How many transfers do we need next season?

[SpiderTrap]

Already thinking of next year, and with conference seasons coming to an end - the portal will soon be open. Got me thinking - how many roster spots do we need to fill next year with transfers?

Someone will need to remind me how many HS kids we have coming in next season. I thought it was 3, but could be wrong.

But by my count - we are losing 5 spots to graduation - Hunt, Roche, Neskovic, B White, D'Entremont. All of these guys, with exception of Hunt who is injured, are currently getting minutes in each game. So that is 5 spots. And I think a reasonable assumption is we lose 2, maybe 3 players to the portal ourselves - hard to believe in this day and era, a 20 loss team retains everyone on the roster. So expect 7-8 spots to be open on the roster.

So we will likely need 4-5 guys from the portal to fill out the roster. And since all of these guys are playing, we will have a large amount of newcomers playing minutes next season as well. Not that is definetley a bad thing. In the past 2 seasons of having high amount of newcomers - UR has won the A10 regular season title, and then come in 13th in the A10 and lose 20 games. So its possible - we just swing back the other way next year and bounce back to win 20 games. But just trying to figure out - how many portal guys will UR need this coming season - and who do you think we should target? Not specific names, but types of players.

 

[Eight Legger]

12

 

[97spiderfan]

Is 13 an unreasonable number? I say that tongue and cheek but there is no one on our roster that I would lose sleep over if they left.

Walz has turned out to be a good player, but we aren't getting going to be competing for anything next year with this roster, so is keeping him as a senior on this team in our best interests.

The rest of the players, save the 2 freshman redshirts, who we have not seen on the court yet, I have seen enough to know that we probably aren't losing any future stars.

 

[SFspidur]

If everybody including walk-ons comes back, we are already at the limit of 15 roster spots.

Frosh: Argabright, Harper, Richardson
R-Frosh: McGlothin, Mooney, Robinson
R-Soph: Soulis
Junior: Graham, Tanner, Tyne, Washington
Senior: Beagle, Roumoglou, Walz
R-Senior: Weaver

 

[spiderman]

If everybody including walk-ons comes back, we are already at the limit of 15 roster spots.

Frosh: Argabright, Harper, Richardson
R-Frosh: McGlothin, Mooney, Robinson
R-Soph: Soulis
Junior: Graham, Tanner, Tyne, Washington
Senior: Beagle, Roumoglou, Walz
R-Senior: Weaver

I just can't imagine us using 3 of our roster spots on walk-on level players. and Weaver's already had 4 years to graduate. I assume he's leaving on his own.

 

[8legs1dream]

Walz has turned out to be a good player, but we aren't getting going to be competing for anything next year with this roster, so is keeping him as a senior on this team in our best interests.

Maybe we could trade him for 150k NIL money and a player to be named later

 

[SpiderTrap]

If everybody including walk-ons comes back, we are already at the limit of 15 roster spots.

Frosh: Argabright, Harper, Richardson
R-Frosh: McGlothin, Mooney, Robinson
R-Soph: Soulis
Junior: Graham, Tanner, Tyne, Washington
Senior: Beagle, Roumoglou, Walz
R-Senior: Weaver

But with the new roster limits and NIL payments directly from the school - do you think UR gets rid of Walk-ons? Or do they keep walk-ons, in a sense to keep down their payment amount. i.e. I am sure you could tell a walk-on, your can be on the team, but your getting little to no payment money, and some walk-ons will take that deal, which frees up more money for your top 8-10 guys.

But if you try to fill out entire roster with no walk-on type players, all of them will want something. Of course it will be varying amounts - I don't think player 14 on the roster gets 100K payment, but I don't think 20K would be unheard of. Especially when the bar right now being set by VCU and Mason is $3 million per year on mens basketball. Thats an average of 200K per player if 15 get even amount, which is not the case. Expect top level guys to get 300-500K, maybe more and then slide down that scale to the end of the bench.

I wonder if the payments can be incentive based as well. You will get 20K, but if you play in some many games or log so many minutes, etc - you get a bonus of 10K, etc.

 

[SFspidur]

Yeah, I obviously don't know what will happen with Weaver other than the fact he has another year of eligibility. I suspect he will graduate and move on.

