John Hardt on Black and Drew

[AnnapSpider]

OK, I'll play the devils advocate. We've had pretty good successes in the past 5
years in the non-revenue sports, improving baseball program, healthy men and ladies
lacrosse programs, golf, etc. Also, winning records in football, even with changing
coaches.
To hear some of you, you'd think we were VMI and you want us to be Ohio State.
I think, as a small private university, we are pretty respectable.

 

[Gospiders06]

When you spend millions of dollars on a new basketball practice facility you expect results. Spending all this money on the Robins Center you really expect NCAA tournament bids. I think that's where we all are. It definitely isn't cheap going to college at Richmond. Being a smaller private university, I would say having a national championship in football is very impressive. I just think standards aren't being met in the basketball program. Everyone talks about the Sweet 16 run we had. When you sign a 10-year contract it kinda blows any incentive to reach the same level.

 

[Wood Hall]

Hard to show results from a practice facility that isn't even built yet, isn't it? As for the upgraded RC, have we not seen results, ie increased attendance and increased customer satisfaction with the venue, if not with the team?

As for waiting for six months to hire an AD, that's no big deal. What's more important is getting it right and it sounds as if we did that.

Perhaps Hardt was the target all along, and we knew he couldn't come six months earlier.

And seriously, do you really expect him to say, "Well, coach Mooney is just lukewarm about the upcoming season."

 

[MrTbone]

When you spend millions of dollars on a new basketball practice facility you expect results.

At the risk of being contrarian, Its highly assumptive to state that UR expects results. Logically it stands to reason that they would. Analytically though, the indicators are they don’t expect it enough to extricate from a coaching deal, much less to bend admission standards or any other means that have been posited here before.

If you evaluate it on financial merit alone, something folks here often errantly do, you must consider that UR isn’t putting up any capital for the facility, I believe it is 100% donor financed. So maybe there are some donors who care, or maybe they just like that they’ll have a bronze plaque in the building. UR meantime is getting a tremendous physical asset without investing any of its own dollars.

Objectively, it may in fact diminish any pressure to change out the coach which is an actual fiscal burden.

I think UR is building this facility to be more competitive, but I don’t think it changes the calculus at all in terms of program expectations.

 

[fan2011]

At the risk of being contrarian, Its highly assumptive to state that UR expects results. Logically it stands to reason that they would. Analytically though, the indicators are they don’t expect it enough to extricate from a coaching deal, much less to bend admission standards or any other means that have been posited here before.

If you evaluate it on financial merit alone, something folks here often errantly do, you must consider that UR isn’t putting up any capital for the facility, I believe it is 100% donor financed. So maybe there are some donors who care, or maybe they just like that they’ll have a bronze plaque in the building. UR meantime is getting a tremendous physical asset without investing any of its own dollars.

Objectively, it may in fact diminish any pressure to change out the coach which is an actual fiscal burden.

I think UR is building this facility to be more competitive, but I don’t think it changes the calculus at all in terms of program expectations.

Maybe UR sees this building as necessary to maintain the current level of competition but does not expect it to increase our competitiveness. There is always an arms race in college athletics, and college as a whole, we need to keep up with the Joneses.

Hopefully that is not the case, but who knows.

 

[coachfezz]

i think 18 wins means bad coaching and planning. good out of bounds plays means good coaching

 

[wr70beh]

So Spiderman, 18 wins is a good year for you for Richmond basketball. You are buying into the excuse mongering from Mooney. Based on his recent past performance, I don't think we should just keep waiting for the next year, in this case you are basically saying 2 more years to compete for A10 championship.

Exactly. Why are we giving him more time at all, considering he didn't inherit any messes. All of this is his doing 100%. We've let him try to work himself out of messes before and he came up just short every time. I'm sorry, but I don't see it happening. Anything less than NCAA this year and he should be out the door. Tired of waiting around.

 

[spider23]

Exactly. Why are we giving him more time at all, considering he didn't inherit any messes. All of this is his doing 100%. We've let him try to work himself out of messes before and he came up just short every time. I'm sorry, but I don't see it happening. Anything less than NCAA this year and he should be out the door. Tired of waiting around.

Agree completely. This is on him, he did not inherit this roster, or last year, or year before.

