cayo's a good basketball player. but as a backup to Golden, Grace is a better 5 for what we do on the offensive end and Sal is a better 5 on the defensive end. Nathan's just not a 5. if size didn't matter, you could just play Burton at the 5 too. heck, never recruit centers. but it does.
I like Sherod coming back. Think he brings a sense of leadership and mental toughness are team lacked at times that can really only be expressed when he is on the court. I hope he is close to the old Nick after his series of injuries. In reality - with his toughness - he is the only player I can imagine on this roster coming back from these types of injuries.
In terms of minutes - I assume Nick is only coming back if he feels he can contribute and play like his old self. If that is the case - I see our starting 5 as Gilyard, Sherod, Cayo, Burton, and Golden. I could see Sherod getting some minutes limited early on in the season - maybe keeping him around 25 - so expect to see Gustav as normal and a little bit of Wilson. But in reality - this means no playing time for incoming frosh and I think even Bailey gets left out of the rotation. With the starting 5 mentioned above - I think you see Gustav, Wilson, and then Grace/Sal off the bench.
I just wonder how many of the incoming guys can we redshirt to get an extra year out of them.
In terms of minutes - I assume Nick is only coming back if he feels he can contribute and play like his old self. If that is the case - I see our starting 5 as Gilyard, Sherod, Cayo, Burton, and Golden. I could see Sherod getting some minutes limited early on in the season - maybe keeping him around 25 - so expect to see Gustav as normal and a little bit of Wilson. But in reality - this means no playing time for incoming frosh and I think even Bailey gets left out of the rotation. With the starting 5 mentioned above - I think you see Gustav, Wilson, and then Grace/Sal off the bench.
I just wonder how many of the incoming guys can we redshirt to get an extra year out of them.
I think everyone gets a free year due to Covid, although not sure about the freshman. If not, I agree, they aren't going to playing much this season with all of the seniors returning.
Burton would be a better 5 in a small ball game than would Cayo. It's a change of pace line-up to maximize Sherod minutes, not something I would see us running for large parts of the game.
I agree, I like Sal/Grace out there (presuming both of their games continue to evolve) in most situations. However, if I have 10 minutes of time that could go to Sherod vs. Sal/Grace, I want those 10 minutes going to Sherod.
I’m looking forward to seeing how Mooney distributes minutes next year. From my count we’ve got 10 returning guys who will be fighting for minutes every game and then the incoming freshmen on top of that.
Since I’ve been a Spider (2012) this is the most depth we have had. I feel comfortable going 10 deep, and feels like we can keep a lot of guys fresh and play more menacing on defense and make more mass-subs like VCU does. We will have more fouls to give and hopefully these guys come in off the bench and give the other team hell every second they’re out there.
Since I’ve been a Spider (2012) this is the most depth we have had. I feel comfortable going 10 deep, and feels like we can keep a lot of guys fresh and play more menacing on defense and make more mass-subs like VCU does. We will have more fouls to give and hopefully these guys come in off the bench and give the other team hell every second they’re out there.
I believe it's 11 guys returning.
my issue with going small up front to find Sherod minutes is that I feel we've gone through this square peg in a round hole thing before. I don't want to play guys out of position to help the offense at the expense of the defense.
I do think Sherod can play some minutes at the 2. if it doesn't work, we can scrap that. we certainly have strong defensive options available at the 2. question would be if Sherod's offense outweighs their defense.
if he's strictly limited to the 3, there's still room there. Burton starts and plays 20+ there and then takes the backup minutes at the 4 from Sal. Sal then competes for the backup minutes at the 5.
my issue with going small up front to find Sherod minutes is that I feel we've gone through this square peg in a round hole thing before. I don't want to play guys out of position to help the offense at the expense of the defense.
I do think Sherod can play some minutes at the 2. if it doesn't work, we can scrap that. we certainly have strong defensive options available at the 2. question would be if Sherod's offense outweighs their defense.
if he's strictly limited to the 3, there's still room there. Burton starts and plays 20+ there and then takes the backup minutes at the 4 from Sal. Sal then competes for the backup minutes at the 5.
Managing in-game is Mooney's greatest weakness. This is why all the depth could be a problem. Is there enough experience and talent (can they get it done in spite of the coach) to hide Mooney's blundering, time will tell.
