Best case scenario

[mr.spider]

I think what frustrates me the most and leaves me feeling despair is the success cap we now face. I am sure we can improve slightly. But the best Mooney is capable of on his best day is an NIT run or a NCAA appearance miracle once in a blue moon. This is not acceptable, and if that is all we hope for, it isn't worth my time, energy, or emotion.

It feels like we are on a 3 or 4 year plan just to make it to the NIT again. And somehow that is considered ok.

It also struck me way back whenever it was we made the Sweet16, Mooney said something to the effect that if we were ever FORTUNATE enough to make it back to the Sweet16, it would be remarkable. Why not aim higher, built on, don't treat it like a miracle. His attitude and lack of motivation is the reason his low bar cap is in place.

 

[SpiderK]

This will only be a two year shot assuming we can keep this “junior” class at UR. Once that class is gone it will be almost all freshman again.

 

[Ferrum Spider]

This will only be a two year shot assuming we can keep this “junior” class at UR. Once that class is gone it will be almost all freshman again.

This is why next year is very important for the long term health of the program. We have to make the NCAA's for two reasons, keep the current group in tact for the following season(3 grad transfers) and for the next year have something to go to recruits with. I still think the biggest reason for the downtrend was our inability to close on highly rated recruits our first couple of years after the NCAAs. They were not many classes with multiple contributors (Think Buck, Sherrod, Golden year or Gilyard/Cayo) between 2011-2015. Unfortunately by the time we picked up recruiting the years of poor recruiting caught up and the on court product left a lot to be desired.

Not that it matters, but an NCAA tournament appearance and run probably wont satisfy the dozens of fans on this board if they are true to their word (I am done with Spider athletics because I hate Mooney). But at the very least will set the program back into the trajectory to where its needed and maybe even a few of them will put down their pitchforks.

*This is not an endorsement to either fire/retain Mooney. Just a pragmatic observation and since we know hes coming back just playing out possible scenarios.

 

[97spiderfan]

This is why next year is very important for the long term health of the program. We have to make the NCAA's for two reasons, keep the current group in tact for the following season(3 grad transfers) and for the next year have something to go to recruits with. I still think the biggest reason for the downtrend was our inability to close on highly rated recruits our first couple of years after the NCAAs. They were not many classes with multiple contributors (Think Buck, Sherrod, Golden year or Gilyard/Cayo) between 2011-2015. Unfortunately by the time we picked up recruiting the years of poor recruiting caught up and the on court product left a lot to be desired.

Not that it matters, but an NCAA tournament appearance and run probably wont satisfy the dozens of fans on this board if they are true to their word (I am done with Spider athletics because I hate Mooney). But at the very least will set the program back into the trajectory to where its needed and maybe even a few of them will put down their pitchforks.

*This is not an endorsement to either fire/retain Mooney. Just a pragmatic observation and since we know hes coming back just playing out possible scenarios.

If Mooney gets us back to the NCAA, of course I would embrace that and I have been one of his harshest critics. I have maintained for as long as the day as long, that this situation is entirely in Chris's hands.

I don't hate Mooney, I just think he can't perform his job very well and have about 8 years of evidence to back that up.

 

[Not-A-Homer]

This is why next year is very important for the long term health of the program. We have to make the NCAA's for two reasons, keep the current group in tact for the following season(3 grad transfers) and for the next year have something to go to recruits with. I still think the biggest reason for the downtrend was our inability to close on highly rated recruits our first couple of years after the NCAAs. They were not many classes with multiple contributors (Think Buck, Sherrod, Golden year or Gilyard/Cayo) between 2011-2015. Unfortunately by the time we picked up recruiting the years of poor recruiting caught up and the on court product left a lot to be desired.

Not that it matters, but an NCAA tournament appearance and run probably wont satisfy the dozens of fans on this board if they are true to their word (I am done with Spider athletics because I hate Mooney). But at the very least will set the program back into the trajectory to where its needed and maybe even a few of them will put down their pitchforks.

*This is not an endorsement to either fire/retain Mooney. Just a pragmatic observation and since we know hes coming back just playing out possible scenarios.

Making the NCAA tournament next year is not going to happen unless the team stumbles into an A-10 tournament championship. I am willing to wager.

 

[SpiderK]

Making the NCAA tournament next year is not going to happen unless the team stumbles into an A-10 tournament championship. I am willing to wager.

We need to stumble into a defense.

 

[Captain Anderson]

This is why next year is very important for the long term health of the program. We have to make the NCAA's for two reasons, keep the current group in tact for the following season(3 grad transfers) and for the next year have something to go to recruits with. I still think the biggest reason for the downtrend was our inability to close on highly rated recruits our first couple of years after the NCAAs. They were not many classes with multiple contributors (Think Buck, Sherrod, Golden year or Gilyard/Cayo) between 2011-2015. Unfortunately by the time we picked up recruiting the years of poor recruiting caught up and the on court product left a lot to be desired.