I definitely would not be surprised if we stuck with 13 scholarship players plus 2 walk-ons. All 15 guys aren't going to get playing time or really even be developmental players. Go 8 or 9 deep, a few more redshirting or just riding the bench, and you're there barring catastrophic injury situation. So make that money go further spread over 13 instead of 15.

 

[Spiders4ever]

All of them

 

[spider23]

I do agree we have some potential transfers out.

I can see Beagle, GW3, as likely candidates - based on their roles this season - GW3 had very little game opportunity and Beagle's role diminished and Moon unwilling to play next to Walz or Soulis. So I would have both of them above 50%. Both have accomplishments that would at least allow them to have options (Beagle former Rookie of year in previous league, GW3 Ohio player of year in HS and Michigan recruit).

I think Tanner maybe next most likely - but he has got plenty of opportunity - and Moon stated that he was ahead of Dji's schedule - which personally don't think is a good comparison. Dji was a very good defender, Tanner does not look so inclined. Dji was a good playmaker, Tanner more of a spot up shooter. But all depends what he is looking for. Would expect him to stay.
Tyne - I think he played every minute - or something close the last few games? Probably has to feel better that he has a huge role here than taking chance in portal. Expect to stay.
Glou - no idea. Expect to stay, Moon gave plenty of minutes. He showed some promise but hard to feel good about him being a piece on an A10 challenger at this point, but maybe had a lot of rust this year.
Soulis - real wild card. Showed some potential. Based on St. Johns and St. Mary's offers think he could have a market if he thinks change of scenery would be beneficial. Limited minutes by injury. Think likely to stay.
Walz - Seems like a loyal soldier that likes school and access to golf course. Think he stays, BUT - he is a big body that had some pretty good games and of all our guys could see him getting a P6 NIL offer that would be hard to refuse.

 

[Eight Legger]

As 97 said, there's no one on this roster who I would be that upset to see leave. Maybe Tyne if this recent version of him is the real version. No clue on the redshirt freshmen since we haven't seen them, so I won't lose sleep if they all leave. Soulis has some potential, I think. Washington and AP I feel like there was a gross overestimation there in both cases for whatever reason. Beagle and Walz, eh.

Start over.

 

[Ferrum Spider]

If we don't get another Jordan King/Neal Quinn combo this offseason, expect the same results next season.

Don't really care at this point, likely opting out of season tickets for the first time in 25 years and spending my hard earned money on things that bring me joy and not make me want to throw my beer on the court in disgust while I listen to the propaganda on local media that literally everything is just fine in Spiderland. They just have a rolodex of excuses as to why we cant elevate the program.

20 loss season.....fine
9-27 vs your "rival"......fine
At least 1 embarrassing loss in the non conference slate EVERY FREAKING YEAR that derails any hope of an at large bid...fine
One injury to a good player that makes a bad team unwatchable....built in excuse for why the season went off the rails

If we keep Rousell this offseason, will opt in to a program that actually produces results and start going to those games.

This isn't about Mooney to me so much as it is his handlers holding him to 0 accountability. Everything about this program is so stale and predictable. Why do we extend him after every freaking successful season? Only to suck again the next season and not build on success. Then hear the same ole shit from our uninspiring, sack of potatoes masquerading as an AD that its just so hard to win out there, but were competing!

Imagine being a HS student with a 2.4 GPA at a mid major high school (academically speaking), applying to our admissions department, with no extracurriculars or community service saying something along the lines of, "yea I was a pretty mediocre student by your standards, but I did compete in my classes! They were just so hard!" and then admissions just lets them in. The BOT and Pres would lose their minds.

 

[spiderman]

Walz is a very important guy to keep. He's improved by leaps and bounds. While he'd get ggood offers, I think he stays and graduates ... and has a big year. For those saying we don't develop players, look at Walz. He was pretty stiff as a fresman.

Tyne shows signs and I think he could have a big year here next season. I think this is a great place for him.

Tanner looks better all the time to me. He likely has a big role next year.

AP didn't have the kind of year to move up a level, and he doesn't need to move down. He's getting plenty of run here. He just needs to shoot better.

