Coaching incompetence
- Thread starter Eight Legger
- Start date
So what happened the first time that a substituteion was denied?
Plus
If URI missed in the last minute and we threw the ball in then directly out of bounds, would we be allowed to substitute? /s
We make up for being 339th in 3 point % by being 26th in % of our shots that are 3 pointers.
Who do we think we are? Central Arkansas or Western Carolina?
What is most important?
Triumvirate says shut up spidernation!!!!
Triumvirate says shut up spidernation!!!!
8legs1dream
Graduate Assistant
I thought this was getting bumped to add Moon's handling of GW3 to the coaching incompetence list 🤣
No 8legs, let's not forget we are hitting the books so darn hard we can't hit the boards that hard.
8legs1dream
Graduate Assistant
You guys are incredibly knowledgeable. The next time you are thrilled with a player, or excited with
a streak of wins, I’ ll be sure to follow your opinions. Basketball Jones,I wait to hear your your answer to who we should get as players and a coach.
a streak of wins, I’ ll be sure to follow your opinions. Basketball Jones,I wait to hear your your answer to who we should get as players and a coach.
We were hoping for Rodney Rice, however your traitorous Maryland icon did not help.
Could have started with Odom before he was hired across town.
Setting us up for the Patriot League move, one Facebook post at a time...
That's what it feels like. I remember when we moved to the A10. I was for staying in the CAA, thought we couldn't compete with the landscape. JB came in and showed with coaching acumen we could. But years later with moon at the helm it is a very rare feat to make an NCAA. So it does seem very plausible we will follow football down that path.
As troubling as it would be to many fans, you could be right...while the football move to the Patriot was pushed along by the disintegration of the former CAA...the move also kept the University from the pressure of having to get its hands dirty with a bunch of NIL money for football; player agents; employees of the school etc for a large roster of football players. The Patriot League model is likely to stay much closer to the good ole days of amateur college sports as things get sorted out in the years ahead.
Now you have the same questions and challenges flaring up in basketball. VCU just said it was going to spend $5M per year on players and take on all of the ramifications that come along with that. I'm afraid that like football the University will not want to dive into the deep water of the new era of college basketball. Once again the Patriot League would offer a much quieter and more traditional port for the Regatta.
I believe President Hallock when he says he believes D-1 athletics bring tremendous value and diversity to the University, but I don't think he's talking about the new D-1 model that's evolving rapidly. I'd guess he's thinking about the good ole days of mostly amateur college sports. It'll be very interesting to see how this whole thing evolves.
Go Spiders!
And even if Hallock did believe in this new D-1 model, our history suggests that a lot of the academics at UR like to look at us as an elite academic school and sports as very ancillary to that. There is validity to that thinking as that it was universities are for, not some minor league athletic programs. That is also not the world we live in either today.
And hence a large part of the reason we have Mooney for 20 years, why we hired Hardt from Bucknell (Patriot league school), we moved football down to the Patriot League. Our sports are seen by the powerbrokers at UR as a student amenity that we offer to student in our quest of educating them. So, yeah, the Patriot League is some safe haven for like minded institutions. We would be all over the Ivy league too if they allowed us.
I and I suspect many others on this board, see UR as very different from Patriot/Ivy league schools. I see UR as an elite academic institution but also able to have highly competitive national athletics and would like to see us more in the mold of Duke/Wake/Vandy than Bucknell/Lafeyette/Cornell. I think we have the money to be more like the former but we clearer don't have the organizational alignment to make it happen.
From a sports perspective, UR is far from Duke/Wake/Vandy for one simple reason - football. One has to wonder whether those schools will actually continue to invest in the new age of pay for play in that sport. None of them have top tier football talent and two of them are in a league (ACC) that is close to falling out of being relevant in the FBS altogether. The reality is UR is much more like the Patriot League teams.
I think we can add to the pile of evidence by listening to today’s press conferences for both Men’s and Women’s basketball. First, Rousell said that his vision for the Women’s team is a high school development model. He wants the multiyear academic type players. Mooney didn’t really answer the question and went in circles, but he did say that the A10 was trying to guide teams to the amount of “investment” the league thinks is required. Then Mooney mentioned how different all the team are and that he did not have an amount that the school was willing to state it was committed to. This seems to be another subtle sign that the administration would like to be in a tighter peer group to me. As I have said before I totally expect UR to move to whatever league sticks with whatever is closest to the “old” amateur model. There is no doubt that UR will end up as a full participant in the Patriot League in my view. The question is how quickly will it happen.
I think we can add to the pile of evidence by listening to today’s press conferences for both Men’s and Women’s basketball. First, Rousell said that his vision for the Women’s team is a high school development model. He wants the multiyear academic type players. Mooney didn’t really answer the question and went in circles, but he did say that the A10 was trying to guide teams to the amount of “investment” the league thinks is required. Then Mooney mentioned how different all the team are and that he did not have an amount that the school was willing to state it was committed to. This seems to be another subtle sign that the administration would like to be in a tighter peer group to me. As I have said before I totally expect UR to move to whatever league sticks with whatever is closest to the “old” amateur model. There is no doubt that UR will end up as a full participant in the Patriot League in my view. The question is how quickly will it happen.
Duke just spent $8M for a QB, so they see their football program going up, not down.
