Recent Big East expansion article

[spiderstudent17]

Here's another article I found. I know that he is saying something previously talked about, and nothing new has changed, but hey it's preseason! It's always something interesting to bring up.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebas...lbag-ohio-states-retooling-big-east-expansion

Here are my thoughts:

1. I honestly think we are a perfect team for the Big East. We fit the mold of what they look for i.e. small, private college, strong academics. And even though we are not religiously affiliated, we were founded as a Baptist school.

2. The main emphasis will be looking at school's Men's basketball programs, however, looking at UR as a whole athletically we have a lot to offer. We have a very strong Women's Swim and Diving team, a field hockey team that always competes for an A-10 championship. Furthermore, our men's lacrosse is going to be an elite program in the upcoming years in my opinion. Also, we have good soccer, tennis, and golf programs. And with respect to basketball, Richmond has historically had a very solid basketball program.

3. The whole notion that we are a "lesser school" (in terms of popularity in the city) in an average market will definitely change if we were in the Big East. I know we are close to Georgetown, but we would be the only Virginia school in the conference, and so our popularity will surely increase.

I know it's down the road, but it's interesting to think about how this decision will be made, and what criteria is looked at. Personally, I think we would be a great addition to the conference and can only add both academically and athletically!

 

[Ulla1]

17, a

Here's another article I found. I know that he is saying something previously talked about, and nothing new has changed, but hey it's preseason! It's always something interesting to bring up.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebas...lbag-ohio-states-retooling-big-east-expansion

Here are my thoughts:

1. I honestly think we are a perfect team for the Big East. We fit the mold of what they look for i.e. small, private college, strong academics. And even though we are not religiously affiliated, we were founded as a Baptist school.

2. The main emphasis will be looking at school's Men's basketball programs, however, looking at UR as a whole athletically we have a lot to offer. We have a very strong Women's Swim and Diving team, a field hockey team that always competes for an A-10 championship. Furthermore, our men's lacrosse is going to be an elite program in the upcoming years in my opinion. Also, we have good soccer, tennis, and golf programs. And with respect to basketball, Richmond has historically had a very solid basketball program.

3. The whole notion that we are a "lesser school" (in terms of popularity in the city) in an average market will definitely change if we were in the Big East. I know we are close to Georgetown, but we would be the only Virginia school in the conference, and so our popularity will surely increase.

I know it's down the road, but it's interesting to think about how this decision will be made, and what criteria is looked at. Personally, I think we would be a great addition to the conference and can only add both academically and athletically!

Agree 100%. The Big East is a perfect fit for the Spiders. OSC

 

[UR Fan 2]

A lesser school in an average market probably is a comparison of recent bball success of VCU. I for one think they are heading down and we are heading up. If we dance this year we will be at the top of the Big East wish list.

 

[Jwilk2]

Spiders are in a perfect spot right now. Don't belong in Big East and should not want to be there.

 

[Ulla1]

The A10 is the new CAA. Look at the colleges in the A10: vcu, uri, lasalle, gmu, et c. Pretty bad. If not the Big East, then would rather be in the Patriot League. OSC

 

[spiderstudent17]

I think the Spiders are in a great position in the A-10 as well. However, if possible, moving to the Big East would be a better move in my
opinion. Personally, I'd rather be in the A-10 than the Patriot League. Better competition and conference recognition.

 

[Ulla1]

17, unfortunately the A10 gets little respect. Honestly, look at the institutions that comprise it. When UR joined, Temple and Xavier were members. Butler was a member for one year. Well, Temple, Xavier and Butler have left, replaced by vcu, gmu and Davidson. Not an equal trade. It is what it is. Would love for UR to be in the Big East, if not then the Patriot League.

 

[spiderstudent17]

Ulla,

VCU and Davidson have added a lot to our league. I don't think it's a fair argument to say that because the A-10 now is "worse" than the A-10 a few years ago, the Patriot League would be a better fit. The A-10 as it is now is 100% a stronger league than the Patriot League. Sure every league is going to have the bottom feeders, but the A-10 top to bottom is a better league. We've consistently had 3 teams go to the tournament every year for awhile and had 6 teams make it 2 years ago. In the most recent CBS rankings we had 6 teams (including us) in the top 65. We are often regarded as a high mid-major. Look at this post. We are considered the 8th best conference.

http://m.bleacherreport.com/article...the-2014-15-college-basketball-season/page/11

To me, I am happy where we are, but think that the only step up would be moving to the Big East.

 

[97spiderfan]

Still think we are the 3rd choice for two slots. Would love to get a bid, but the A-10 is a great league, especially if the Big East doesn't raid our top teams. We are not going to the Patriot League, that is laughable.