Think I'm in the minority but I love Beagle's game. He'll have to do what he thinks is best. I'd be playing him at the 4. But Mooney doesn't.

Soulis ... he's got another year as a backup in his future. But after that he's the man for two years. He should stay.

GW3 ... Hunt, White and Roche are all gone. He SHOULD feel he's got a great shot at a major role next year. But who know based on Mooney's usage of him this year. We'll see how he feels.

 

[97spiderfan]

If we don't get another Jordan King/Neal Quinn combo this offseason, expect the same results next season.

Don't really care at this point, likely opting out of season tickets for the first time in 25 years and spending my hard earned money on things that bring me joy and not make me want to throw my beer on the court in disgust while I listen to the propaganda on local media that literally everything is just fine in Spiderland. They just have a rolodex of excuses as to why we cant elevate the program.

20 loss season.....fine
9-27 vs your "rival"......fine
At least 1 embarrassing loss in the non conference slate EVERY FREAKING YEAR that derails any hope of an at large bid...fine
One injury to a good player that makes a bad team unwatchable....built in excuse for why the season went off the rails

If we keep Rousell this offseason, will opt in to a program that actually produces results and start going to those games.

This isn't about Mooney to me so much as it is his handlers holding him to 0 accountability. Everything about this program is so stale and predictable. Why do we extend him after every freaking successful season? Only to suck again the next season and not build on success. Only to hear the same ole shit from our uninspiring, sack of potatoes masquerading as an AD that its just so hard to win out there, but were competing!

Imagine being a HS student with a 2.4 GPA at a mid major high school (academically speaking), applying to our admissions department, with no extracurriculars or community service saying something along the lines of, "yea I was a pretty mediocre student by your standards, but I did compete in my classes! They were just so hard!" and then admissions just lets them in. The BOT and Pres would lose their minds.

This rant is everything and spot on. Thanks Ferrum. You are 100% correct that this isn't about Mooney but everyone around him that fails to hold him to any accountability.

Any good leader in any capacity is a leader who takes accountability when a mistake is made or a goal is not met. Mooney is INCAPABLE of doing that and why a school with an effing leadership school allows that him to do that as our most visible leader in the community is a really sad statement on the academic side of things; we don't practice what we preach or in our case teach. I wish our ivory tower, academic elites would realize that. If UR is to be seen as a truly top notch university, shouldn't we be elite in everything we do.

 

[97spiderfan]

Walz is a very important guy to keep. He's improved by leaps and bounds. While he'd get ggood offers, I think he stays and graduates ... and has a big year. For those saying we don't develop players, look at Walz. He was pretty stiff as a fresman.

Tyne shows signs and I think he could have a big year here next season. I think this is a great place for him.

Tanner looks better all the time to me. He likely has a big role next year.

AP didn't have the kind of year to move up a level, and he doesn't need to move down. He's getting plenty of run here. He just needs to shoot better.

Think I'm in the minority but I love Beagle's game. He'll have to do what he thinks is best. I'd be playing him at the 4. But Mooney doesn't.

Soulis ... he's got another year as a backup in his future. But after that he's the man for two years. He should stay.

GW3 ... Hunt, White and Roche are all gone. He SHOULD feel he's got a great shot at a major role next year. But who know based on Mooney's usage of him this year. We'll see how he feels.

So basically, you want all of the guys who played significant roles in a team that is going to finish 13th or 14th in the A-10 to run it back and return next year?

 

[spiderman]

So basically, you want all of the guys who played significant roles in a team that is going to finish 13th or 14th in the A-10 to run it back and return next year?

yes. and with their continued development and the 5 new faces, I think we'll be much better.
I don't think we'll be better with a slew of incoming transfers.

 

[spider23]

So basically, you want all of the guys who played significant roles in a team that is going to finish 13th or 14th in the A-10 to run it back and return next year?

Yep, not buying the player development angle. Not saying we don't develop guys, but we are not making guys that are average great - so we need to replace them. Justin Harper showed great improvement, but he had Providence offer out of HS, and he was 6'9 , could shoot it, and decent athelete. But his biggest improvement came when he went outside the system to big man school in Boston. TJ, similar, had all kinds or resources and self starter. Notice how we don't get those easy scores on inbounds since he left.