There should be enough to get the NCAA bid, but I think it is far from certain.
I’ll let PhillyBob tell me that I’m being outrageous, but I don’t think that just an NCAA appearance should be the expectation. With this group assembled, we really need to be preparing as if we expect to make the 2nd weekend. The stars have aligned to give us multiple bites at the apple with this group.
I like our talent and depth but I have no idea why some think this is a sure thing. the team has plenty of flaws to overcome and improve upon.
PG: ok, Gilly's really good and he's backed up by Wilson and maybe Nelson. that's a strong start.
SG: well here we go. either Sherod plays here with defensive limitations, or Goose/Dji/Isaiah play with what seems like offensive limitations ... certainly compared to Francis.
SF: we all believe Burton is ready to be a star but he just doesn't do it every night yet. is he ready to make the jump? we'll see. and we haven't seen a healthy Crabtree.
PF: for all the nice interior offense Cayo provides, he can't shoot outside 15 feet, doesn't rebound all that much, and gets lost defensively. Sal's not proven.
C: I don't necessarily see what many of you see here, but I keep reading that he's horrible defensively. and Grace is no Mutombo either.
am I wrong in these evals? Mooney assembled this team so that's on him. we do have talent and depth but we have some issues. it'll absolutely take a good coaching job to dance. and if Mooney's as bad as some here say, then we probably won't.
PG: ok, Gilly's really good and he's backed up by Wilson and maybe Nelson. that's a strong start.
SG: well here we go. either Sherod plays here with defensive limitations, or Goose/Dji/Isaiah play with what seems like offensive limitations ... certainly compared to Francis.
SF: we all believe Burton is ready to be a star but he just doesn't do it every night yet. is he ready to make the jump? we'll see. and we haven't seen a healthy Crabtree.
PF: for all the nice interior offense Cayo provides, he can't shoot outside 15 feet, doesn't rebound all that much, and gets lost defensively. Sal's not proven.
C: I don't necessarily see what many of you see here, but I keep reading that he's horrible defensively. and Grace is no Mutombo either.
am I wrong in these evals? Mooney assembled this team so that's on him. we do have talent and depth but we have some issues. it'll absolutely take a good coaching job to dance. and if Mooney's as bad as some here say, then we probably won't.
That lineup has no secondary ball handler, so I don’t think that’s viable even with CMs tendency to lean on his known quantities. I’d be really surprised to see that lineup start or even see a majority of minutes.
11 is so much better than just 3 1/2 that we ended the season with. They will certainly be good. Great will depend on Mooney letting Burton be the star we know he is and Grant playing defense.
Agreed. I just wonder if the staff should try to get nick down to 210 or 215 lbs., so that there will be less weight on his knees and greater quickness. Just a thought.
Thrilled you are coming back, young man!
I really don’t understand the “we need Grace or Sal playing the 5 when Grant is out” argument. What? We should absolutely go small sometimes and play Burton/Cayo/Sherod. Especially in A-10 games. Sal and grace are certainly not better defenders at the 5 than Burton/Cayo and I think the offense can flow fine. Plus having Sherod at the 3 and a bigger 2 guard makes us bigger than last year. I still want Sal to come in and hack some people and Grace to hit a couple threes but I’m honestly fine if they get less than 20 minutes combined.
sman, some really good points on the roster and chances next year.
SG - If Sherod healthy and we can get a lot of minutes with him and Burton (3/4) together I am not as worried about this being a shooter (which I know is direct opposite of my opinion on SG a few days ago). Also, if we get NIT Gilly who is shooting and making with confidence I think we are OK on the shooting, and between Dji, WIlson and Gustavson we have guys that all bring some positives to the game.
SF - Between Burton, Crabtree, Sherod, Goose, Dji we are in fine shape here.
PF- Like Cayo, but some very relevant points made by sman. Defense lacks some times, no threat from outside of 5 feet, rebounding comes and goes. Overall consistency needs to improve. He has that game where he is great, then next game don't notice him. He needs a coach to really work on this and he needs to somehow finally develop a 15 footer. We struck out on some good PF prospects, so no competition to push him. I was opposed to Burton using his talents here, but with lack of recruiting and Nick coming back - I do hope to see Tyler at 4 a good bit. We likely will need the shooting some games .