 

[MrTbone]

Patriot League??? Seriously?

 

[Ulla1]

Patriot League??? Seriously?

Tbone, The fact that UR is a private school with academic standards makes it a much better fit for the Big East or Patriot Leagues.

 

[SFspidur]

Too bad we're talking about sports leagues then.

 

[Ulla1]

Too bad we're talking about sports leagues then.

SF, conferences are not just about sports. There are numerous academic functions among member institutions. OSC

 

[Spider B]

I would like to move to the BE. That being said, the A10 is not the new CAA and is not a bad home for the Spiders. The A10 is multibid league every year while the CAA has been a multiple bid league twice in its history. Also, based on the number of bids since X and temple left, the departures really haven't hurt the conference at all. No way in hell we are going Patriot Leauge Ulla. Come on, you know that.

 

[urfan1]

Ulla is obsessed with the idea of going to the BE. I believe many share his viewpoint, but are prefer to enjoy what we have rather than talk about something we don't have and may never have.

 

[Ulla1]

Spider B and urfan1, I agree with your sentiments and should possibly not be so adamant about UR moving to the BE. It just seems like the perfect fit. OSC

 

[Ulla1]

Video on BE expansion mentions UR:
http://www.cbssports.com/video/play...21/0/college-hoops-mailbag-big-east-expansion

 

[spiderman]

I love the A10 but if the BE calls we'll listen.
Ulla ... we're not downgrading sports so the debate team can have better competition. please don't mention the PL again. it hurts your credibility!

 

[SFspidur]

SF, conferences are not just about sports. There are numerous academic functions among member institutions. OSC

Numerous academic functions? I can't think of a single one off the top of my head.

The reason to join with similar institutions is a presumed alignment of institutional priorities. Our athletic aspirations are clearly higher than the Patriot League's, so that's make it a bad fit regardless of any academic match.

Athletic commitments and goals are far and away the #1 criterion. Geography is somewhat important (unless you're WVU or the Pioneer league), and academics and everything else are way down the list.

 

[Ulla1]

SF,

Numerous academic functions? I can't think of a single one off the top of my head.

The reason to join with similar institutions is a presumed alignment of institutional priorities. Our athletic aspirations are clearly higher than the Patriot League's, so that's make it a bad fit regardless of any academic match.

Athletic commitments and goals are far and away the #1 criterion. Geography is somewhat important (unless you're WVU or the Pioneer league), and academics and everything else are way down the list.

SF, perhaps this will enlighten you: the Colonial Athletic Conference Alliance. A colleague at Towson recently headed their annual meeting at ODU which involved top students from each member institution. Other conferences have similar alliances. OSC
http://colonialacademicalliance.org

 

[SFspidur]

Thanks, Ulla...that didn't exist during my time in the CAA and I'd never heard of it.

I still maintain that sort of thing is incredibly low on the scale of importance in the conference affiliation dance.

 

[RCSGA]

While being the BE would be great, I do not think we can discount the conference we are in. Since the BE expanded and took a few teams from the A10, we have averaged 4.5 bids. Richmond is now in a conference with true rivals, we have the local team downtown which is a different from us as possible, and now another rival that is most similar to our school in Davidson. The A10 offers us a rival in DC, two in VA, and one in NC, to go along with Mid-Atlantic and New England teams that take the Spiders into our main recruitment and alumni areas. The Tourney is in big cities in NBA/NHL arenas in NYC, Pittsburgh and DC. We have it so much better than when I was at UR and our main rival was JMU.

 

[Ulla1]

Thanks, Ulla...that didn't exist during my time in the CAA and I'd never heard of it.

I still maintain that sort of thing is incredibly low on the scale of importance in the conference affiliation dance.

No, problem, SF. I agree that the A10 is certainly the best for UR now. But for the long term, the BE would be a much more natural and enduring fit. Moreover, how intense would it be if we were to have Georgetown as our conference rival and played them in a packed Robins Center every year. OSC

 

[keefusb]

There is no doubt in my mind that academically and size-wise, we have more in common with the Patriot League schools than we do with the A10 or even the new BE. However, from an athletic perspective we are now in a multi-bid league for our hoops program, and it has only been in the past few years that the PL has had true athletic scholarships.

I'm happy to be in the A10 for now, but agree that from an athletic perspective I would like to see us in the BE sometime in the near future.

 

[ur2K]

This again?

We are in the CURRENT best position for UR hoops and UR football. If the landscape changes again, I hope our leadership has us in the best position for UR based on what happens in future rounds of realignment.