 

[97spiderfan]

Hard to show results from a practice facility that isn't even built yet, isn't it? As for the upgraded RC, have we not seen results, ie increased attendance and increased customer satisfaction with the venue, if not with the team?

As for waiting for six months to hire an AD, that's no big deal. What's more important is getting it right and it sounds as if we did that.

Perhaps Hardt was the target all along, and we knew he couldn't come six months earlier.

And seriously, do you really expect him to say, "Well, coach Mooney is just lukewarm about the upcoming season."

Name one other D-1 university who didn't even form a search committee for 6 months to replace a departing AD? AN AD sets the vision and strategic planning for the entire athletic department and we basically punted on that for close to year.

This is why every major corporation, including universities do succession planning. I doubt anyone's succession plan says, meh, lets just wait 6 months before even beginning to take action. But yeah, no big deal.

 

[urmite]

Exactly. Why are we giving him more time at all, considering he didn't inherit any messes. All of this is his doing 100%. We've let him try to work himself out of messes before and he came up just short every time. I'm sorry, but I don't see it happening. Anything less than NCAA this year and he should be out the door. Tired of waiting around.

I disagree. He did inherit a mess but that was 13 years ago and doesn’t have any bearing on today.

 

[MrTbone]

Name one other D-1 university who didn't even form a search committee for 6 months to replace a departing AD? AN AD sets the vision and strategic planning for the entire athletic department and we basically punted on that for close to year.

This is why every major corporation, including universities do succession planning. I doubt anyone's succession plan says, meh, lets just wait 6 months before even beginning to take action. But yeah, no big deal.

Fwiw, I think the search committee/process was a farce. It seems pretty evident that Hardt was the only candidate given much consideration. Perhaps they knew this long before starting the “search” and there was no urgency?

Not saying that is the right answer but may in fact be the real reason it wasn’t prioritized sooner.

 

[Wood Hall]

If you get the person you want, the search was a success. We had a successful search.

 

[MrTbone]

If you get the person you want, the search was a success. We had a successful search.

Agreed. To clarify, I wasn’t suggesting we didn’t get the right guy, I was just noting that the “delay” may have been irrelevant to how we arrived with Hardt.

 

[97spiderfan]

If you get the person you want, the search was a success. We had a successful search.

I think Hardt is going to be a good AD for us. But he has been on the job for 6 months, so I think it is a bit too soon to label him a success or a failure. He hasn't done anything yet to cause me to question the selection and has raised a considerable sum of money for the new basketball facility, so that is certainly a positive for him. It will probably take 2-3 years minimum to really know if Hardt was the right fit at the right time for us.

 

[SpiderRick]

Why in the world should we have to wait 2 to 3 years to see results? Those sounds a lot like "wait til next year"

 

[LongTimeLurkerFirstTimePoster]

Exactly. Why are we giving him more time at all, considering he didn't inherit any messes. All of this is his doing 100%. We've let him try to work himself out of messes before and he came up just short every time. I'm sorry, but I don't see it happening. Anything less than NCAA this year and he should be out the door. Tired of waiting around.

he didn't deny admission to a college graduate for our School of Continuing studies. That is the same school that offers certificates in beer making. That doesn't sound like everyone rowing in the same direction.

 

[MrTbone]

Why in the world should we have to wait 2 to 3 years to see results? Those sounds a lot like "wait til next year"

Well you can certainly make an evaluation in one year if you want, but the results may not accurately represent success or failure over a longer period of time which you'd get if you gauged it over 3 years of results.

As a practical matter, no one is going to make a determination on Hardt after 12 months on the job, at least not one that's going to cause a seismic change.

 

[spiderman]

I'm not sure how we're supposed to grade Hardt. If the basketball team wins a ton of games the next couple years, he's doing a great job??? doesn't make much sense. how do you judge him?

 

[MrTbone]

i think there are reasonable ways to judge the AD. The three key factors will be on development/fundraising, revenue generating sports success (I guess defined by post-season appearances instead of just W/Ls), and "everything else".

Of course, that's how most universities who are particular about athletics success would do it, I'm not sure it's how UR looks at it though.

 

[spiderman]

even if basketball wins 25 freaking games next year and football wins a national championship, does anyone think Hardt would have had anything to do with that?
he can get judged on how good he comes across in public statements and on how he does raising money. that and if he fires a coach and hires a better one, but it takes time to see if that kind of move is successful or not.