Tanner - I guess you fall right in line with moon, and don't consider the defensive side of the ball?

We need a new everything basically , BUT with moon back imperative to have top 3 talent to compete for top of A10.

 

[97spiderfan]

yes. and with their continued development and the 5 new faces, I think we'll be much better.
I don't think we'll be better with a slew of incoming transfers.

Ok. Your logic makes sense. I happen to believe that we have very little high end talent on our roster, so even if all of our current rostered players get better with development, they still are not going to be able to compete with the best teams in our conference.

They probably all won't leave but I'd rather lose some and at least have the opportunity to pick up players with a chance to be upper echelon A-10 players, I vote for that. You need multiple all A-10 level players if you wanna finish Top 3-4 in the league, we have none on this roster (that I see).

We might not be better next year with a slew of incoming transfers, but next year is a wash already given the state of the roster, so I'm looking at 2 years down the road.

 

[spider23]

but next year is a wash already given the state of the roster, so I'm looking at 2 years down the road

So is Mooney #LongGame

 

[spiderman]

Yep, not buying the player development angle. Not saying we don't develop guys, but we are not making guys that are average great - so we need to replace them.

I think expectations for Walz were low. He's become a very solid big man, with his best year ahead of him. He's developed.

Tanner - I guess you fall right in line with moon, and don't consider the defensive side of the ball?

I believe in the metrics ... especially this late in the season. Defensive Box Score Plus Minus says Delonnie is our best defender. That's not a surprise. Our 2nd best (by that metric) is Tanner. Not saying I want him defending a point guard one on one. But the team plays better defense when he's on the floor. I was actually more concerned with him on the offensive end, but that's coming around.

 

[spiderman]

I happen to believe that we have very little high end talent on our roster, so even if all of our current rostered players get better with development, they still are not going to be able to compete with the best teams in our conference.

Agreed. But unless we get lucky (Jordan King) I don't love our chances of finding guaranteed high end talent in the portal. Even with the increase in NIL, I think we'll be very happy to land anyone like Dusan, AP, BA and GW3 type guys.

For one I think there will be less to choose from with the grad transfer stuff done. And with the 15 roster spots available, I think more power conferences will fill those spots with the available transfer talent.

 

[spiderman]

I just can't imagine us using 3 of our roster spots on walk-on level players. and Weaver's already had 4 years to graduate. I assume he's leaving on his own.

Some news on Weaver. Impressive.

 

[Ferrum Spider]

This rant is everything and spot on. Thanks Ferrum. You are 100% correct that this isn't about Mooney but everyone around him that fails to hold him to any accountability.

Any good leader in any capacity is a leader who takes accountability when a mistake is made or a goal is not met. Mooney is INCAPABLE of doing that and why a school with an effing leadership school allows that him to do that as our most visible leader in the community is a really sad statement on the academic side of things; we don't practice what we preach or in our case teach. I wish our ivory tower, academic elites would realize that. If UR is to be seen as a truly top notch university, shouldn't we be elite in everything we do.

They're too busy being butthurt over not being hired at an Ivy League school that they try and morph us into one but realize they cant, so patriot league is next best option.

Same can be extended to the students. A lot of contempt amongst the student body thinking the athletes only got in because of their athletic ability. In some instances that is true, but explain to me why historically have had a better graduation rate than the student body themselves?

 

[GKiller]

we aren't going to be fishing in the portal much this offseason I'm convinced. Who transfers out plays a role. But main reason is the Moon long game. Reset time with 4-5 year hs guys. 5 man class. be young. Just show some promise. Not the best for performance but build for the hopeful payoff in 3 years when the contract timing is good.

I don't see many guys leaving, they would all be a transfer down, although there r definitely some I want back. Fair to think we'll have 2, hard to not have at least 2 these days. walk ons back. maybe all 3. possibly not Liam Weaver he would be most likely to depart. maybe Graham gets his 2 in 4 handshake ship. so as of now I'll call it 2-3 new guys from portal. we'll see.

 

[spiderstudent17]

yes. and with their continued development and the 5 new faces, I think we'll be much better.
I don't think we'll be better with a slew of incoming transfers.