Not that it matters, but an NCAA tournament appearance and run probably wont satisfy the dozens of fans on this board if they are true to their word (I am done with Spider athletics because I hate Mooney). But at the very least will set the program back into the trajectory to where its needed and maybe even a few of them will put down their pitchforks.

*This is not an endorsement to either fire/retain Mooney. Just a pragmatic observation and since we know hes coming back just playing out possible scenarios.

This is what concerns me: that Mooney wasn’t able to capitalize on the Sweet Sixteen momentum on the recruiting trail. Maybe we do get back to the tournament in 2020 but how are we going to recruit over the next few years? Getting back to the tournament in 2020 and then not going again for 5-8 more years doesn’t excite me. I think we are better than that. I feel like Mooney is pushing the “best class ever” narrative in order to save his own bacon but where are we as a program in 2 years?

 

[Spider B]

Can’t win playing defense like we do (or don’t) and getting crushed on the boards night in and night out. We won’t make the tournament until those issues are addressed. It’s hard for me to see either of these areas greatly improved next year, but hopefully CM has learned his lesson.

 

[mr.spider]

Mooney learning a lesson. What a joke. This program needed a shot in the rear-end but it was left to die with Mooney

 

[Spider B]

Mooney learning a lesson. What a joke. This program needed a shot in the rear-end but it was left to die with Mooney

Agreed

 

[CAAguy]

This is why next year is very important for the long term health of the program. We have to make the NCAA's for two reasons, keep the current group in tact for the following season(3 grad transfers) and for the next year have something to go to recruits with. I still think the biggest reason for the downtrend was our inability to close on highly rated recruits our first couple of years after the NCAAs. They were not many classes with multiple contributors (Think Buck, Sherrod, Golden year or Gilyard/Cayo) between 2011-2015. Unfortunately by the time we picked up recruiting the years of poor recruiting caught up and the on court product left a lot to be desired.

Not that it matters, but an NCAA tournament appearance and run probably wont satisfy the dozens of fans on this board if they are true to their word (I am done with Spider athletics because I hate Mooney). But at the very least will set the program back into the trajectory to where its needed and maybe even a few of them will put down their pitchforks.

*This is not an endorsement to either fire/retain Mooney. Just a pragmatic observation and since we know hes coming back just playing out possible scenarios.

If the Spiders are going to battle for an at-large next year (everyone can always battle for the auto bid every year), they’ll need to play at a certain level to be in the hunt (generally Top 60 KenPom overall; Top 70 KenPom defensive efficiency). This year, UR was 201 in KP overall, 124 offense, 285 defense.

It would require an unprecedented leap in overall standard/level of play (at both ends) from essentially the same group plus Sherod and Francis.

What makes this task even more daunting is that VCU, Dayton, Rhode Island, Duquesne, Mason, St Joes, and Davidson return just about everybody. And St Bonny/St Louis will certainly add some pieces to their A-10 finalist/NCAA cores. The league was incredibly young this season. It also appears your OOC schedule will be more competitive as well.

The A-10 will be much stronger/more competitive next season. UR will need to leapfrog just about everyone above in order to compete for an at-large, a very challenging proposition.

 

[GKiller]

If the Spiders are going to battle for an at-large next year (everyone can always battle for the auto bid every year), they’ll need to play at a certain level to be in the hunt (generally Top 60 KenPom overall; Top 70 KenPom defensive efficiency). This year, UR was 201 in KP overall, 124 offense, 285 defense.

It would require an unprecedented leap in overall standard/level of play (at both ends) from essentially the same group plus Sherod and Francis.

What makes this task even more daunting is that VCU, Dayton, Rhode Island, Duquesne, Mason, St Joes, and Davidson return just about everybody. And St Bonny/St Louis will certainly add some pieces to their A-10 finalist/NCAA cores. The league was incredibly young this season. It also appears your OOC schedule will be more competitive as well.

The A-10 will be much stronger/more competitive next season. UR will need to leapfrog just about everyone above in order to compete for an at-large, a very challenging proposition.

Yes most have been beating that same drum b/c it's true. But you said it all pretty succinctly and the added KenPom was a nice touch. What you fail to consider however is our own Jabba the Hardt has a SECRET plan. It was part of a Q&A but shhh, it's actually still very secret and innovative. He told us "if we work hard in the offseason to get bigger, stronger, better and everyone stays healthy" - no other team will do this or be as hungry as us - we'll compete for that elusive 8 years and counting NCAA bid. Forget precedent, forget Mooney coaching, forget KenPom, and forget the rest of the young A10.