 

[Rivercup]

Met a young man on Sunday who coaches bb in Mass. He was at Bucknell and spoke very highly of Hardt. Said the bb and fb programs really started to excel after his arrival. I believe that we have a good one in Mr. Hardt.

 

[CarolinaSpider]

Ran into Bucknell Baseball coach who said Hardt will push all programs towards excellence.

 

[97spiderfan]

I'm not sure how we're supposed to grade Hardt. If the basketball team wins a ton of games the next couple years, he's doing a great job??? doesn't make much sense. how do you judge him?

Pretty much so. This is UR, so I know the AD has to raise a lot of money, but let's just be real, we never have had a challenge doing that. Other than that AD's are judged largely on the success of the main revenue sports, football and men's basketball.

If we start winning and going to the postseason in both, Hardt's ability to raise $$$ is only going to increase too. Winning breeds a lot of good things.

 

[spider23]

Good to hear the feedback from the former Bucknell guys. Hope he can bring similar success here. Should be an interesting basketball season. Will Mooney rise to the occasion, and make the best out of a less than ideal roster. Or will the pressure to win cause him to wilt? I think Cayo/Sal and whoever is the 2G will be huge keys. Sal will have to actually be better than advertised and/or Cayo will have to make a huge jump offensively. 2 guard is still a mystery to me. I think that position will be OK at best. Not knocking Gussy or Woj, but even if they are good A10 level players, I don't see them as 1st year studs (a la Buck frosh year).

 

[spiderman]

I wonder if Yates is the early 2.

it's not what we're used to ball handling wise, but Gilyard can handle a heavy ball handling load and if Yates can defend the top he does add shooting and length.

Julius makes a lot of sense with familiarity in the program but he hasn't shown enough yet offensively. Bryce or Woj could earn it. Probably too much to expect early time from Gussy after not coming over for the summer program.

 

[MrTbone]

even if basketball wins 25 freaking games next year and football wins a national championship, does anyone think Hardt would have had anything to do with that?
he can get judged on how good he comes across in public statements and on how he does raising money. that and if he fires a coach and hires a better one, but it takes time to see if that kind of move is successful or not.

I think it's a bit dismissive to suggest that near-term improvement has nothing to do with the AD. Is it ultimately up to the individual head coaches to achieve success? Yes. But I also think Hardt may handle a lack of success by coaches more aggressively than has been done of late. If he's more demanding of success, underperforming coaches may feel more heat to succeed. We have probably all seen this happen in our own work environments with leadership/management changes.

 

[spiderman]

I just don't buy into this concept that we did poorly last year because CM wasn't trying hard, and he'll try harder now because we have a new AD.
I think that's so incorrect it's laughable. but we can all have our opinions.

 

[spiderstudent17]

We did poorly last year because Mooney is a mediocre coach. He was average at his tenure at Air Force and he has been average the 12 years he’s been coaching here. He will continue to be average for as long as we employ him. What will distinguish Hardt as a great AD is 3 things.

1. Firing Mooney when he inevitably underperforms these next couple of years.

2. Hiring the right coach who will make us a consistent contender for A10 championships and NCAA tournament

3. Raising the money to build the facilities needed for our basketball coach to recruit at this level

 

[spiderman]

if we do substantially better this year it won't be because an AD made CM try harder. it'll be because our best returning players are a year older and a year better, despite unexpectedly losing two really good pieces.

 

[MrTbone]

I just don't buy into this concept that we did poorly last year because CM wasn't trying hard, and he'll try harder now because we have a new AD.
I think that's so incorrect it's laughable. but we can all have our opinions.

I'm not suggesting CM has been sitting around eating bon bons and now he's being told to get to work. But if Hardt has different expectations for CM than have been communicated in the past, it absolutely could change CM's behavior, how he coaches, what things he tries (or doesn't try), etc.

I think it's laughably incorrect to suggest that having a new boss with new expectations isn't going to impact behavior. It absolutely will, particularly if the new boss is willing to be confrontational, which I don't think the last boss was. Of course it boils down to having the players to make it happen, but you're probably giving CM too much credit if you think he can't be motivated by anyone other than himself.