I’m with 97 on this one. Many of our players will be juniors/seniors next year and joined this team with college basketball experience under their belt already. They may develop more individually and as a team, but not enough to move the needle where we want to. Bring back Walz and Tyne. If everyone else transfers, I’m okay with it.

 

[spider23]

Walz had Penn State offer. Go re-read my postsfrom last year and this year. I had expectations and many others did too that after two years in system would be ready to step in. And moons talk preseason. I do think he is mostly on schedule now, but took a long time to get there. He was pretty decisive and good metrics last season in limited minutes but did not do that much for first half of season. Coming on again late. I'm not sure I believe the Tanner D metrics, but he makes my eyes bleed with inability to keep guys in front of him. But I have watched less spider hoops than most on here so could be wrong.

 

[spiderstudent17]

so as of now I'll call it 2-3 new guys from portal. we'll see.

2-3 new players is likely all we need to see a considerable impact. I posted this in the house settlement thread, but how we allocate our NIL money is just as important as having the money to spend in the first place. I would rather get 2 absolute studs and difference makers next year and give them each more money than get 4-5 guys who are all okay and maybe one has a break out season and does well here.

 

[spiderman]

2-3 new players is likely all we need to see a considerable impact. I posted this in the house settlement thread, but how we allocate our NIL money is just as important as having the money to spend in the first place. I would rather get 2 absolute studs and difference makers next year and give them each more money than get 4-5 guys who are all okay and maybe one has a break out season and does well here.

everyone has a price, but "absolute studs" are in high demand and will have high major offers with really large NILs. How much do you think we'd have to overspend to land that kind of stud?

 

[Ferrum Spider]

Walz had Penn State offer. Go re-read my postsfrom last year and this year. I had expectations and many others did too that after two years in system would be ready to step in. And moons talk preseason. I do think he is mostly on schedule now, but took a long time to get there. He was pretty decisive and good metrics last season in limited minutes but did not do that much for first half of season. Coming on again late. I'm not sure I believe the Tanner D metrics, but he makes my eyes bleed with inability to keep guys in front of him. But I have watched less spider hoops than most on here so could be wrong.

Always liked Walz, but I am not sure he was a natural fit for this system that involves a passing big man which slowed his progress. This is a guy that would thrive under a Jerry Wainwright/Dick Tarrant type of coach.

 

[97spiderfan]

Walz had Penn State offer. Go re-read my postsfrom last year and this year. I had expectations and many others did too that after two years in system would be ready to step in. And moons talk preseason. I do think he is mostly on schedule now, but took a long time to get there. He was pretty decisive and good metrics last season in limited minutes but did not do that much for first half of season. Coming on again late. I'm not sure I believe the Tanner D metrics, but he makes my eyes bleed with inability to keep guys in front of him. But I have watched less spider hoops than most on here so could be wrong.

No, you are correct. Tanner lacks the athletic quickness to play guard/wing at the A-10 level. He is kind of like Roche in that regards, but Roche at least had the potential to be sniper on offense, which Tanner lacks. He isn't getting the quick twitch muscle movement, no matter how many developmental years he has in our system and that ultimately is the problem. He probably would do really well in like the Patriot League or Big South though.

 

[97spiderfan]

Always liked Walz, but I am not sure he was a natural fit for this system that involves a passing big man which slowed his progress. This is a guy that would thrive under a Jerry Wainwright/Dick Tarrant type of coach.

And yes on Walz. Walz is a banger but he plays in a system where we want our big men to passers and to facilitate the offense. I give Walz credit for developing his game to hit some outside shots and at the end of the season make some passes from the top of the key.

But damn, you would have to wonder how he would do in a system that utilizes his natural strengths. If I'm Walz, I have to wonder that as well. What if I went to a system that played their centers in a more traditional format?

 

[spider23]

But damn, you would have to wonder how he would do in a system that utilizes his natural strengths. If I'm Walz, I have to wonder that as well. What if I went to a system that played their centers in a more traditional format?