 

[97spiderfan]

Can’t win playing defense like we do (or don’t) and getting crushed on the boards night in and night out. We won’t make the tournament until those issues are addressed. It’s hard for me to see either of these areas greatly improved next year, but hopefully CM has learned his lesson.

Exactly. We were the worst defensive team in the league and what 2nd worst in the country on the offensive glass and not much better on the defensive glass.

Sherod and Francis make us a better offensive team, which we were already pretty good at. I don't see how they even more the needle much on our defensive/rebounding issues. Plus, Mooney is still going to be teaching his damn shoot and retreat philsophy and having our big men stay out of foul trouble by letting through uncontested lay-ups.

He should have learned that lesson about 5 years ago when his defense went south on him. He didn't and I see no reason for hope that all of a sudden some light bulb is going off for him now.

 

[CAAguy]

There were just 7 non-P6 at-large bids this season (a fairly healthy number based on recent history/trends) — Gonzaga, Temple, VCU, Belmont, Cincinnati, Nevada, and Central Florida. All of them were Top 50 KenPom except Temple (the lone outlier).

Next yr, there will be “many” other non-P6 teams trying to recapture past glory — Wichita St, Memphis, UConn, Dayton, San Diego St, Davidson, Rhode Island, etc.

An at-large bid is an uphill battle for even the most accomplished and well-positioned of the non-P6 contenders/programs.

 

[fatherspider]

Making the NCAA tournament next year is not going to happen unless the team stumbles into an A-10 tournament championship. I am willing to wager.

Not one of the mooney supporters would bet decent cash even money that ur makes the dance next year. If there are please pm me.

 

[fatherspider]

There were just 7 non-P6 at-large bids this season (a fairly healthy number based on recent history/trends) — Gonzaga, Temple, VCU, Belmont, Cincinnati, Nevada, and Central Florida. All of them were Top 50 KenPom except Temple (the lone outlier
Next yr, there will be “many” other non-P6 teams trying to recapture past glory — Wichita St, Memphis, UConn, Dayton, San Diego St, Davidson, Rhode Island, etc.

An at-large bid is an uphill battle for even the most accomplished and well-positioned of the non-P6 contenders/programs.

Vcu??? 8 years running from the same league...oMG next years excuses are already being set.

And none of the teams mentioned are on an 8 year slump. Many had one down year, not in the same class of ineptitude as ur. ANd are you saying that we shouldnt even think about competing with such programs? Wow

 

[fatherspider]

This is what concerns me: that Mooney wasn’t able to capitalize on the Sweet Sixteen momentum on the recruiting trail. Maybe we do get back to the tournament in 2020 but how are we going to recruit over the next few years? Getting back to the tournament in 2020 and then not going again for 5-8 more years doesn’t excite me. I think we are better than that. I feel like Mooney is pushing the “best class ever” narrative in order to save his own bacon but where are we as a program in 2 years?

Yes he certainly is doing that and the statement is very far fetched imo

 

[8legs]

Maybe Hardt put Mooney on "double secret probation" and we just don't know it.

 

[Marley13]

We had a huge Animal House party my freshmen or sophomore year. Didn’t end up well.

 

[8legs]

We had a huge Animal House party my freshmen or sophomore year. Didn’t end up well.

We had a toga party where we turned on the lights and took a group picture every hour. Suffice to say as a result there are a number of us who could never run for public office.

 

[Marley13]

We had the Deathmobile on the front lawn. After numerous beers it seemed like a good idea to roll it down the hill. Not a good idea. Lawsuits ensued as I recall.

 

[MrTbone]

We had the Deathmobile on the front lawn. After numerous beers it seemed like a good idea to roll it down the hill. Not a good idea. Lawsuits ensued as I recall.

Did you run it into the rock?

 

[8legs]

Did you run it into the rock?

We put the rock there.

 

[Eight Legger]

There were just 7 non-P6 at-large bids this season (a fairly healthy number based on recent history/trends) — Gonzaga, Temple, VCU, Belmont, Cincinnati, Nevada, and Central Florida. All of them were Top 50 KenPom except Temple (the lone outlier).

Next yr, there will be “many” other non-P6 teams trying to recapture past glory — Wichita St, Memphis, UConn, Dayton, San Diego St, Davidson, Rhode Island, etc.

An at-large bid is an uphill battle for even the most accomplished and well-positioned of the non-P6 contenders/programs.

I've heard this argument and number of times, and while technically it's correct, it over-complicates matters. The A10 is always a multi-bid league. So you don't have to worry about beating out dozens of teams nationally, you just have to be one of the best three teams in the A10 most years. That's not easy but it's easier.

 

[Marley13]

To the right of the rock looking downhill.

 

[MrTbone]

To the right of the rock looking downhill.

I’ve fallen off that hill a few times. I even rode a grocery cart off it once. Never a car though. Sweet.

 

[8legs]

Roll Chi!