Like I mentioned in the revenue sharing post, football is a completely different story. In fact, I see UR stepping down in football level in a way supporting the notion that we want to be successful in basketball and our other sports. By not having to get our hands dirty with the expenses of football, we can devout that money and resources to our other sports, namely basketball. Literally no one would support our primary conference to go from A10 to Patriot League. Not Mooney, not any of the fans, not Queally or other big donors who have spent millions for us to be competitive at this level, I don’t see any reason to think otherwise. A10 contracts pay more than patriot league, our national exposure is more in A10 than PL. At worst we’ll be complacent with status quo in A10 and make no effort to want to be at the top of the A10 as other programs want to spend more money, but I don’t see that not happening either. We are a top 5 program in A10 in facilities and spending money (when they release that info every year).
With football, I hate to say this because there are a lot of us who are die hard spider supporters no matter what, but fact of the matter is 99% of the people don’t give a crap about FCS football and moving from one above average FCS conference to a slightly worse one, isn’t really seen as that big of a deal. Moving from A10 to patriot league in basketball is a huge drop, and will upset virtually everyone.
With football, I hate to say this because there are a lot of us who are die hard spider supporters no matter what, but fact of the matter is 99% of the people don’t give a crap about FCS football and moving from one above average FCS conference to a slightly worse one, isn’t really seen as that big of a deal. Moving from A10 to patriot league in basketball is a huge drop, and will upset virtually everyone.
Also for those of you who say UR hates bad press, moving our entire athletic department to patriot league would be the ultimate bad press. Again, for those who like to say that UR athletic admin just want to cash in their checks and call it a day, the easier thing would be to go unnoticed and stay with that status quo in A10 and not ruffle any feathers. Many of us want UR to strive to be in the big east and a top 25 program, which is wishful thinking sure. Being bad in the A10 would annoy a lot of people but we’ll have next year to look forward to. But voluntarily downgrading our athletic department would piss off a lot of people.
More money to basketball. Come on. How much has already been thrown toward basketball? At what point does the outcome consistently catch up with the investment? Investment looking like a great payback this year, right? We have greater problems from a top down standpoint than dumping more into the basketball program. I’m not sure any more money to players, coaches, airplanes, or facilities will solve our problems.
There's always a lot of talk on here about this being an "investment" and what our ROI is, blah blah blah.
For those of you still confused on this topic, no one of any influence views UR basketball as an investment. It is a cost that the university is willing to bear, for whatever reason you may assign. But that's it. If it were an investment, there would be actual change to the mostly flat trajectory they've been on for the past 14 or so years.
For those of you still confused on this topic, no one of any influence views UR basketball as an investment. It is a cost that the university is willing to bear, for whatever reason you may assign. But that's it. If it were an investment, there would be actual change to the mostly flat trajectory they've been on for the past 14 or so years.
Mooney is and has always been a poor to mediocre sideline coach. He's made so many in game mistakes over 20 years. WHY AFTER ALL THESE YEARS HAS HE NEVER CORRECTED HIS ERRORS?
Well, cost might be the underside of a coin with the other side being investment. Regardless of how one looks at it, the fact that there would be “change” is no different than substituting the term “cost” for “investment”. I don’t think the terminology one way or the other matters. It is the decision makers, figureheads, and lackeys who refuse to make changes to the program. They are in it for the long run come hell or high water of status quo and mediocrity.
most of us wouldn't be talking regularly about UR for 20-30 years if not for basketball and football.
the school better keep "investing".
the school better keep "investing".
And how exactly would going to the PL save costs? We would presumably still have the same amount of full scholarships and travel costs going to games. The only difference is this extra NIL revenue sharing stuff and there isn’t a rule that teams have to do this to be in the A10. I would rather UR not do the extra NIL revenue sharing stuff and be a bottom A10 team than go to the patriot league. Also, I’m willing to bet you that UR will do the revenue sharing stuff because we do care about basketball success.
As far as investment, I agree that from a finance perspective it isn’t a big - if any - money maker for the school although ticket revenue and media deals in the A10 will be a heck of a lot better than patriot league. But investment can also be seen in other non-financial sense. It’s an “investment” in keeping alumni, fans, donors happy. Every year in UR’s giving day, donations to athletics is always #1 in most donors and amount raised. It’s also an “investment” in exposure for the university, which Hallock and all of us agree adds tremendous value.
Agree. Athletics has been an integral part in our identity and helping us get to where we are athletically it would be foolish to think otherwise. I want us to push down on the gas pedal and keep taking steps forward to elevate our programs and not just remain on cruise control.
I call BS. This year is a prime example. How many people on the Forum are happy right now? We have posters already saying they don’t care anymore and aren’t going out of their way to watch/listen/attend the games.
Plus isn’t the goal conference championships and NCAA games? That doesn’t happen in the scenario above so what is the point? Oh yeah - we competed 🤢
Wouldn’t you still attend even if we didn’t build a practice facility or use private charter to fly the team around?
Investment presumes return, which in turn presumes monetary i think. We aren’t making scads of money on merchandise or tickets, and certainly not on ncaa credits. So it’s really just a cost to the university isn’t it?
Feel free to prove me wrong. I’d love to think that we’re treating what we do here as a product that we’re trying to get a hugely profitable return on, I just don’t think anyone closely associated with running the program uses that as their primary barometer.
You missed the point. It doesn’t matter what conference you’re talking about. The point is that oodles of money has been spent on the basketball program, and with PQ, Hardt, and CM the results are mediocrity. The program will not improve with Mooney as coach. We will continue to make NCAA tournament about once every 6-7 years and continue to be overwhelmed by VCU. This 20 year record of Mooney speaks for itself. Throw millions more at the program to get the same results.