PG and Center - I think in good shape. Would like to see Gilly and Golden become more aggressive, Gilly on offense and Golden on D and rebounding. Grace looked good on offense when he got some minutes, but his D is really non existent.
SG - If Sherod healthy and we can get a lot of minutes with him and Burton (3/4) together I am not as worried about this being a shooter (which I know is direct opposite of my opinion on SG a few days ago). Also, if we get NIT Gilly who is shooting and making with confidence I think we are OK on the shooting, and between Dji, WIlson and Gustavson we have guys that all bring some positives to the game.
SF - Between Burton, Crabtree, Sherod, Goose, Dji we are in fine shape here.
PF- Like Cayo, but some very relevant points made by sman. Defense lacks some times, no threat from outside of 5 feet, rebounding comes and goes. Overall consistency needs to improve. He has that game where he is great, then next game don't notice him. He needs a coach to really work on this and he needs to somehow finally develop a 15 footer. We struck out on some good PF prospects, so no competition to push him. I was opposed to Burton using his talents here, but with lack of recruiting and Nick coming back - I do hope to see Tyler at 4 a good bit. We likely will need the shooting some games .
PG and Center - I think in good shape. Would like to see Gilly and Golden become more aggressive, Gilly on offense and Golden on D and rebounding. Grace looked good on offense when he got some minutes, but his D is really non existent.
I think the one thing folks need to keep in mind is that you're all assuming Nick is going to come back and be the player he was before the injury. Even professional athletes that are doing nothing but rehabbing can't get their timing, feel back for full 100% comfortability from torn ACLs in 18 months.
I think Nick is going to be a rotational piece, mainly providing leadership and some spot up shooting--but do we really need leaders at this point, we have like 4 6th year seniors on this team now.
I think Nick is going to be a rotational piece, mainly providing leadership and some spot up shooting--but do we really need leaders at this point, we have like 4 6th year seniors on this team now.
We want Grace and Sal backing up Grant because they know the position, have the experience there, and have both improved to the level of being very good backups. Our offensive efficiency has been really good the last several years, and we don't want to change too much there by moving guys around all over the place. Keep Burton and Nate doing what they do, without having to learn Grant's position and all the things asked of him. Also, defensively, we don't want to risk getting Burton and Nate in foul trouble by picking up cheap fouls while handling an opposing big while Grant is out.
Agree 100%. I don't see this lineup even getting a small amount of minutes, unless we have major foul trouble or injuries. Wilson, Dji, or Andre (or one of the freshman ball handlers) needs to be out there along with Jacob. Without a second ball handler, what do we do when Jacob gets doubled in the backcourt, or when he gets the ball taken out of his hands in the frontcourt? Our best games happen when we have very few turnovers. We need to keep it that way.
I think coming off of two torn ACLs, Nick will be more than happy coming off the bench and making some deep 3s. If he can get to the point where he can also be a factor in the lane with his 12 footers in traffic, even better, but I think it's unrealistic to expect him to play a lot of minutes out there, especially the first half of the season.
I expect to see Sherod playing the high post 5 on O for Golden at times. and we'd go small on D. Mooney said he talked to Sherod last year pre injury about this role. Probably just spot minutes idk. But I think he would be a threat there, it would open up the court with his 3 pt shooting, or he'd be getting looks from top of key which you want for good shooters, he can distribute well from high post, and we've also seen he can post up pretty well for a big guard/wing. All for trying this out especially if he's going to be on limited minutes.
No practicing for Nick this year! Just show up to the games and play. He's basically a stand-still shooter anyway. Wrap him in bubble wrap until the game starts, and he'll put up 10-15 for us.
how much time did Nick have after his 1st ACL until he started playing 30 minutes? anyone remember? if it's similar this time, I don't know why people are expecting him to have an old man YMCA game this time and need limited minutes. he came back fine once. it's the other knee. it's not a chronic thing. either he can play or he can't. I don't see 10-15 mpg. I think it's 0 or 25+. I think it's likely that he's back just like he was last time. and that's where it gets tricky.
if Nick ends up 100%, you've got three 30 mpg starters for 2 forward spots. check that. if Crabtree is healthy then we have 4 starters for those 2 spots.
so either a) we play someone (Nick) at the 2 and make Gilly work really hard all game, possibly reducing his effective minutes ...
or b) we play a ball handler like Isaiah or Dji at the 2.