 

[bb3831]

Patriot League??? Seriously?

Ulla, you are fulla of bulla.

 

[keefusb]

It doesn't seem to hurt Northwestern's academic reputation that they are in the BigTen, nor does it seem to hurt Vandy's academic reputation that they are in the SEC. There are numerous additional examples of elite academic schools being members of big-time sports conferences.

Astute institutions realize that it is critically important that they maximize their opportunities to get exposure and marketing advantage from their athletic endeavors. I don't mind that UR and Davidson are significantly ahead of the rest of the A10 members academically, the A10 is a good place for our sports programs in terms of exposure and multiple NCAA bid opportunities in men's basketball.

 

[SFspidur]

I have no problem with Big East aspirations...solid group of traditional basketball powers with a great TV contract, at least for now. Great academic fits for Ulla in Georgetown and Villanova. I'd be happy for us to be in that conference, though I think the A-10 has come out of the major realignment phase in great shape...good mix of athletic and geographic rivals and Davidson is a great all-around match for us.

I just take issue with any talk of Patriot League. It's a great academic fit for us to be sure, but that's not the point of an athletic conference, and serious consideration of moving to the Patriot League would send a signal a significant downgrade of our commitment to athletics on the national stage. Just ask Fly The Coop.

 

[keefusb]

I would actually like to see us schedule more PL schools in our OOC hoops schedule. Bucknell, Lehigh, and BU have all had decent hoops teams in the recent past, and we have had a long history with Navy's program.

Frankly, I'd rather play PL schools than Stetson, Bethune, or Presbyterian

 

[RCSGA]

If the CAA starts to implode some, then I would be ok with joining the Patriot as a football only member with Villanova and W&M, otherwise, I see no real reason to consider that conference for anything.

 

[SFspidur]

Couple of friends of mine from high school played for Holy Cross in the late '90s...one of them famously described himself in Feinstein's book as the worst player on the worst team in the worst conference in Division I.

Sure, there are some decent programs in the PL and I think it's great to play some once in awhile, but I sure don't want to be in a conference full of them.

 

[Ulla1]

With all due respect, SF, let's give Holy Cross some credit: OSC
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Cousy

 

[keefusb]

I'm certainly not advocating that we join the PL, but I would rather play Lehigh (a school of similar size, mission, and academic reputation) than Bethune (RPI>300) in our OOC schedule.

 

[urmite]

With all due respect, SF, let's give Holy Cross some credit: OSC
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Cousy

And to tie the thread together, from the Holy Cross wiki entry...

"Patriot League
Holy Cross could have joined the newly founded Big East Conference in 1980, but college President Rev. John E. Brooks, S.J., vetoed the move for academic reasons. Holy Cross stayed independent until joining the Metro Atlantic Athletic Conference (MAAC) to start the 1983–84 season. It moved to the Patriot League in 1991.

In recent decades, the men's basketball team has been the leading varsity program of the Holy Cross' athletic department. The men's basketball team has won five Patriot League titles (1993, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2007) since the league's formation in 1991."

 

[Ulla1]

Outstanding, urmite! Nice way to pull it together. OSC

 

[MrTbone]

If you want to advocate for the Bae, that seems totally reasonable. Patriot League is cuckoo.

 

[TBSpyder]

I think the A-10 is perfect for UR. We're where we belong, and it's a very good place to be.

 

[SFspidur]

I'm certainly not advocating that we join the PL, but I would rather play Lehigh (a school of similar size, mission, and academic reputation) than Bethune (RPI>300) in our OOC schedule.

Sure, but you have to play the Bethunes of the world in these tournaments in order to get shots at the WVUs, Cals, and San Diego States. We're not playing Bethune because we think they're a good game for us to have on the schedule.

With all due respect, SF, let's give Holy Cross some credit: OSC
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Cousy

That's ancient history, like La Salle's national championships. Great to talk about, but meaningless with regard to the quality of the program today. Sure, Holy Cross has had some decent Patriot League years more recently, but it's still the Patriot League. You might get a Lehigh or a Bucknell to put together a couple of great years that get them into the top 100 of the RPI, but top to bottom the conference isn't very good. In good years they're a middling conference, and in bad years they're near the bottom.

My friend Chris was a senior in 1999-2000 when Feinstein was writing The Last Amateurs, and it was definitely a down period for Holy Cross, and the Patriot as a whole.

http://www.holycross.edu/departments/publicaffairs/hcm/fall00/athletics/fall00_ath1.html

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/college/mensbasketball/2004-11-15-spitlers-walkons_x.htm