As I noted he seems like a guy that will return, but yes maybe he would like a system that plays more to his strengths and heck an SEC team can offer him big bucks even if they think of him as the 9th man

 

[ur2K]

We've got something with the bigs - Walz has come on towards the end of the season and I think Soulis has potential. I don't think Tyne can be our lead guard - he can be a secondary piece (doesn't seem to make players around him better with his passing and plays out of control at times) - but history has shown here that we need the lead guard to be exceptional - he can be good, but not sure he's next in line of the likes of KA, K0, Lindsay, Gilly, even SDJ.

The rest of the roster - meh.

 

[spiderstudent17]

everyone has a price, but "absolute studs" are in high demand and will have high major offers with really large NILs. How much do you think we'd have to overspend to land that kind of stud?

I think we’ll be able to compete more than you think, assuming we aren’t completely incompetent with how we allocate the money. In terms of absolute studs, we have never and will never be landing 5 start recruits. So I’m referring to high 3 star/4 star guys, or players who played very well for 2-3 years and are looking to move up a level. Unlike many P5s who will have a full roster of high level players and more mouths to feed with NIL, our recruiting pitch could be come here, get a lot of minutes and make an immediate impact. And hoping we are smart with how we distribute NIL, those top players would have a greater piece of the same size pie (assuming we do in fact spend $3 mill per year like most P5s would do).

 

[spiderman]

Well ... we'll see. our recruiting pitch vs P5's has always been "come here, get a lot of minutes and make an immediate impact". We always assume they won't get that chance at a P5 ... or at least think they will.

 

[spiderstudent17]

Well ... we'll see. our recruiting pitch vs P5's has always been "come here, get a lot of minutes and make an immediate impact". We always assume they won't get that chance at a P5 ... or at least think they will.

The other consideration is assuming we are both operating with the same(ish) amount of money per year for MBB now, then we can offer an individual more than other P5s. Other P5s will have more top players they’re recruiting and also on their roster already. They will all command more money. I’m not saying for us to try and have a full roster of top level players, but maybe like 2-3 of them. Maybe P5s offer a player $400K per year because they have more mouths to feed and need to compensate other great players too. On the other hand, we can offer that player $500K+ and pay the players on our current roster less. This operates under the assumption that we aren’t handing out NIL money like candy just because someone has been here longer. Might be a wrong assumption to make.

 

[GKiller]

2-3 new players is likely all we need to see a considerable impact. I posted this in the house settlement thread, but how we allocate our NIL money is just as important as having the money to spend in the first place. I would rather get 2 absolute studs and difference makers next year and give them each more money than get 4-5 guys who are all okay and maybe one has a break out season and does well here.

I was just answering the thread question. and that I don't see a high qty of transfers in, compared to our last few classes. & yeah it could be 1. in theory. Get a Cooper Flagg. Offer him 20.5 million make him say no. But like sman said the issue is finding those studs. I'd take 2 studs too.

Problem is Mooney offensive & defensive systems and his style are not conducive to that. Except possibly the 1 & 5 guys. the small PG and the shooting/passing big. But it seems like that's where we're most set positionally. Tyne terrible shooting but 2 years of development I don't see Moon recruiting over him. we need another guard but Moon likely sees with Tyne not over Tyne. In reality with this team we could recruit over anyone. But in Moon mind he thinks i got the 1 & 5 set (maybe bring in another devlopmental 5 depending on who we lose) and blend in the 5 frosh of course big time. well call it 3 or 4 of them. I bet he redshirts 1 or 2 of the frosh. Anyway my confidence in Moon getting a couple relative studs is low.

 

[spiderman]

The other consideration is assuming we are both operating with the same(ish) amount of money per year for MBB now, then we can offer an individual more than other P5s. Other P5s will have more top players they’re recruiting and also on their roster already. They will all command more money. I’m not saying for us to try and have a full roster of top level players, but maybe like 2-3 of them. Maybe P5s offer a player $400K per year because they have more mouths to feed and need to compensate other great players too. On the other hand, we can offer that player $500K+ and pay the players on our current roster less. This operates under the assumption that we aren’t handing out NIL money like candy just because someone has been here longer. Might be a wrong assumption to make.

yes, if we somehow have the money to outbid a P5 of course we have a chance.
but I'll believe that when I see it.
I don't even think we'll outbid VCU and GMU level teams.