B probably makes the most basketball sense, but it's going to be frustrating when we go a few possessions without scoring and we've got big time scorers on the bench.
if Nick ends up 100%, you've got three 30 mpg starters for 2 forward spots. check that. if Crabtree is healthy then we have 4 starters for those 2 spots.
so either a) we play someone (Nick) at the 2 and make Gilly work really hard all game, possibly reducing his effective minutes ...
or b) we play a ball handler like Isaiah or Dji at the 2.
B probably makes the most basketball sense, but it's going to be frustrating when we go a few possessions without scoring and we've got big time scorers on the bench.
I feel like spiderman and Spider K had a "Freaky Friday" event and switched bodies.
Sherod's first knee injury was like 5 games into the season, so mid-late November. I think he injured this one mid October, so he should be a month further along. Sherod was ready to go the next year from the start.
I don't really see what all the worry is about Sherod and his knees. It's not like he lost a leg and is playing on a prosethic leg or something. He's in his early 20's, is getting the best rehab/medical care, money can buy, and is a highly trained athlete. Would expect his physical recovery to be complete and given that he has already been through this once, hopefully his mental readiness is on par.
Still don't see him starting though, because there is just no place for him to start. He can't play the 2 guard, so just stop with that. He is not a ball handler and can guard the quicker guards who will man that position.
I don't really see what all the worry is about Sherod and his knees. It's not like he lost a leg and is playing on a prosethic leg or something. He's in his early 20's, is getting the best rehab/medical care, money can buy, and is a highly trained athlete. Would expect his physical recovery to be complete and given that he has already been through this once, hopefully his mental readiness is on par.
Still don't see him starting though, because there is just no place for him to start. He can't play the 2 guard, so just stop with that. He is not a ball handler and can guard the quicker guards who will man that position.
I agree 2's are likely too quick for Nick, but 3's are quick too. he's not going to be a plus defender regardless. that said ... he rebounds a little and shoots the lights out. his shooting range spacing the floor doesn't help us from the bench.
there's 80 mpg at the forward spots. if Burton keeps developing he's got to get 30 mpg. if you want to split the balance between Cayo and Sherod 25/25 or 30/20 I'm good with that.
but I believe in Crabtree too. if he's healthy he plays. he's a 3 but you'll have to find time somewhere.
there's 80 mpg at the forward spots. if Burton keeps developing he's got to get 30 mpg. if you want to split the balance between Cayo and Sherod 25/25 or 30/20 I'm good with that.
but I believe in Crabtree too. if he's healthy he plays. he's a 3 but you'll have to find time somewhere.
I’d like to see Nick come off the bench and serve as a spark scorer for us. But if he does start (which I don’t think he will), he’ll play more of the role of the 3. I think Burton is capable of playing more like a 2 - he’s quick, athletic, and a pretty good ball handler. That would be a very interesting lineup
I think you are right with Nick...but I disagree with you on Tyler, I just don't see him as a 2
In case no one has noticed - defense is not our speciality the last few season so the fact that Nick might be a little slower for opposing team 2 or 3's doesn't really matter to me. Plus - in our switch everything defense we deploy 90% of the time, you don't need to be that quick.
Agree that Tyler isn’t a 2, just think his skill set is closer to a 2 than Nick’s
I don't think Nick or Tyler can guard the 2 spot. I do think quickness plays a role, especially lateral quickness and lets be honest...coming off of a 2nd ACL injury is going to play a lot in that. Tyler hasn't showed that he cares about defense a great deal imo and he stays really high up and doesn't get low on his defensive assignments, which is alway a recipe to get beat. (But I think he could be a very good defender. )That in turn puts our bigs in harms way for foul trouble because of slow rotation over.
Trap's talking about how we switch on all screens in our man defense.
100%. and it's not just Tyler either. Grant is put in help position too often which leaves his guy to be picked up ... and nobody gets inside of that guy.
The guards will switch occasionally, but we don't switch on screens 90% of the time.
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