 

[spiderman]

Of course it boils down to having the players to make it happen, but you're probably giving CM too much credit if you think he can't be motivated by anyone other than himself.

maybe. but I believe CM to be like every relatively successful coach I've ever know. extremely motivated to win.

I know people here will question "successful", just as people here have questioned that he's working his ass off. that's fine. I just disagree.

 

[KWeaver]

I am at the end of page 1 of this thread, but it needs to be said that a lot of people who were considered "good" were leaving BEFORE Gill left, too. That can go both ways -- You don't want the wrong people leaving.

 

[KWeaver]

I mean, it's funny to question when we will know that we have a good one, since it's taken us this long to actually figure out that Miller may or may not have been a good AD. He seemed pretty great when he left, and now we are not exactly thrilled, and yes, perhaps Gill was left too far behind to be able to make up some ground that was missing, otherwise.

I think we can far back enough to say that Chuck Boone was a pretty good AD. I don't even know what to say about Miller anymore.

One other thing that I was reading is that we are improving in the non-revenue generating sports. Meh. When we switched to the A10, we were actually really good in those sports, including baseball, field hockey, and women's soccer. We switched, and we went into the crapper. It's all about who you surround yourself with, too.

It's quite humorous for me that we are worried about non-rev sports when we entered the A-10 exclusively because of basketball, at the expense of everything else. There were some babies getting thrown out with the bathwater back then.

 

[WebSpinner]

very accurate words K. know and respect Chuck and think he did a pretty darn good job through a lot of changes in conferences, etc. Jim did some very good hiring, missed a couple and the 10 year deal still mystifies me but we were all rumbling that we had to keep CM whatever it took and it obviously took a 10 year deal to close it. personally, would have to punt, not based on what has taken place, said this before the deal, just would never go that long on a contract, no matter the guy. if Jim chose to punt and CM departed, he would have been crucified on here and we all know it. an AD is judged on hirings, win-loss records, championships and graduation rates, along with bringing in some money, all in all, not an easy job. we have a long, long, way to go with our new AD to judge him at all.

 

[Gospiders06]

I really believe Mooney has overstayed his welcome. It's been 7 years since our name went to the NCAA tournament. As a mid-major going to the NCAA should happen at least ONCE every 5 years. I just can't believe we have kept him for 13 years now. This year is more than likely the same or worse than the past SEVEN years. The only way I am keeping Mooney past this year is by somehow getting to the NCAA tournament. I am NOT the AD but I am not wasting money on season tickets.

 

[97spiderfan]

I mean, it's funny to question when we will know that we have a good one, since it's taken us this long to actually figure out that Miller may or may not have been a good AD. He seemed pretty great when he left, and now we are not exactly thrilled, and yes, perhaps Gill was left too far behind to be able to make up some ground that was missing, otherwise.

I think we can far back enough to say that Chuck Boone was a pretty good AD. I don't even know what to say about Miller anymore.

One other thing that I was reading is that we are improving in the non-revenue generating sports. Meh. When we switched to the A10, we were actually really good in those sports, including baseball, field hockey, and women's soccer. We switched, and we went into the crapper. It's all about who you surround yourself with, too.

It's quite humorous for me that we are worried about non-rev sports when we entered the A-10 exclusively because of basketball, at the expense of everything else. There were some babies getting thrown out with the bathwater back then.

Agreed. The CAA was a far superior conference in many non-revenue sports to the A-10 when we made the switch.

 

[ChoppinBroccoli]

Well, he went on the air and said the expectation is to compete for championships "each and every season." If we fail to compete next year, that'll be 8 straight years of missing that expectation. Then I suppose it becomes "what you do" vs. "what you say you'll do."

 

[MrTbone]

Well, he went on the air and said the expectation is to compete for championships "each and every season." If we fail to compete next year, that'll be 8 straight years of missing that expectation. Then I suppose it becomes "what you do" vs. "what you say you'll do."

I think there’s a fair bit of ambiguity in the definition of “compete for championships”.

 

[ChoppinBroccoli]

I think there’s a fair bit of ambiguity in the definition of “compete for championships”.

Yeah, there was that one time we made the semi-finals.

 

[spiderman]

Yeah, there was that one time we made the semi-finals.

there's tournament and regular season championship. coming in 3rd in the regular season is competing. it's not the goal. winning is the goal. but we want to be relevant all season every year.